The Firearm thread: Engineering artistry of wood, polymer and steel.

[Aktungbby]

Originally Posted by Stealhead

a 335 word paragraph was needed to explain my error.

No error implied; you just piqued my curiosity since I study that history and shoot everything black-powder and up to WWII; But if you counted the words in my post!!!?

[Stealhead]

Originally Posted by Aktungbby

No error implied; you just piqued my curiosity since I study that history and shoot everything black-powder and up to WWII; But if you counted the words in my post!!!?...good lord ol' son, ya really need a HAMM"S

Nah i just copy pasted into Word and got the word count.How many Hamms did it take you to write that?

[Red October1984]

Reviving this topic to get some opinions on my next gun. Do we have any shotgunners on here?

• 12 Gauge
• Able to shoot 3.5" shells
• Durable and Reliable
• Best Value For The Money

That's basically my criteria. Now, I have it narrowed down to the Benelli Nova and Remington 887. I've got a friend who has an 887 and my dad's got a Nova. I've heard some mixed things about the 887...and Benelli seems to have a good product line with the Nova.

The 887 has the special ArmorLokt coating...I read it described as a "glass-filled polymer coating." In reality, it just makes the thing feel plastic.

I'm leaning toward the Nova....which I can get for ~400$ around here but the 887 is only ~325$

I assume "You Get What You Pay For" applies to Benelli products. I took out the Nova the other day and ran some 2.75" High Velocity game loads through it and I really like the feel for it.

I'm just wondering should I consider the Remington 870 or any of the Mossberg products....

[Ducimus]

You missed the number 1 criteria:
What is this shotgun for? Hunting or self defense? With shotguns, it makes a world of difference in barrel length, magazine capacity, and choke. A good hunting shotgun makes a poor self defense shotgun and vice versa.

Personally, i'm in the Remington and Mossberg area, and really don't know much beyond those two brands. For hunting, id probably go with a Remington, mainly because I have a Remington 870 wingmaster in my gun safe, that was made in 1967 or so, and it's still chucking shells like it was brand new. The action is smooth, it's been 100% reliable, and has taken more dove, grouse, pheasant , quail, and other assorted upland game birds then i can count.

For self defense, that depends on what YOU want in a stock. Do you want a pistol grip with collapsible stock or a fixed stock? If you want a pistol grip with collapsible stock, again go with a Remington. The slide lock and safety locations are conducive to this setup. If you prefer a fixed stock, go with a Mossberg 500. The safety and slide release are in different locations then the 870 and are ergonomic to a fixed stock. Take it from someone who's made this mistake, DO NOT put an M4 styled stock on a mossberg. It's counter intuitive to the guns design. With a Remington 870 you have to shift your hand forward of the trigger guard to unlock the slide, with a mossberg 500, you do not have to shift your hand at all, so long as the receiver is on a fixed stock.

On the flip side mossbergs are harder to field strip, while Remingtons fairly easy. Also, Mossberg has a polymer or aluminum Reciever, and Remingtons are steel, if thats an issue for you. You may think im a Remington fan, but I actually have both, and like both. I have a Mossberg 500 with a short LOP stock and an 8 round magazine. It used to be my home defense piece, and would pick it over my Remington for that purpose.

[Red October1984]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

You missed the number 1 criteria:
What is this shotgun for? Hunting or self defense? With shotguns, it makes a world of difference in barrel length, magazine capacity, and choke. A good hunting shotgun makes a poor self defense shotgun and vice versa.

I'm looking at waterfowl...but something versatile that I can use for squirrels, doves, etc. Mainly waterfowl though. I want to get into duck hunting. I've got some good friends that are hardcore into it and I fell in love with it in November.

I'd need a choke for steel shot... as far as choke tubes go. Magazine capacity only allows like...3 shells to be in the gun at one time. And obviously I wouldn't want a short barrel for this kind of thing...

Personally, i'm in the Remington and Mossberg area, and really don't know much beyond those two brands. For hunting, id probably go with a Remington, mainly because I have a Remington 870 wingmaster in my gun safe, that was made in 1967 or so, and it's still chucking shells like it was brand new. The action is smooth, it's been 100% reliable, and has taken more dove, grouse, pheasant , quail, and other assorted upland game birds then i can count.

See, there are people that swear by the 870 Wingmaster and then there are people who swear by the Mossberg 500. The Wingmaster doesn't shoot 3.5" and it's out of my price range by about 300$ (according to the Remington website)

For self defense, that depends on what YOU want in a stock. Do you want a pistol grip with collapsible stock or a fixed stock? If you want a pistol grip with collapsible stock, again go with a Remington. The slide lock and safety locations are conducive to this setup. If you prefer a fixed stock, go with a Mossberg 500. The safety and slide release are in different locations then the 870 and are ergonomic to a fixed stock. Take it from someone who's made this mistake, DO NOT put an M4 styled stock on a mossberg. It's counter intuitive to the guns design. With a Remington 870 you have to shift your hand forward of the trigger guard to unlock the slide, with a mossberg 500, you do not have to shift your hand at all, so long as the receiver is on a fixed stock.

On the flip side mossbergs are harder to field strip, while Remingtons fairly easy. Also, Mossberg has a polymer or aluminum Reciever, and Remingtons are steel, if thats an issue for you. You may think im a Remington fan, but I actually have both, and like both. I have a Mossberg 500 with a short LOP stock and an 8 round magazine. It used to be my home defense piece, and would pick it over my Remington for that purpose.

Home defense isn't too much of an issue for me. Living where I live, any weapon in the house is a possible self defense weapon. There are some people who go hardcore-full-nine-yards with the weapons for self defense. Those usually seem to me to be the people who will likely NEVER have to use it and end up wasting money.


As I said, I'm leaning pretty hard toward the Nova right now....but I'm open to anything you have to say.

[Ducimus]

I overlooked your requirement of a 3 1/2 inch shell. Something I don't think i've ever used. 2 3/4" or 3" shell, high or low brass is all I can recall using. It sounds like your looking for a "long tom" for geese and what not.

I've pretty much "shot my wad" where shotguns are concerned, so i can't offer any more information then what I already have. Maybe someone else with more experience can chime in.

[Red October1984]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

I overlooked your requirement of a 3 1/2 inch shell. Something I don't think i've ever used. 2 3/4" or 3" shell, high or low brass is all I can recall using. It sounds like your looking for a "long tom" for geese and what not.

I've pretty much "shot my wad" where shotguns are concerned, so i can't offer any more information then what I already have. Maybe someone else with more experience can chime in.

Fair enough.

See, the perfect gun would be the Benelli Super Black Eagle II....but the cheapest one MSRP is $1500.

Who doesn't like semiautomatic 3.5" capable shotguns.

There's a lot of people with the argument against 3.5" that it'll shred any bird you shoot with it. But, yeah, I want something I can use for a variety of purposes. Geese, Ducks, Squirrels, maybe the odd rabbit or dove.