Europe's migrant problem

[tomfon]

Originally Posted by Skybird

^Some of those rights are violations of natural rights of hosting nations and people already living there.

I'm not quite sure i follow you.

During WWII almost 60 million people became refugees and i'm pretty sure they violated someone else's rights in an attempt to reach safety... The Articles of the Convention refer to a migrant crisis ; i.e. a massive displacement of people who flee their country in a desperate attempt to seek shelter (however far they would have to go). So we're not talking about someone who parks his car right in front of your doorstep or someone who suddenly decides to jump to the front of a long queue simply because he felt like doing so. We're talking about ordinary people engaged into an extra-ordinary situation: That of losing their home & family because the whole country is partly a warzone and partly a nest of extremists. What should one expect from them? Grace and consistency?

For too long the West has intervened in the Middle East and its affairs but somehow the leaders failed to foresee that the destabilization of a whole region will ultimately have an impact on their own countries! This very simple truth is the primary lesson they should have learned right after 9/11. Paris attack(s), is the proof they didn't, again & again. Is it stupidity? Is it the lack of a serious strategy? I wouldn't know. What i know is that, now each refugee is a living proof and a constant reminder of that failure, for one more time... The tragedy of the refugees became a European problem - and in my opinion, they knew all about it since early 2015 or even earlier. So i guess that we may ignore reality but we can't ignore the consequences. I take it you'd agree with that. In other words, when it rains, you will get wet. Given the scale of the problem, i believe that we should carefully consider how the rain started in the first place.

[Betonov]

Originally Posted by August

Exaggerate much?

a little

Originally Posted by MaDef

Any retail store on Black Friday.

I remember when the first Hoffer opened in Slovenia.
People stampeded like mad just to buy TV sets €30 cheaper that were a fire hazzard



Something weird is happening in Slovenia. In the last few weeks 3 teens have gone missing. The anti-migrant spin doctors are already scaring the population silly.
I somehow doubt that polynesian cannibals are among the migrants.

[Catfish]

^ No, they are syrian cannibals.
Ask Trump.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Catfish

^ No, they are syrian cannibals.
Ask Trump.

No they are hiding and wait for a chance to buy a cheap TV.

Markus

[Catfish]

^ and they all want the new iPhone ..

[mapuc]

Right now there is a series of 4 episodes that have been recorded with a hidden camera. This Muslim worked undercover for a Danish TV channel. Until now it has been shown 3 episode

In the latest episode you can see and hear the imam on hidden camera saying
that Muslims are "conquering" Europe and that Muslims should not melt into society


The Danish Politicians and others who have been speaking only positive things about the Muslims are in deep shock. After this Danish TV-Channel have shown these episode of a the real life in a mosque.

The program have been recorded in Mosque who by these politicians been marked as moderate.

Markus

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by tomfon

I'm not quite sure i follow you.

During WWII almost 60 million people became refugees and i'm pretty sure they violated someone else's rights in an attempt to reach safety... The Articles of the Convention refer to a migrant crisis ; i.e. a massive displacement of people who flee their country in a desperate attempt to seek shelter (however far they would have to go). So we're not talking about someone who parks his car right in front of your doorstep or someone who suddenly decides to jump to the front of a long queue simply because he felt like doing so. We're talking about ordinary people engaged into an extra-ordinary situation: That of losing their home & family because the whole country is partly a warzone and partly a nest of extremists. What should one expect from them? Grace and consistency?

For too long the West has intervened in the Middle East and its affairs but somehow the leaders failed to foresee that the destabilization of a whole region will ultimately have an impact on their own countries! This very simple truth is the primary lesson they should have learned right after 9/11. Paris attack(s), is the proof they didn't, again & again. Is it stupidity? Is it the lack of a serious strategy? I wouldn't know. What i know is that, now each refugee is a living proof and a constant reminder of that failure, for one more time... The tragedy of the refugees became a European problem - and in my opinion, they knew all about it since early 2015 or even earlier. So i guess that we may ignore reality but we can't ignore the consequences. I take it you'd agree with that. In other words, when it rains, you will get wet. Given the scale of the problem, i believe that we should carefully consider how the rain started in the first place.

Yes, as always its all just our own fault and our own responsibility. Who else, if not us.

Meanwhile Certzainb 'Muslim states spend hundreds of millions into missionising centres in Europe and billions into Muslim terrorism - while refusing to give a damn for their precious Muslim brothers and sisters.

By the way, your precious subscription for paradise (international laws) on this case only state that neighbouring states should give shelter to war refugees. A general right for these people to choose the country they want to be hospitalised and hosted by, does not exist. EU treaties also do not state such a right. One can opt to support neighbouring states, such as Jordan , Egypt, etc etc, do do that: by collecting private donations and transfer them. But I wonder why I should, doing that when at the same time rich Muslims states care a damn for their precious Muslim brothers and sisters and instead invest hundreds of millions per year into raising Muslim missionising centres and Islam centres in Europe and investing billions into global Muslim terrorism. Indirectly I would financially invest into Muslim terrorism and missionsing that way.

Ralph Waldo Emerson, and one of his best and most famous essays: On Self- Reliance:

"Then again, do not tell me, as a good man did today, of my obligation to put all poor men in good situations. Are they my poor? I tell thee, thou foolish philanthropist, that I grudge the dollar, the dime, the cent I give to such men as do not belong to me and to whom I do not belong. There is a class of persons to whom by all spiritual affinity I am bought and sold; for them I will go to prison if need be; but your miscellaneous popular charities; the education at college of fools; the building of meeting-houses to the vain end to which many now stand; alms to sots; and the thousandfold Relief Societies; -- though I confess with shame I sometimes succumb and give the dollar, it is a wicked dollar, which by and by I shall have the manhood to withhold."

I love RWE, and this essay especially.

Just so that you know: my father's family were refugees, too. And the biggest sub-group of people in Germany complaining about germany'S undiscriminatory migration policy - is that minority amongst Muslim migrants who indeed integrated themselves into German society and culture over the past 20-40 years. The majority of Muslim migrants in germany - are net receivers of social wellfare even after decades the families are here now. And Germany, different to what is said, doe snot have net treasury for free, we have no money. We have debts - debts, and more of the same. Explicit debts are ~85% of the yearly GDP last year. Implicit debts already now are calculated to be in the most likely range of 400-800% most likely. The costs of the migrants coming in 2015 alone, got calculated to be many hundreds of billions. Including all the follow-on-costs after same ratios of failed and successful integration acctrdpi8ng to the examples set by Muslim migrants we already have, are calculated to be close to one trillion until 2030. These masses of people coming and having nothing to offer that is needed in germany, will cost us tremendously. And this will make itself felt sooner or later.

If foreign markets collapse and German exports falter, many of those few migrants who in 6-8 years will have integrated into the job world, will lose their jobs and become social wellfare receivers again.

I totally reject any moral obligation that nevertheless we "must" accept this. We must not.

[Dowly]

Meanwhile in Sweden:


I do hope they guy who intervened is ok.

Originally Posted by Dowly

Meanwhile in Sweden:


I do hope they guy who intervened is ok.

I don't see the problem.
That was hardly worth mentioning.
These poor people need our help and tolerance.
And everyone knows these "no-go-zones" are right wing propaganda.
The perpetrators in this video are either misunderstood or hired to act out.

Clearly this video doesn't portray the reality of what's going on daily all across Europe Dowly.


In other words, when I see such things, I get really sad.

[Dowly]

Meanwhile in Finland, the Finnish Broadcasting Company (YLE) together with the creators of a 90s Finnish sketch show "Kummeli" have decided to remove the "Aziz the combat fighter" segments from the show which is now available through YLE's streaming service. The reason YLE gave was "to not offend anyone in light of the recent terrorist attacks" (paraphrasing).

What was so bad about the segments? It made fun of terrorists.

You can view them here:

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Dowly

Meanwhile in Finland, the Finnish Broadcasting Company (YLE) together with the creators of a 90s Finnish sketch show "Kummeli" have decided to remove the "Aziz the combat fighter" segments from the show which is now available through YLE's streaming service. The reason YLE gave was "to not offend anyone in light of the recent terrorist attacks" (paraphrasing).

What was so bad about the segments? It made fun of terrorists.

You can view them here:

Maybe April 1st joke?

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

Maybe April 1st joke?

Unfortunately, that is not the case. YLE confirmed it yesterday via twitter.

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Oberon

BE DEUTSCH!

You know what I like about the video? They claim to be super tolerant but only if you share their believes otherwise you become "penetration face" etc... Long live hypocrisy.

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

You know what I like about the video? They claim to be super tolerant but only if you share their believes otherwise you become "penetration face" etc... Long live hypocrisy.

Yes, that is the ironic part. Tolerant people tend not to be so tolerant towards those who oppose their view(s).

In Finland, you could literally call them a bunch of clowns, as there was, in response to Soldiers of Odin, a group dressed in clown suits called Loldiers of Odin. Who tried to agitate and disrupt SoD's march which was not illegal.

Video of them in Tampere:


LoS' reprentives went then on to YLE morning TV to talk about their stunt and the moment a hard question was put to them ("Do you not make fun of also those women who have been raped on the street?") they rode with their stick horses around the studio.

Video of them in the studio, right after the question was asked:


Even the guy asks: Are you evading the question?
They never answered.

[Betonov]

The far left can be as bad as the far right.