Who Started World War II?

[Fahnenbohn]

Originally Posted by Tchocky

You don't know the context? Why am I not surprised. Open a book before telling other people they're uninformed. All you're doing is embarrassing yourself.

Sorry, but I can't know all the thousands minor facts. If you want to be useful, please tell what you know, and also how (what documents you have read) you know it. I'm sure you don't tell the story in an honest and impartial way. Last thing, this is not the debate.

[Tchocky]

Mate, if you're trolling then 10/10. If you're being serious then this is a particularly ugly sort of historical revisionism.


The Nazi-trained, equipped, and directed terrorist organisation with almost 35,000 members that attempted a putsch in Czechoslovakia is NOT A MINOR FACT.


Seriously, stop it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudete...ches_Freikorps


EDIT - I see your edit and this is just sad.

I'm sure you don't tell the story in an honest and impartial way.

"I don't know anything about what you're talking about but I'm sure you're wrong",

For God's sake.

Last thing, this is not the debate.

Nice of you to let me know what I'm allowed to say. Funny the way fascists like to shut people up.

You're almost correct though, this is not a debate. This is you promoting a sick version of historical events designed to assuage those who worship psychopaths. And you're not even good at it.

[Fahnenbohn]

Instead of insulting me, just say to me : "this are the facts I would like you to know, and here are the sources. And this is why I consider this is something important, etc."

My question : Why was this Freikorps created ?

Originally Posted by Tchocky

Nice of you to let me know what I'm allowed to say. Funny the way fascists like to shut people up. You're almost correct though, this is not a debate. This is you promoting a sick version of historical events designed to assuage those who worship psychopaths. And you're not even good at it.

I'm requesting the moderator to stop this sort of hateful posts. Where is the debate in this post ? Nowhere, except a link (wikipedia), all the rest is useless and disrespecting. If this sort of posts are still allowed, then I stop immediately the debate.

F.

PS : I'm writting an answer to Jimbuna and Oberon, but this takes time, because I do the effort to understand the other side, write arguments, and search for sources. I don't insult, unlike some people here.

[Tchocky]

Originally Posted by Fahnenbohn

Instead of insulting me, just say to me : "this are the facts I would like you to know, and here are the sources. And this is why I consider this is something important, etc."

Oh don't even start with this garbage.

The reason I'm not doing that is because you were dismissive to a poster previously, asserting that they didn't know anything about the issue at hand. In your next post you show you didn't know anything about a major element of that historical period. Then you referred to the FS as a minor detail. Ten seconds of research would have told you they are not minor.

Your next move was to tell me that no matter how little you knew about the subject, I was definitely lying to you and misrepresenting history.

So there you are, assuming someone is wrong because they know something you don't.

This tells me you are not someone I should be too concerned about being nice to.

My question : Why was this Freikorps created ?

They were the paramilitary wing of the Sudeten German party. Very much akin to the SA. Do your own homework. Proper sources this time.

I'm requesting the moderator to stop this sort of hateful posts. Where is the debate in this post ? Nowhere, except a link (wikipedia), all the rest is useless and disrespecting.

Oh come on.

You're pushing a version of history that is only found in a few very particular places. Pointing this out isn't an insult, nor is it disrespectful.

You do that all by yourself.

If this sort of posts are still allowed, then I stop immediately the debate.

And nothing of value was lost.

this takes time, because I do the effort to understand the other side, write arguments, and search for sources. I don't insult, unlike some people here.

No you don't.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Tchocky

Nice of you to let me know what I'm allowed to say. Funny the way fascists like to shut people up.

This is my first informal warning. Name-calling and personal attacks add nothing to the debate and will not be allowed.

[Tchocky]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

This is my first informal warning. Name-calling and personal attacks add nothing to the debate and will not be allowed.

I'll be good.

[Betonov]

Why should anyone understand the other side.
They were a bunch of xenophobic, genocidic, ruthlesss uninformed thugs led by the inner circle of a one testicled painting corporal.

It's like understanding a pack of retarded gorillas. Even David Attenborough woulnd't touch that.

[Torplexed]

Everyone knows WW2 was a perfidious ploy by the British to lose half a million lives, bankrupt their empire and allow the USA and USSR dominate the world stage.

And Der Fuhrer fell for it.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Betonov

Why should anyone understand the other side.
They were a bunch of xenophobic, genocidic, ruthlesss uninformed thugs led by the inner circle of a one testicled painting corporal.

It's like understanding a pack of retarded gorillas. Even David Attenborough woulnd't touch that.

And this will be your informal warning. Personal opinions are welcome, but we are trying to discuss the causes of the war, and this sort of thing doesn't help.

[Betonov]

WWII was the final act of the colonial tensions that sprung up during the 19th century, peaked when WWI started and then reflamed 2 decades later.
The whole mess would have been avoided if Hitler wasn't such a good manure shuffler (I know a better word but it's NSFW), that he convinced the Germans that they should not have faith in the Weimar republic, that was on a good path to rebuild Germany to an industrial power without all that Prussian militarism.

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

And this will be your informal warning. Personal opinions are welcome, but we are trying to discuss the causes of the war, and this sort of thing doesn't help.

Just give me a formal one then.
The only remorse I will show when comparing nazis to retarded gorillas is that I'll offend retarded gorillas

[Fahnenbohn]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

You introduce the word 'humiliated' and add a smiley which I am confident will be perceived as pouring scorn/mockery on forum members who lost loved ones on both sides of the conflict. .... Humiliating? No, extremely tragic in all cases..

It's true, I was stupid to laugh at that, I have not experienced these tragic events. But in military terms, this is a historical fact that the Royal Navy had not suffered so much competition since a lot of time !

About Graf Spee and Bismarck events : how could it be otherwise ? The british navy was far superior to the german navy. A frontal fight was not in favour of Germans.

About Tirpitz : there was not enough fuel in the end of the war (I recall that the equivalent of 25 atomic bombs (like the one on Hiroshima) was dropped on Germany).

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

I am also of the belief that your opinions are seriously biased and blinkered toward one side of the conflict and looking at some of the responses on this thread (of a few nationalities, German included) it is obvious I am not alone in that thinking.

Maybe it's true. It can also be your own beliefs that are distorted by post-war propaganda.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Fahnenbohn

It's true, I was stupid to laugh at that, I have not experienced these tragic events. But in military terms, this is a historical fact that the Royal Navy had not suffered so much competition since a lot of time !

Jutland
Raid on the Medway
Battle of Beachy Head
Battle of Chesapeake Bay
Battle of the Coronel

About Graf Spee and Bismarck events : how could it be otherwise ? The british navy was far superior to the german navy. A frontal fight was not in favour of Germans.

KMS Bismarck - Commissioned 1940
KMS Prinz Eugen - Commissioned 1940

HMS Hood - Commissioned 1920
HMS Prince of Wales - Commissioned 1941

See the problem here? The Hood, although one of the loved ships of the Royal Navy, was an old Battlecruiser, really not designed to take on something like the Bismarck. The more equal opponent to the Bismarck would be the King George V.
Yes, the Bismarck did inflict a nasty shock to a navy which was almost arrogant in its confidence in its superiority, but it wasn't the only one. The uboat campaign was another nasty shock, as were Japanese aircraft.
In return, well, let's remember what crippled the Bismarck, a very slow, very outdated biplane. So slow, in fact, that the fire control of the AAA systems on the Bismarck didn't have a target speed selector that went low enough.

The Tirpitz acted well as a threat, just as Argentinas submarines acted well as a threat towards the Falklands fleet, but there was no way for Germany to carry out that threat, but of course, Britain did not know that and so expended resources to eliminate the threat.

In my opinion, the Kriegsmarine surface fleet was mostly a waste of time and resources that could have been spent improving and expanding the uboatwaffe, but then I'm a bit of Doenitz fan so I would go for the 300 uboats over Plan Z. Of course, fortunately for Great Britain, such a plan was not feasible.
http://uboat.net/forums/read.php?3,285,554

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Fahnenbohn

Maybe it's true. It can also be your own beliefs that are distorted by post-war propaganda.

Tell me, would you consider the atrocites committed at Oradour-sur-Glane in June 44 to be a part of post-war propaganda?

[Fahnenbohn]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Tell me, would you consider the atrocites committed at Oradour-sur-Glane in June 44 to be a part of post-war propaganda?

Absolutely.
An investigation was also carried out on this point.

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Fahnenbohn

Sorry, but I can't know all the thousands minor facts. If you want to be useful, please tell what you know, and also how (what documents you have read) you know it. I'm sure you don't tell the story in an honest and impartial way. Last thing, this is not the debate.

Fahnenbon, I'm not sure what compels you to ignore a universe of accepted history, but I'm sure it would be interesting. I think you only have to read Mein Kampf to get the answer, straight from the man who engineered WWII.