At this moment, 150 years ago...

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Betonov

Well, you need a Serb that would spit in my face, I'd start kicking him when a Russian would start kicking me and then a German would start kicking me and a Frechman would come in with a riot shield and the German would smack a Belgian to the ground to get around that shield and then a Brit would start kicking the German.

To be followed by a Turk kicking the Brit and an Italian who kicks the Austro Hungarian, a Japanese who kicks remote parts of the German (what ever that would be) and an American who is too late to get much of the party (would we actually have to make a distinction whether it's a northern or southern US boy as this seem to be two different countries in some people's eyes... maybe it was a self righteous Northerner riding on the back of a suppressed and exploited Southerner. ) . After a short pause everybody will be at it again for round two with a few people changing sides and some having difficulties to decide on which side to stay throughout the brawl.
Or in short: I hate you all!

[Bilge_Rat]

[Betonov]

And at that point, nothing remains of York

[mapuc]

And I who have high thoughts about Lincoln. Have always seen him as one of the best President USA had.

Markus

[Bilge_Rat]

Abraham Lincoln, the One President All of Them Want to Be More Like

While confronting Gen. Douglas MacArthur, Harry S. Truman sent an aide to the Library of Congress to research Lincoln’s firing of Gen. George B. McClellan. Dwight D. Eisenhower kept a set of Lincoln’s collected works in the Oval Office and painted a portrait of him that hung in the Cabinet Room.

Sitting in the Lincoln Bedroom during the Vietnam War, Lyndon B. Johnson looked up at a picture and said, “I sure hope I have better generals than he did.” Richard M. Nixon, at age 12, was given a picture of Lincoln that hung over his bed. During his own Vietnam trials, he made a spontaneous nighttime visit to the Lincoln Memorial.

Ronald Reagan reported a couple of instances when his dog, Rex, acted oddly, which “nearly made me join the believers” that Lincoln’s ghost haunted the mansion. Bill Clinton, of course, got in trouble for inviting political donors to sleep in the Lincoln Bedroom, but once told Mr. Winik that he wanted to write his own Lincoln biography.

Few presidents revered Lincoln more than George W. Bush, who read 14 biographies of him while president and still has two paintings of Lincoln in his office in Dallas. “There was more of an affinity, or looking to Lincoln, than other presidents because Bush was a wartime president,” said Peter H. Wehner, who as an aide to Mr. Bush organized a meeting for him with Lincoln scholars like Mr. Winik.

They sit in the second-floor bedroom named for him. They stare at his picture on the walls or his bust in the Oval Office. They study his speeches, read his letters, glance at the copy of the Emancipation Proclamation under glass. Some have even wondered if they saw or felt his ghost. In their darkest moments, especially during war or crisis, they ask themselves what Lincoln would do. Some find an answer; others do not.

“He remains an inspiration for presidents whether they’re Republican or Democrat,” said Jay Winik, author of “April 1865,” a book about the final days of the Civil War. “When they look at him, he almost defies explanation. He sort of lives somewhere in the stratosphere.”

Mark K. Updegrove, director of the Lyndon B. Johnson Presidential Library and Museum, said Lincoln remained a touchstone for those who followed. “There’s no president I’ve interviewed — Ford, Carter, Bush 41, Clinton, Bush 43 — who hasn’t said that it was Lincoln that they thought of first and foremost as an inspiration during the most trying days of their presidencies,” Mr. Updegrove said. “He is unquestionably the standard.”

not a bad standard to have.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/15/us...like.html?_r=0

[Betonov]

And food for thought.
Say the USA and CSA existed side by side. How would history unfold.

If the south had won and gained independence, what are the chances those two sides would come in to conflict again (history teaches us the chances were good)
Spanish American war, would a divided nation be able to win that conflict and
WWI, wouldn't Germany influence one side against the other to keep them out of Europe and one side would join Central powers out of sheer spite for the other and we'd have another trench system along the Mason-Dixon line.

He could have been a tyrant, but the USA and CSA would be less today than just the USA

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Betonov

And food for thought.
Say the USA and CSA existed side by side. How would history unfold.

If the south had won and gained independence, what are the chances those two sides would come in to conflict again (history teaches us the chances were good)
Spanish American war, would a divided nation be able to win that conflict and
WWI, wouldn't Germany influence one side against the other to keep them out of Europe and one side would join Central powers out of sheer spite for the other and we'd have another trench system along the Mason-Dixon line.

He could have been a tyrant, but the USA and CSA would be less today than just the USA

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Victory_Series

[Betonov]

Originally Posted by Oberon

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Victory_Series

I really got to get my hands on a copy.
I love alternate history.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Betonov

WWI, wouldn't Germany influence one side against the other to keep them out of Europe and one side would join Central powers out of sheer spite for the other and we'd have another trench system along the Mason-Dixon line.

Since the South could only have won with Britain and France's recognition, I think the South would have joined the war on the Allied side and the North would have stayed out altogether.

[Betonov]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Since the South could only have won with Britain and France's recognition, I think the South would have joined the war on the Allied side and the North would have stayed out altogether.

A lot can happen in 50 years.

Example is the turmoil that happened around the German unification.
Sardinia Piedmont attacked Austria with the backing of France (1859) and took Lombardy. In 1866 Prussia attacked Austria and Italy was there to help Prussia. Fearing the rise of Prussia, France started talks of an alliance between them, Italy AND Austria. The Austrians were ready to ally themselves with a side that took away from them north Italy only 10 years prior.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

To be followed by a Turk kicking the Brit and an Italian who kicks the Austro Hungarian, a Japanese who kicks remote parts of the German (what ever that would be) and an American who is too late to get much of the party (would we actually have to make a distinction whether it's a northern or southern US boy as this seem to be two different countries in some people's eyes... maybe it was a self righteous Northerner riding on the back of a suppressed and exploited Southerner. ) . After a short pause everybody will be at it again for round two with a few people changing sides and some having difficulties to decide on which side to stay throughout the brawl.
Or in short: I hate you all!