Convoy Attack Technique

[Aras]

Originally Posted by Paulebaer1979

Hiding under a cover ship makes sense, if you know the draft of the other ships around you, so you can launch your torps submerged. But that needs a lot of paperwork by hand for plotting courses and postions.

@Joefour - Interesting tactic. I will try defiantly try it. Combined with what Paulebaer mentioned, it may give you the opportunity to sink more targets.

[Paulebaer1979]

@aras: if you want to try it, check the settings in the NSS_Uboat**.cfg (inside SH3/data/Submarine/NSS_Uboat**/) first.

TorpLaunchMaxDepth=25;meters

This should work most times. I don´t know from witch depth the subs in WW2 could launch torps - so it could be cheating.

Edit: just checked out the unmodified settings from SH3 1.4: 20m. So it´s a little bit of cheating.

[Joefour]

Wouldn't that be cool if you could launch torps from a 100M depth at the escorts attacking you. SUPERSUB! Kill 'em all, let Churchill sort 'em out!

[Joefour]

Originally Posted by Paulebaer1979

@aras: if you want to try it, check the settings in the NSS_Uboat**.cfg (inside SH3/data/Submarine/NSS_Uboat**/) first.
This should work most times. I don´t know from witch depth the subs in WW2 could launch torps - so it could be cheating.

Edit: just checked out the unmodified settings from SH3 1.4: 20m. So it´s a little bit of cheating.

I am sure the depth limitations on launching torpedos has something to do with water pressure. It would be interesting to play around with the various types of subs, Allied or German, and see how much havoc you could create from below periscope depth.

I bet that modern atomic subs don't have anywhere near the same limitations. I would search out a today's submariner and ask him. But if he told me then he would probably have to shoot me.

[Paulebaer1979]

Originally Posted by Joefour

I am sure the depth limitations on launching torpedos has something to do with water pressure.

That´s right. We need blueprints from the subs to check the maximum depth. It´s dangerous to launch a torp at depth because the inner door of the torpedotube opens to inside the pressure hull. So the pressure of the water would open it or make it flooding if the sub is to deep with opened front door of the tube.

Originally Posted by Joefour

I bet that modern atomic subs don't have anywhere near the same limitations. I would search out a today's submariner and ask him. But if he told me then he would probably have to shoot me.

Even older and nonatomic subs can launch torps from depth deeper 100m. Class 206/206a were able to launch torps from 100m. That´s design depth for those subs. Class 212 can launch torps from design depth (250m), too. Both classes were build with nonmagnetic special steel which isn´t as strong as normal shipbuilding steel.
Class 209 and 214 (normal steel) can go deeper as 350m and i bet they can launch torps from that depths, too.

[Joefour]

Originally Posted by Paulebaer1979

That´s right. We need blueprints from the subs to check the maximum depth. It´s dangerous to launch a torp at depth because the inner door of the torpedotube opens to inside the pressure hull. So the pressure of the water would open it or make it flooding if the sub is to deep with opened front door of the tube.



Even older and nonatomic subs can launch torps from depth deeper 100m. Class 206/206a were able to launch torps from 100m. That´s design depth for those subs. Class 212 can launch torps from design depth (250m), too. Both classes were build with nonmagnetic special steel which isn´t as strong as normal shipbuilding steel.
Class 209 and 214 (normal steel) can go deeper as 350m and i bet they can launch torps from that depths, too.

Netflix had a show on the other night that I think, might have been off the Discovery Channel, about a modern american sub they were allowed to go out to sea on and film (with limitations in certains areas of the boat). Their fuel lasts for years, they make their own air and fresh water, the only thing that holds them back is the chow supply. Neat! Had no idea they could make their own water and air supply. Now if they could just requisition a replicator from Capt. Kirk they'd be all set.

[Paulebaer1979]

Originally Posted by Joefour

Netflix had a show on the other night that I think, might have been off the Discovery Channel, about a modern american sub they were allowed to go out to sea on and film (with limitations in certains areas of the boat). Their fuel lasts for years, they make their own air and fresh water, the only thing that holds them back is the chow supply. Neat! Had no idea they could make their own water and air supply. Now if they could just requisition a replicator from Capt. Kirk they'd be all set.

Yes. But you will need a replikator for torps, harpoons and so on, too. And don´t forget about the crew. You´ll need some woman to replikate the crew

And all those engines and systems are the reason why a LosAngelos sub fresh out the shipyard (refreshment) had no chance against a 30 year old 206a in med sea 2002. We won 20 to 1. The one time they found us, we started to snorkel while the batteries were fully charged. We were able to detect the noise from reactor from greater distances as the LA could detect us - even when both subs cruised with speeds below 10kn.

[Joefour]

Originally Posted by Paulebaer1979

Yes. But you will need a replikator for torps, harpoons and so on, too. And don´t forget about the crew. You´ll need some woman to replikate the crew

And all those engines and systems are the reason why a LosAngelos sub fresh out the shipyard (refreshment) had no chance against a 30 year old 206a in med sea 2002. We won 20 to 1. The one time they found us, we started to snorkel while the batteries were fully charged. We were able to detect the noise from reactor from greater distances as the LA could detect us - even when both subs cruised with speeds below 10kn.

This is true. Good thing thing I'm not employed as a naval planner!

Uh, you aren't going to have shoot me now, are ya?

[Paulebaer1979]

No i´m telling the truth. We had to officers from the LA onboard. They were surprised how easy we detected their sub.

Just ask yourselve why HDW sells subs as 209 and 214 as easy as a fresh rolls on a saturday morning? Because they are not easy to find, easy to handle and very agile when submerged.

[Joefour]

Originally Posted by Paulebaer1979

Yes. But you will need a replikator for torps, harpoons and so on, too. And don´t forget about the crew. You´ll need some woman to replikate the crew

And all those engines and systems are the reason why a LosAngelos sub fresh out the shipyard (refreshment) had no chance against a 30 year old 206a in med sea 2002. We won 20 to 1. The one time they found us, we started to snorkel while the batteries were fully charged. We were able to detect the noise from reactor from greater distances as the LA could detect us - even when both subs cruised with speeds below 10kn.

What I find interesting is the detectable noise you say was coming from the powerplants. Many years ago I worked with my dad at a pump factory in the Los Angeles area. They did some DoD work, the majority of which was submarine main seawater pumps, which I think was for Electric Boat in Connecticut. I have no idea what class subs these pumps were for. I worked there from 1973 to 1978, if that helps. The thing is, the pumps were so quiet that they had to be tested outside at a special testing station away from the machine shop noise. What amazed me was that you could stand next to them and not even know they were running unless you put your hand on them and felt a very smooth vibration.

[Paulebaer1979]

Originally Posted by Joefour

What amazed me was that you could stand next to them and not even know they were running unless you put your hand on them and felt a very smooth vibration.

That´s the fact. The reactor needs active watercooling above a spec. speed/load limit. We were able to detect this cooling pump about distances of 2-3,5 nautical miles. When we drove at the same speed, the LA-class sub wasn´t able to detect us at the same distance.

The 212 are better noise-isolated. All engines witch vibrates or make any noise are build in special location. This room is noise-isolated build and has special basics to the hull.
In facts they can detect a coastal cargoship at range about 80 nautical miles and another 212 sub cruising in normal modus only in range under 100m. Therefore HDW had a slogan: "Nobody finds our subs well."

[Panthera Pardus]

Ahoy,

Interesting tactic in your first Post, joefour. But it sound familiar while I read it, and at the End I know why. Because I am a fan of the movie "Periscope Down" since the first time I saw it. And when I think I have enough experience I truly will try it myself. But it is good to know that you tried it successfully. So, Thank you for posting it, have a nice day and good hunting.

Joy and Happiness
Panthera Pardus

P.S.: Just in case anyone wants to know, the German Title is "Mission Rohr Frei"

[Joefour]

Originally Posted by Panthera Pardus

Ahoy,

Interesting tactic in your first Post, joefour. But it sound familiar while I read it, and at the End I know why. Because I am a fan of the movie "Periscope Down" since the first time I saw it. And when I think I have enough experience I truly will try it myself. But it is good to know that you tried it successfully. So, Thank you for posting it, have a nice day and good hunting.

Joy and Happiness
Panthera Pardus

P.S.: Just in case anyone wants to know, the German Title is "Mission Rohr Frei"

I wonder why they didn't just call it " Seerohr Ab". Gut' Jagd!

[Joefour]

Originally Posted by Paulebaer1979

That´s the fact. The reactor needs active watercooling above a spec. speed/load limit. We were able to detect this cooling pump about distances of 2-3,5 nautical miles. When we drove at the same speed, the LA-class sub wasn´t able to detect us at the same distance.

The 212 are better noise-isolated. All engines witch vibrates or make any noise are build in special location. This room is noise-isolated build and has special basics to the hull.
In facts they can detect a coastal cargoship at range about 80 nautical miles and another 212 sub cruising in normal modus only in range under 100m. Therefore HDW had a slogan: "Nobody finds our subs well."

Amazing! 80 NM.

[Paulebaer1979]

Originally Posted by Joefour

Amazing! 80 NM.

Made in Germany

And i was able to hear both, DEMON and LOFAR with the Flank Array.

DEMON stands for: DeModulationOfNoise and means the noise only from the prop of the target.

LOFAR means the lower frequences of the engines and gearboxes. With this tool you can analyse the number of cylinders of the engine, the number of turns per minute and the ratio of the gearbox. Very interesting stuff.

Originally Posted by Panthera Pardus

P.S.: Just in case anyone wants to know, the German Title is "Mission Rohr Frei"

Funny movie. One of four submarine movies i look regularly.