US Politics Thread 2016-2020

[ikalugin]

Originally Posted by u crank

More coffee. Need more coffee.

And popcorn.

[Rockstar]

[Skybird]

Another defeat for Trump. The vote on Obamacare has been delayed, his own party's support was not certain. Even if he gets it later, even more prestige - or what is left of it - has been lost. If he gets needed support later, more losses will follow - due to the inevitable chaos following the dismantling of Obamacare. Its a no win-no-win situation now. Meanwhile the Russian Connection slowly but surely turns into a guillotine for Trump. I do not take it for granted that he will make even the first year. Last public approval rate for him reported over here was less than 36% - after not even 90 days. Record? But who cares, as long as his daughter got her own office in the West Wing.

[ikalugin]

Trump has his fail-deadly - Pence.

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Another defeat for Trump. The vote on Obamacare has been delayed, his own party's support was not certain. Even if he gets it later, even more prestige - or what is left of it - has been lost. If he gets needed support later, more losses will follow - due to the inevitable chaos following the dismantling of Obamacare. Its a no win-no-win situation now. Meanwhile the Russian Connection slowly but surely turns into a guillotine for Trump. I do not take it for granted that he will make even the first year. Last public approval rate for him reported over here was less than 36% - after not even 90 days. Record? But who cares, as long as his daughter got her own office in the West Wing.

Are those the same poll takers that had Trump loosing the election by 10-20 points?

As for the health care bill. The failure would not be Trumps. If it doesn't pass it'll be the GoP led Congress that failed to put a it on his desk to sign in spite of claiming to have a working replacement plan for nearly 8 years. I seriously doubt that fact will be lost on anyone although i'm sure the democrat press will attempt to blame it on Trump.

And what the heck is that crack about his daughter supposed to mean?

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Skybird

I do not take it for granted that he will make even the first year. Last public approval rate for him reported over here was less than 36% - after not even 90 days.

American Presidents are not removed from office by approval polls Skybird. There are only three ways that I know of. Death, resignation or impeachment. Four died of natural causes and four by assassination. Only one President has ever resigned, Nixon. Two Presidents have been impeached by the House of Representatives but both later acquitted at trials held by the Senate. The next poll that means anything are the 2018 mid term elections. Who knows what will happen till then but it sure is interesting. Pass the popcorn.

[Mr Quatro]

Originally Posted by u crank

American Presidents are not removed from office by approval polls Skybird. There are only three ways that I know of. Death, resignation or impeachment. Four died of natural causes and four by assassination. Only one President has ever resigned, Nixon. Two Presidents have been impeached by the House of Representatives but both later acquitted at trials held by the Senate. The next poll that means anything are the 2018 mid term elections. Who knows what will happen till then but it sure is interesting. Pass the popcorn.

The truth is like a shinning light ... nice to see the truth in GT US Politics

As for all the gold fears on this thread ... Who can afford to store gold?

Walking around with it is not a safe plan ...
Driving around with it may cause some concern if you plan on leaving it in your automobile or van or truck ...
Leaving it in your empty nest all day could be a problem if anyone knows you buy and sell gold ...
A bank deposit vault is nice, but what if you need it in a hurry ...
Stock market is paper and subject to the ups and downs ...
If you use it in an emergency to cross the border for example someone will follow you for sure ...
The only safe way is to have a home full of people that know you will take care of them in any emergency and have teenagers that stay up all night playing video games to ward off any strangers looking in the windows ...

As for Obama's healthcare plan he managed to put down Trump today:http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/23/politi...t-anniversary/

Former President Barack Obama defended his signature health care achievement on its seventh anniversary Thursday as the House of Representatives prepares for a major vote to repeal it.

He called the fight "about more than health care," but rather, "the character of our country."

If the new plan doesn't pass tomorrow it will pass sooner or later ... the old plan is just a way to double check what you say your make a year anyway.

But a room full of men deciding what women can and cannot do with their bodies is going to hurt the GOP in the end.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by August

Are those the same poll takers that had Trump loosing the election by 10-20 points?

As for the health care bill. The failure would not be Trumps. If it doesn't pass it'll be the GoP led Congress that failed to put a it on his desk to sign in spite of claiming to have a working replacement plan for nearly 8 years. I seriously doubt that fact will be lost on anyone although i'm sure the democrat press will attempt to blame it on Trump.

And what the heck is that crack about his daughter supposed to mean?

He did not brought up the support he needed and did not manage to have enough supporters rallying around him. That is what is his defeat, his loss in prestige, his fail. The last defeat fail in a now logner list of defeats and fails. We can split hairs on what term matches best, but it is not needed. He once again got stopped, and not for the first time.

His daughter has started to behave as if she could claim any electorial or administrative legitimation, but she has none. Her rank is not inheritable, but they behave in that Trump clan as if it were based on the rank of her father. - After the row over the Kennedys and their family-focussed cabinet, your country introduced laws that in the future should prevent such meddlings because it increases the chance for nepotism. But violating these rules and habits is what the Trumps are practicing now. A conflict of interests between family business interests, and the demand of the office. The smell of nepotism lies heavy in the air. Trump handed over his businesses to his sons and daughters, and then gives these highly infuential, dominant psoitions in the government crew? Unacceptable. That does not just smell like nepotism - that IS nepotism.

The White House stinks like that huge hill of fish they piled up in New York in that movie, in order to lure Godzilla out of the sewers.

Not even mentioning the three investigations running by the FBI, the Senate, and the Congress, and CNN's latest claims about Trumps team contacts to Russia during campaign. That could indeed lead to impeachment, even if Trump does not get personally accused.

I am not surprised that Trump faces such a load of problpöems, and that he creates himself so many challenges and enemies. I am surprised however by the speed at which he drives it all frontally against the wall. I thought that he would not make it beyond year 3 or 4 - but that after less than 90 days he already is where he is now, that surprised me indeed. I expected more time to pass.

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

He did not brought up the support he needed and did not manage to have enough supporters rallying around him. That is what is his defeat, his loss in prestige, his fail. The last defeat fail in a now logner list of defeats and fails. We can split hairs on what term matches best, but it is not needed. He once again got stopped, and not for the first time.

And I would imagine it won't be the last as long as the swamp remains undrained but I would term a bill written by others versus one he came up with more than a split hair.

His daughter has started to behave as if she could claim any electorial or administrative legitimation

Can you list the claims she has made in that regard?

The White House stinks like that huge hill of fish they piled up in New York in that movie, in order to lure Godzilla out of the sewers.

That's odd, I feel the same way about your theories.

[August]

I also would like to say that the GoP, not having the replacement plan they had claimed to have, are compounding their error by trying to ram through an ill thought out alternative.

By not giving members the time to study the bill they are basically doing the same thing the Dems did with the ACA. Or in Pelosi's words "We have to pass it to see what is in it". Wrong wrong wrong.

[Skybird]

Another stomping-feet-day for little Donald not getting his will. That will not stop of course those who still see him as the messiah reincarnated on Earth. In alternative fact it is not a defeat but a fake-defeat, and probably it is an alternative victory then, but what do I know about the art of using words in most meaningless manner. Several Republicans nevertheless said the counter-Obamacare bill "is dead" for this legislation period. Trump tried to blackmail them, to intimidate them, and to bluff them. He was called on his cards, and lost. Very big loss of prestige and reputation. Good poker players know that he made a big mistake there.



On another thing: some days ago they had a short docu on TV, shot on US metropoles' streets and in rural places as well, and they interviewed fans of Trump and tried to find out why these people support him. A very confusing fact was that many of them admitted freely that they knew/were certain/were quite aware that he lies, and that he is distorting things and not tells the truth on almost every occasion possible. What is confusing, alarming, worrying, troublesome is that these people still stay loyal to him and said "But I don't care that he lies", and "He still is our man."

They know, they say, he is a liar, but they do not care, they say. This sounds like the ultimate hopeless-case scenario to me. If people frankly admit they do not care whether their leaders lie or not, and just nod it off and say "I don't care, I still support him", then everything seems to be lost indeed.

I wonder in how far this is linked to this study's object on hopelessness and raising suicide rates and self-harming behaviour amongst white non-Hispanic men in the past one and a half decade:
http://www.pnas.org/content/112/49/15078.full.pdf

This paper documents a marked increase in the all-cause mortality of middle-aged white non-Hispanic men and women in the United States between 1999 and 2013. This change reversed decades of progress in mortality and was unique to the United States; no other rich country saw a similar turnaround.

Originally Posted by August

Can you list the claims she has made in that regard?

I did not say the made claims, I said she claims, in the meaning of making claim for something. If I messed up correct language here I'm sorry, if not, my reply to your question would be the problem is that she is in a position where she she should not be, seems to claim in all naturalness responsiblities that she should be banned to have, claims access to secret information she is not legitimised to get, and in general simply is in a place where she ought to have no business to do. None of his family should have any position in his government, since all his children have private business interests that should automatically ban them from holding any positions in the government club. This all is as classic a conflict of interests as "classic" can mean. That Trump calls them in, is nepotism. What they perform, is dynastic politics. They have to leave, unconditionally. And Trump should have sold his own businesses not to his family that he now includes in the government, but to third parties.

Sorry, that are the rules, Donald.

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

That will not stop of course those who still see him as the messiah reincarnated on Earth

Dude why is it that you never seem to be able to make a statement without attempting to precast and vilify anyone who might possibly hold a different opinion than you? I mean it's your second sentence. What chance do you think you have of getting the proper debate that you claim to seek if you poison the waters of discourse so early on before anyone has a chance to even read the body of what you write?

I did not say the made claims, I said she claims, in the meaning of making claim for something. If I messed up correct language here I'm sorry, if not, my reply to your question would be the problem is that she is in a position where she she should not be, seems to claim in all naturalness responsiblities that she should be banned to have, claims access to secret information she is not legitimised to get, and in general simply is in a place where she ought to have no business to do. None of his family should have any position in his government, since all his children have private business interests that should automatically ban them from holding any positions in the government club. This all is as classic a conflict of interests as "classic" can mean. That Trump calls them in, is nepotism. What they perfom, is dynastic politics. They have to leave, unconditionally. And Trump should have sold his own businesses not to his family that he now includes in the government, but to third parties.

I'm not sure where in the US constitution it says that a person must liquidate all their their personal assets before assuming the office of the president nor do I recall it saying that family members are prohibited from seeing/talking to him about what they want pretty much whenever they want.

Because of the familial access they have to the president a security clearance is given to every member of his immediate family including little children. That does not mean however they have the right to demand (or claim) access to classified information and it's not correct to imply that it does. It just allows them to move without escort in areas of the White House not open to the public.

[Bilge_Rat]

I have to admit, I always a kick of how clueless most Europeans are about US politics.

You surf most conservative sites, you see everyone is blaming Ryan for this, not Trump. Trump tried his best to sell the deal, no one can fault his efforts.

The real culprit here are the GOP congressmen, who spent 7 years railing against Obamacare and can't even agree on a replacement plan. They are the ones who will have to answer to their constituents when they run for re-election next year.

Originally Posted by August

Dude why is it that you never seem to be able to make a statement without attempting to precast and vilify anyone who might possibly hold a different opinion than you?

Pahahahaha!!
Oh boy... oh boy...

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

I have to admit, I always a kick of how clueless most Europeans are about US politics..

Oh my God, this thread gets more fun with every post! xD