Presidential debate October 18th Las Vegas

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by August

He didn't promise to jail her. That's just the corporate medias pro-hillary spin on it. He said he would have his AG appoint an independent council to look into it. The "You'd be in jail" comment was referring to the fact that it's pretty obvious to anyone not already drinking the Democrats Koolaid that had Obama administration not put the fix in she quite likely would be prosecuted and jailed for mishandling classified material like everybody else does.

There's a lot of kool-aid being drunk around here, and it's not just democrats drinking it.
Quite frankly, if you're having to decipher and put in special clauses to what a candidate is saying then the candidate should not be saying it. Trump is a gold mine to spin, and you can blame the 'liberal media' and all the other Alex Jones boogey-men if you like, but at the end of the day Donald Trump is a very poor candidate for President, even more so than Hillary Clinton, to the point where the party that he's running for is regretting deeply everything that has happened. Now, you can say that this is exactly what you want to happen, that you want the 'establishment'™ to be shaken up, but quite frankly the only thing it has shaken up has been the Republican Party and it's damn near broken it. If you wanted to make the GOP even more toxic, then congratulations, electing Donald Trump to be its representative for President has done it.

[August]

Originally Posted by Oberon

There's a lot of kool-aid being drunk around here, and it's not just democrats drinking it.
Quite frankly, if you're having to decipher and put in special clauses to what a candidate is saying then the candidate should not be saying it. Trump is a gold mine to spin, and you can blame the 'liberal media' and all the other Alex Jones boogey-men if you like, but at the end of the day Donald Trump is a very poor candidate for President, even more so than Hillary Clinton, to the point where the party that he's running for is regretting deeply everything that has happened. Now, you can say that this is exactly what you want to happen, that you want the 'establishment'™ to be shaken up, but quite frankly the only thing it has shaken up has been the Republican Party and it's damn near broken it. If you wanted to make the GOP even more toxic, then congratulations, electing Donald Trump to be its representative for President has done it.

OK but why congratulate me? I never vote in party primaries and intend to vote for Johnson next month and would have even if the Republicans had run a better candidate than Trump.

In any case that doesn't take away one bit from the fact that a Democrat administration, abetted by the corporate media, was going to do whatever it took to keep the Democrat nominee from answering to her crimes including holding secret meetings between the AG and the defendants husband. Nor does it take away from the fact that the same biased corporate media would have minimized and excused what they are crucifying Trump for doing if he was a Dem just like they are doing with the steady stream of incriminating emails from Clinton and Co.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by August

OK but why congratulate me? I never vote in party primaries and intend to vote for Johnson next month and would have even if the Republicans had run a better candidate than Trump.

In any case that doesn't take away one bit from the fact that a Democrat administration, abetted by the corporate media, was going to do whatever it took to keep the Democrat nominee from answering to her crimes including holding secret meetings between the AG and the defendants husband. Nor does it take away from the fact that the same biased corporate media would have minimized and excused what they are crucifying Trump for doing if he was a Dem just like they are doing with the steady stream of incriminating emails from Clinton and Co.

Sorry, bad choice of words, I meant the people who elected Trump to be Republican candidate, not yourself personally.
Absolutely, the Democrats have pulled very sleezy tricks, although I'm not sure in the most recent wikileaks emails exactly what is meant to be so devastating, the fact that it was Russian government activities that brought these emails out is perhaps a bit more concerning than the contents of the emails themselves which only serve to confirm a lot of what we already knew or suspected, that Hillary will think one thing but say another (just like most politicians) that she wants open borders and open trade (I can see open borders being a problem for Americans these days, but open trade is one of the founding principles of the free market system which America has always campaigned for), and that she will do anything to win. Now, imagine if this had been Mitt Romney, not Trump, running...now unless the Dems were able to pull up some kind of massive Mormon conspiracy, he would be making absolute hay with these emails, and you can be sure that the GOP would be at full capacity on pushing everything they had to keep anything dishonest or troublesome about Hillary on the front pages. But it's not Mitt, it's Trump, and he's a walking headline generator. It's a man who is more newsworthy than his party, and the fact that his party is not, and has never been, fully unified behind him only underlines the fact that the GOP has thrown this one. It let Trump get that momentum, because let's face it, if the GOP fact-checking hounds were anywhere near as competent as they claim to be (and indeed normally are) then these sex allegations and pussy comments would have come out during the Republican primaries and we would have Ted Cruz running against Hillary most likely, but the GOP stepped back because part of it wanted Trump, they wanted that strong man, that non-politically correct man, they wanted his power, his 'charisma' and they wanted that image, to court the 'Alt-Right', the Breitbarts and the 4chans. Trump was trendy, so they gave him a pass, when really all of the warning bells should have been ringing, when all of their senior members were shuffling their feet and saying "Well...errm...this might not be a good idea." Now all the chickens have come home to roost, and sure the Democrats have had a part in that, they've played some strong cards, but the simple fact is, Trump has played weak hands in return, he's blustered and bumbled from one soundbite to the next, and given his enemies absolutely everything they could have wanted. He's a perfect gift to the Democrat party, any other competent GOP candidate would have wiped the floor with Hillary, who is one of the most hated women in America, even her own voters are not fond of her, and Trump could have made hay with that, he could have split their party in two, brought chaos to the Democrats, but he's not the person to do that, instead he pretty much quotes from Alex Jones, attacks SNL, and basically bumbles around like an idiot.
I don't blame you for going third party, I think that I would still vote for Hillary if only to vote against Trump, but that's probably because I got burned badly with a third party in 2010 and that third party got vaporised in 2015. I hope that this doesn't happen with your third party, but I imagine that they've got more political acumen than Nick Clegg.

[August]

I don't know how the GOP could have found out about the tape since it was hidden in an NBC vault (and or DNC HQ) for when it could be used with the greatest effect.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by August

I don't know how the GOP could have found out about the tape since it was hidden in an NBC vault (and or DNC HQ) for when it could be used with the greatest effect.

What about the bit where he admitted walking through backstage at the Miss Universe pagents quote:

"They're standing there with no clothes. Is everybody ok? And you see these incredible looking women. And so I sort of get away with things like that."

That was from the Howard Stern show in 2005, and that's after the NBC days, so the GOP could perhaps have got that...I don't know the internal workings on the GOP intelligence service but it seems that they have dropped the ball in a manner which would make the CIA jealous. I mean, it's Donald Trump for goodness sake, not some nobody from hicksville, there must have been something they could have used.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Oberon

What about the bit where he admitted walking through backstage at the Miss Universe pagents quote:

"They're standing there with no clothes. Is everybody ok? And you see these incredible looking women. And so I sort of get away with things like that."

That was from the Howard Stern show in 2005, and that's after the NBC days, so the GOP could perhaps have got that...I don't know the internal workings on the GOP intelligence service but it seems that they have dropped the ball in a manner which would make the CIA jealous. I mean, it's Donald Trump for goodness sake, not some nobody from hicksville, there must have been something they could have used.

I suspect the GOP never thought Trump would make it this far. Trump would fizzle on his own. No need to go digging. Herman Caine was the same. When he became a serious contender did the sexual harassment news start breaking. The witch hunt began. It is the same tactic used here. All is fair in love and war.

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by Oberon

What about the bit where he admitted walking through backstage at the Miss Universe pagents quote:

"They're standing there with no clothes. Is everybody ok? And you see these incredible looking women. And so I sort of get away with things like that."

That was from the Howard Stern show in 2005, and that's after the NBC days, so the GOP could perhaps have got that...I don't know the internal workings on the GOP intelligence service but it seems that they have dropped the ball in a manner which would make the CIA jealous. I mean, it's Donald Trump for goodness sake, not some nobody from hicksville, there must have been something they could have used.

It isn't a problem with vetting. Everybody knew what Trump was all about, but once he accumulated the appropriate number of delegates the die was cast. The thing is that the primary system in the US is more of a team of rivals. The candidates want to win, but they also want the party to win. So you go after the other guys on the stage but you don't tear them down so much that the damage is irreparable.

Of course Trump didn't play by that rule, but everybody else did. And so he bullied his way through relatively unscathed. The vetters in the party knew about these things, everybody did, but what were they supposed to do? The only option was to sit and wait for this stuff to be used.

[August]

Originally Posted by Oberon

That was from the Howard Stern show in 2005, and that's after the NBC days, so the GOP could perhaps have got that...I don't know the internal workings on the GOP intelligence service but it seems that they have dropped the ball in a manner which would make the CIA jealous. I mean, it's Donald Trump for goodness sake, not some nobody from hicksville, there must have been something they could have used.

Or maybe they did know and deliberately decided not to prepare for it. It's no secret that many in the party leadership want him to fail.

FWIW I heard on the way into work that Howard Stern has said he would not release tapes of his old shows where Trump was a guest.

Stern said on his SiriusXM radio show Monday morning. “I feel Donald Trump did the show in an effort to be entertaining and have fun with us, and I feel like it’d be a betrayal to any of our guests if I sat there and played them now, where people are attacking him.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...be-a-betrayal/

[aanker]

There was no button for me in this debate related poll. IMO this debate will have no effect. I think most people have already made their minds up regarding the election.

I believe that there are a lot of people who won't admit to friends, family, and pollsters that they support 'The Donald' - I call them 'Closet Trump Supporters'. Furthermore, Trump has attracted a lot of uncounted 'first time voters'. His rallies are packed with thousands, and thousands more are turned away. Her supporters appear to number in the hundreds, and they don't seem enthusiastic.

Someone mentioned Jesse Ventura. There is the Jesse factor too; people may vote Trump to spite the establishment just as my late Dad did. He was surprised the next morning to see that Jesse won. I was living in another state at the time.

I don't think that anyone can say that the third debate won't be entertaining. Trump is after all a master entertainer. This final debate will also have a good unbiased moderator in Chris Wallace.

Sorry if I strayed a little from only commenting on 'the 3rd debate'. I also wrote about other contributing factors to take into consideration with the third debate in calculating the final result.