Stock Market update: Everybody panic!

[Politenessman]

Originally Posted by Betonov

Except that we don't excpect free stuff. We except a return on our taxes.
Greece collapsed because there was high level corruption sucking money dry with a population that used every trick in the book to avoid paying them. Greece would have floundered even without all the ''freebies'' we Euros get.
Slovenia has a good track record of paying taxes but has a high level corruption that is sucking us dry. Healthcare and education are not sucking us dry. Fat cats do. Teachers and doctors don't.
And then there's debt. Yugoslavia had 13,6 billion dollar debt in 1988. The countries that form the area today have a total debt of 184 billion dollars. Inflation ws not that high and the biggest share of that debt has Slovenia, which avoided the bloody mess of the nineties Balkans.

So how come the national debt skyrocketed when we lost a lot of the ''freebies'' my parents had. It doesn't make sense.

And move where, every other developed country has the same social system. Taxes for healthcare, education, roads.

And one more thing, there is no looming social collapse in Europe. Greece is Europe, but Europe is not Greece. We are angry, we are dissapointed, but we are still going about our business trying to get our collective asses organised enough to put some pressure on the fat cats. As we say in Slovenia: EU is bad, but imagine if we'd live in the US.

At risk of stating the obvious, where do you think that debt comes from? as a society, you lived beyond your means and as the debt goes up, so does the interest rate (because you are a bigger default risk), which means less money to provide the 'free' services, so they get cut AND taxes go up.

You misunderstand the crisis you face, the financial one is a disaster, but the demographic one is existential, it means you won't have the tax base to pay for your debts or services.

Move where? look for a country where they are having enough children to pay the taxes for the services you will need as you age, it helps if the country isn't running major deficts too.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Politenessman

look for a country where they are having enough children to pay the taxes for the services you will need as you age, it helps if the country isn't running major deficts too.

So somewhere in Africa, or wherever there's a major war going on.

Peak child isn't just a European or American thing, it's a global thing caused by the improvement of medical practices and standards of living. When living standards go up, when children stop dying before they reach double figures then people have less children. It's a natural progression.

Does that mean we're going to have to pay for the aging population? Yes, of course it does, we're already seeing a massive rise in dementia rates and housing for old people, but that's just how it goes. You cannot have a constantly youthful population, it will swing between the two, because if you were to have a constantly youthful population growth then you would soon outgrow the planet you live on. We're already over 7 billion in total on this planet, mostly clustered in certain areas because we don't have the financial incentive to spread out more. Thus, trapped within the financial constraints we have made for ourselves, increasing the global population at a reckless pace is foolhardy. Unless you plan to go Logans Run and kill everyone when they reach 40.

[Politenessman]

Originally Posted by Oberon

So somewhere in Africa, or wherever there's a major war going on.

Peak child isn't just a European or American thing, it's a global thing caused by the improvement of medical practices and standards of living. When living standards go up, when children stop dying before they reach double figures then people have less children. It's a natural progression.

Does that mean we're going to have to pay for the aging population? Yes, of course it does, we're already seeing a massive rise in dementia rates and housing for old people, but that's just how it goes. You cannot have a constantly youthful population, it will swing between the two, because if you were to have a constantly youthful population growth then you would soon outgrow the planet you live on. We're already over 7 billion in total on this planet, mostly clustered in certain areas because we don't have the financial incentive to spread out more. Thus, trapped within the financial constraints we have made for ourselves, increasing the global population at a reckless pace is foolhardy. Unless you plan to go Logans Run and kill everyone when they reach 40.

"Peak child" has nothing to do with it, it just lowers the figure to reach replacement rate, before you comment further I'd suggest you read up on demographics otherwise you are at risk of making a fool of yourself.

[Betonov]

Originally Posted by Politenessman

You misunderstand the crisis you face, the financial one is a disaster, but the demographic one is existential, it means you won't have the tax base to pay for your debts or services.

You missunderstand Europe. No wonder since you quoted Mark Steyn and after a research of his works I have concluded that I wouldn't use those books for fertilizer. They're a load of crap, but they lack actual nutritional values to be an actual manure.

Don't you worry your pretty litle head about Europe. We always find a way to deal with these problems, the hard way or the easy way. So we'll just have to pay our own pensions as we work and not relly on the younger generation for it. And maybe start educating our children on more savy financial maneouvers like investing money in growing markets so there's always a possible second income. Maybe we will turn hard left, nationalize our industries, throw the greedy fat cats into jail and live off the billions they wouldn't share. Maybe we'll turn far right, throw out anyone that doesn't fit in. Maybe we'll finally see the old generation without ideas die out and start a new world that's focused on prosperity rather than cheap political scoring.

European first half century is always turbolent which then evens out to second half of prosperity. So I chose the interesting time to get born.

[Platapus]

ll I know is that I am getting my end of year investment reports and every single one of my accounts has grown. Not as much as I want, of course.

But I can remember a time, not that long ago, when having an investment hold its value made me the big winner in my household.