Not Diving Deep To Escape Escorts - Page 2

Tigershark624 · 08-18-15, 05:00 PM

Is there a minimum depth setting for depth charges in SH3? I believe in RL there was a minimum depth of 50 meters, but I'm not sure that's correct and the information is not readily at hand. If not at periscope depth, would 25 meters be safe from ramming and depth charges?

Zosimus · 08-19-15, 08:13 PM

I think this is a bad idea for a few reasons. First of all, depth charges that explode below the ship cause more damage than those that explode above. Second, depth charges below the ship can literally blow the ship up and out of the water.

UKönig · 08-20-15, 12:22 PM

That is exactly correct. Add to that that sometimes the allies drop the charges in a pattern that catches the U-boat both above and below, causing a pressure wave that crushes the hull like a beer can. Nasty.

20000 Leagues · 08-20-15, 02:01 PM

I believe I'm in the minority here, but I only dive deep if I'm damaged, feeling anti-social, out of/loading eels or in a situation that I know is untenable. This will sound crazy, but I like to attract DD's by letting them see me on the surface. Once they start steaming toward me, I go to periscope depth and take them on, bow to bow. I line up a bow shot, somewhere around 1.2 clicks. It really is a long shot and has less than 50% success. But it's usually far enough out that the DD won't be zig-zagging yet. While I'm waiting for the long shot to play out, I start getting the next eel ready for a close shot, around 600-500m. They're zig-zagging by then, so it can be a challenge to land a good shot, but my success rate is fairly high. If I miss or get a dud (f'ing duds!) I'm now into a dogfight.

The dogfight is where I do my best work. Keep your enemies close and all that. If the 600-500m shot didn't work, flank, periscope down, dive and hard to port/starboard. Guaranteed this move will rattle some dishes! Once I'm about 45° from my original course, I blow ballast to stop my descent. This takes careful timing, because I want to end up near periscope depth again and not on the surface. As soon as I can, I pop the periscope up and get a fix on the DD for a stern shot. Chances of getting a 90° shot are low, so you really have to know your eels. This is another instance where a dud can be a real lunchbox let down. If the stern shot misses, then we dance.

I should add, I only draw them in if I can't get a good line on them from my position or I can't catch up to them.

Kip336 · 08-20-15, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 20000 Leagues

I believe I'm in the minority here, but I only dive deep if I'm damaged, feeling anti-social, out of/loading eels or in a situation that I know is untenable. This will sound crazy, but I like to attract DD's by letting them see me on the surface. Once they start steaming toward me, I go to periscope depth and take them on, bow to bow. I line up a bow shot, somewhere around 1.2 clicks. It really is a long shot and has less than 50% success. But it's usually far enough out that the DD won't be zig-zagging yet. While I'm waiting for the long shot to play out, I start getting the next eel ready for a close shot, around 600-500m. They're zig-zagging by then, so it can be a challenge to land a good shot, but my success rate is fairly high. If I miss or get a dud (f'ing duds!) I'm now into a dogfight.

The dogfight is where I do my best work. Keep your enemies close and all that. If the 600-500m shot didn't work, flank, periscope down, dive and hard to port/starboard. Guaranteed this move will rattle some dishes! Once I'm about 45° from my original course, I blow ballast to stop my descent. This takes careful timing, because I want to end up near periscope depth again and not on the surface. As soon as I can, I pop the periscope up and get a fix on the DD for a stern shot. Chances of getting a 90° shot are low, so you really have to know your eels. This is another instance where a dud can be a real lunchbox let down. If the stern shot misses, then we dance.

I should add, I only draw them in if I can't get a good line on them from my position or I can't catch up to them.

Very, very daring. I like that

Zosimus · 08-20-15, 08:52 PM

I just don't get why you would waste 2 eels on something with so few tons.

20000 Leagues · 08-20-15, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zosimus

I just don't get why you would waste 2 eels on something with so few tons.

Sometimes for the challenge, mostly to get them out of the way so I can feast on the convoy.

T.Von Hogan · 08-26-15, 11:52 PM

Never unless there are 3 or more doing the circle of death dance around my boot.

Never advertise our position but keep at least one electric eel each direction for protection. Escorts rarely survive the 1st eel fired inside 600 yds.

CaptainP · 12-23-19, 11:49 AM

The manual states

Another way to avoid detection would be to “use the vertical.” Move on the surface – the waves create distortions that prohibit the proper travel of ASDIC waves.

Earlier in this thread, UKonig wrote:

Sonar doesn't work well near the surface in bad weather and stormy seas, and the motion of the ocean is what's known as "surface clutter".

I believe elsewhere in the forum it was stated that ASDIC projects a beam (of increasing thickness as it travels, I imagine) at an angle of 10 degrees down (from the surface I assume).

Question: does anybody know if this is modelled in SH3? Did the manual mean to state "move just below the surface" ? And how close can a sub get before the top of the beam touches the bottom of the sub?

I look forward to feedback.

FUBAR295 · 12-23-19, 12:54 PM

This may explain some things :

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho...d.php?t=104377

Good hunting

FUBAR295

John Pancoast · 12-24-19, 10:23 AM

Diving deep (I've never gone past 180 though) and turning 180 degrees from the convoys course always works great for me, regardless of the year.

Even better, don't get a position where your submerged and caught by escorts anyway. <g>

Beating the escorts in SH3 isn't that hard; they're not very good in any mod if one uses realistic tactics/survival mindset.

THEBERBSTER · 12-24-19, 11:49 AM

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08-20-15, 12:22 PM	#18
UKönig Captain Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Victoria, British Columbia, Canada Posts: 495 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	That is exactly correct. Add to that that sometimes the allies drop the charges in a pattern that catches the U-boat both above and below, causing a pressure wave that crushes the hull like a beer can. Nasty. __________________ Because I'm the captain, that's why!

12-23-19, 11:49 AM	#24
CaptainP Swabbie Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Toronto Posts: 6 Downloads: 13 Uploads: 0	hiding from ASDIC near the surface The manual states Another way to avoid detection would be to “use the vertical.” Move on the surface – the waves create distortions that prohibit the proper travel of ASDIC waves. Earlier in this thread, UKonig wrote: Sonar doesn't work well near the surface in bad weather and stormy seas, and the motion of the ocean is what's known as "surface clutter". I believe elsewhere in the forum it was stated that ASDIC projects a beam (of increasing thickness as it travels, I imagine) at an angle of 10 degrees down (from the surface I assume). Question: does anybody know if this is modelled in SH3? Did the manual mean to state "move just below the surface" ? And how close can a sub get before the top of the beam touches the bottom of the sub? I look forward to feedback.

12-23-19, 12:54 PM	#25
FUBAR295 Krusty Krab Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Decks awash in the North Atlantic Posts: 1,453 Downloads: 493 Uploads: 0	This may explain some things : https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho...d.php?t=104377 Good hunting FUBAR295 __________________ Good judgment comes from experience. Unfortunately, the experience usually comes from bad judgment.

12-24-19, 10:23 AM	#26
John Pancoast Ocean Warrior Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Minnysoda Posts: 3,211 Downloads: 501 Uploads: 4	Diving deep (I've never gone past 180 though) and turning 180 degrees from the convoys course always works great for me, regardless of the year. Even better, don't get a position where your submerged and caught by escorts anyway. <g> Beating the escorts in SH3 isn't that hard; they're not very good in any mod if one uses realistic tactics/survival mindset. __________________ "Realistic" is not always GAME-GOOD." - Wave Skipper

12-24-19, 11:49 AM	#27
THEBERBSTER Growing Old Disgracefully Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Hythe - Southampton Posts: 9,609 Downloads: 1133 Uploads: 0	A Warm Welcome To The Subsim Community & Wishing You A Merry Christmas > CaptainP Subsim <> Make A Donation <> See The Benefits <> Support The Community SH3 – 4 - 5 Tutorials > Downloads > Other Useful Information > See Links in My Signature Below __________________ LSH3-2015 <> TUTORIALS <> ALL YOU NEED TO KNOW <> ALL IN ONE PLACE SH4 <> TUTORIALS <> HOW TO DO IT <> INFORMATION <> DOWNLOAD LINKS SH5 <> TUTORIALS <> HOW TO DO IT <> INFORMATION <> DOWNLOAD LINKS Always Here To Help A Fellow 'Subber' \| Need An Answer to A Question Just Send Me A PM

08-18-15, 05:00 PM	#16
Tigershark624 A-ganger Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 76 Downloads: 145 Uploads: 0	Is there a minimum depth setting for depth charges in SH3? I believe in RL there was a minimum depth of 50 meters, but I'm not sure that's correct and the information is not readily at hand. If not at periscope depth, would 25 meters be safe from ramming and depth charges?

08-19-15, 08:13 PM	#17
Zosimus XO Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Chorrillos, Lima, Peru Posts: 401 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	I think this is a bad idea for a few reasons. First of all, depth charges that explode below the ship cause more damage than those that explode above. Second, depth charges below the ship can literally blow the ship up and out of the water.

08-20-15, 02:01 PM	#19
20000 Leagues Seaman Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 42 Downloads: 111 Uploads: 0	I believe I'm in the minority here, but I only dive deep if I'm damaged, feeling anti-social, out of/loading eels or in a situation that I know is untenable. This will sound crazy, but I like to attract DD's by letting them see me on the surface. Once they start steaming toward me, I go to periscope depth and take them on, bow to bow. I line up a bow shot, somewhere around 1.2 clicks. It really is a long shot and has less than 50% success. But it's usually far enough out that the DD won't be zig-zagging yet. While I'm waiting for the long shot to play out, I start getting the next eel ready for a close shot, around 600-500m. They're zig-zagging by then, so it can be a challenge to land a good shot, but my success rate is fairly high. If I miss or get a dud (f'ing duds!) I'm now into a dogfight. The dogfight is where I do my best work. Keep your enemies close and all that. If the 600-500m shot didn't work, flank, periscope down, dive and hard to port/starboard. Guaranteed this move will rattle some dishes! Once I'm about 45° from my original course, I blow ballast to stop my descent. This takes careful timing, because I want to end up near periscope depth again and not on the surface. As soon as I can, I pop the periscope up and get a fix on the DD for a stern shot. Chances of getting a 90° shot are low, so you really have to know your eels. This is another instance where a dud can be a real lunchbox let down. If the stern shot misses, then we dance. I should add, I only draw them in if I can't get a good line on them from my position or I can't catch up to them.

08-20-15, 08:52 PM	#21
Zosimus XO Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Chorrillos, Lima, Peru Posts: 401 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	I just don't get why you would waste 2 eels on something with so few tons.

08-26-15, 11:52 PM	#23
T.Von Hogan Planesman Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: mississippi Posts: 190 Downloads: 51 Uploads: 0	Never unless there are 3 or more doing the circle of death dance around my boot. Never advertise our position but keep at least one electric eel each direction for protection. Escorts rarely survive the 1st eel fired inside 600 yds.