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11-07-13, 06:30 AM | #76 |
Ace of the deep .
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11-07-13, 06:43 AM | #77 |
Navy Seal
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Yes, I got your point sober. I think tscharlii's note on post #1 refers to signal strength and bearing accuracy curves rather than to blind angles, but indeed I can be wrong. Let's wait for his answers
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11-07-13, 12:53 PM | #78 | |
Watch
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As of Version 1.1, that is true. Adding support for the rotating hydrophone KDB and the Balcony Apparatus, however, is on the todo list.
Some aspects of the KDB/Balcony are not clear to me, yet. Probably you can help me out here. As my understanding of the KDB is right now, I would model it just like the GHG, just without a deaf area at the bow and without a bearing dependent accuracy/max range degradation. But what about the deaf area at stern. It stems from the engine noise, right? The conning tower doesn't seem to be much of an obstacle to the KDB (for instance see http://www.u47.org/images/album/R07_6jul40.jpg , KDB sensor is visible on the very bottom left of the picture). So would it be possible to listen to contacts at stern, if you shut down the engines while being submerged? Another source (which I cannot find again now ), however, mentioned, that you'd never completely shutdown your engines while being submerged. The sub would start sinking slowly, and change its position unpredictably, which can result in dangerous situations. So we might assume, there is always enough noise at stern, that we cannot listen there using the KDB? On to the Balcony apparatus: Quote:
The german wikipedia article on the GHG (http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gruppenhorchger%C3%A4t) also states, that you could use the balcony apparatus while the sub was surfaced, because the hydrophones were mounted at the keel and the body of the sub shielded them from surface noise. Unfortunately the wikipedia article provides no source for this statement and I couldn't confirm it anywhere else yet. Also, the UBoot_Sensors.sim file of R.E.M_by_Xrundel_TheBeast_1.2 - no hyd on surface - NewUIs-IRAI compatible (gap, your work?) seems to require the boat to be submerged, even with a balcony apparatus. |
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11-07-13, 04:31 PM | #79 | |||
Navy Seal
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- the KDB had a much shorter range than the GHG, but it had a better bearing accuracy, and had no deaf angles. From that, I desume that it could have been more sensitive to short wavelenghts and lesser sensitive to long wavelenghts than the GHG, but this is just my speculation. - due to its short range, the KDB wasn't used as unique listening apparatus, but always coupled with the GHG. This is currently not modelled in game (KDB's specs are therefore unrealistically boosted in game) but there is a possible method for making both sensors to be associated with the KDB upgrade. If you want, I can send you some files modded to the above purpose. I am not fully sure that my method would work, but imo it is worth a test. - due to their relative vicinity, running engines should have deteriorated hydrophone sesitivity and accuracy at any angle, maybe with a slight further decrease in performamnce when listening astern. Balcon Gerat's sonic filters could have partly obviated the problem, but even so silent running or full stop would have been an important listening prerequisite. - both GHG's and balcon gerat's sensors were located along or near boat's keel and, theoretically, they could have been used on surface, though the vicinity of wave-generated noise, would have deteriorated their performance sensibly. Again, Balcon Gerat's improved electronics could have made surface listening a bit better. On the contrary, KDB's sensors stickied out of the water while the boat was surface, thus making their usage impossible. NOTE: the SensorHeight parameter (SensorData controller), already takes into account sensors' position along the boat profile. Therefore, setting KDB's minimum heigh lower than GHG's makes little sense imo. - I remember having read on the forum that the Balkon Gerat had a deaf spot at high elevation angles (thus making its use pointless against targets located directly on top of the boat). IIRC, this fact is already modelled in game through stock and REM settings. I couldn't find a conformation to the above statement elsewhere on the web, but it makes sense anyway as, being located below the keel, BalkonGerat's sensors were a bit lower than GHG's sensors, and much lower than KDB one. This would be yet another argument in favour of the assumption that the Balkon Gerat wasn't as affected as GHG and KDB by surface noises. Quote:
In my opinion you should create a new set of sensordata controller settings, suiting your mod better. If you wanted to increase compatibility with other mods, you would need to clone the existing hydrophones. Should you decide to follow my suggestion, I will be glad to help you on the clonig task |
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11-09-13, 09:02 PM | #80 |
Ace of the deep .
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Any way to script Mr know it all to announce depth charges in the water ? It should be Mr almost know it all
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11-10-13, 06:52 AM | #81 |
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Good idea
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11-12-13, 04:37 AM | #82 | ||||
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- GHG: Maxrange 40000, MinDepth 6m, Bearingranges: 10-150, 210-350 - KDB: Maxrange 30000 (or whatever shorter range means), MinDepth 10m (or deeper? the kdb sensor should be well below the surface), Bearingranges: 0-360 - BG: Maxrange 50000, Mindepth 0m, Bearingranges: 0-150, 210-360 The rest will be done by scripting: Consider the sensor controllers as a first set of criteria, whether we can hear a contact or not, and the scripts act as a secondary filter, after the contact has been detected by the sensor controller. For instance, this is GHG's effectiveness by our sub's depth (x-axis: depth in meter, y-axis: GHG-effectiveness in percent): So at 6m it starts working, at 7m we can already hear (very loud) contacts in a distance of 4km (10% of 40km set in sensor controller), and at 30m we reach an effectiveness of 95%, i.e. we can hear very loud contacts in a distance of 38km. There are other depth modifiers for KDB, BG, and gradual modifiers that take the contact's speed into account (enlarging the detection range for loud contacts, shrinking it for more silent contacts), as well the noise generated by our own engines: We cannot hear anything, if we are running on diesels (incl. snorkeling), it's just too loud. On electric engines, silent running doesn't interfere much with the hydrophone's effectiveness, but moving at flank speed shrinks the detection range to just a few hundred meters. So: It'd be great, if you could help me mod the UBoot_Sensors.sim. The goal is to have the above simple hydrophone sensors, but keep other changes/fixes, that are applied by REM, IRAI etc. |
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11-12-13, 05:18 PM | #83 |
Swabbie
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Seems like the 1.1 version manually replaced sounds over to German? Tried preventing that by uninstalling mod, removing the sounds folder from the mod, reinstalling only to end up with no sonarman sounds. Nowhere near as interesting as the technical details in the posts preceding mine - but hopefully an easy fix.
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11-12-13, 07:10 PM | #84 | |||||||||||||||||
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Sonar reference and implementation details |
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11-14-13, 12:23 PM | #85 |
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I have created an on-line chart resuming all the information we have gathered so far:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...lE&usp=sharing I have left the document open for editing by anyone: feel free to correct any mistake I might have made, or to add information in case you find any new source. You will notice that there are several discrepancies between different sources, especially regarding maximum ranges, maximum allowed speeds during hydrophone listening, and deaf angles. Talking about the latter, there seem to be some confusion between totally deaf arcs, and arcs at which sound detection would have been harder and/or lesser accurate but still possible, for KDB and Balkon apparatus. This might partly depend on the fact that "astern handicaps" could have varied greatly, depending on the propulsion adopted during underwater listening. The above statement is especially true if referred to the KDB which should have provided correct bearings at any angle, provided that U-boat propulsion was switched off during its use. I will let you to draw the conclusions; at this moment I have just a few general suggestions:
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11-17-13, 07:43 AM | #86 |
Navy Seal
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I must express my gratitude one more time, this mod is such a large improvement !
I've got few questions though... Is there any way to prevent this? It can be very annoying when large conwoy is in site... Also it would be really awesome if you could make some changes for sonar too...Current implementation isn't so realistic at all...
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Best regards... Vecko The Wolves of Steel v2.2.25_SH5 Expansion Pack_Full The Wolves of Steel v2.2.xx to v2.2.25 - Update PDF Install Instructions How to report an issue If You wish to support my work... |
11-18-13, 09:28 AM | #87 | |
Grey Wolf
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Will there be an English version for the sound files someday?
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JSGME help links and common error solutions |
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12-14-13, 08:03 AM | #88 |
Navy Seal
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Bump! Tscharlii, please don't give up on this mod, it has so much potential...
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Best regards... Vecko The Wolves of Steel v2.2.25_SH5 Expansion Pack_Full The Wolves of Steel v2.2.xx to v2.2.25 - Update PDF Install Instructions How to report an issue If You wish to support my work... |
12-14-13, 08:10 AM | #89 | |
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undersigned |
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01-06-14, 06:48 PM | #90 |
Bilge Rat
Join Date: Dec 2013
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deutsch?
hello masters of mod!
and special greetings to tscharlii for this great modification (the sonarguy is now my best friend below deck, i call him charlie. ) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^ is there a posibility that the messages of the sonarguy called out by heard contacts (in german: horchkontakt) that are shown in the message-box can be changed to the german terms? ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ i'm german and i like to play the game in german language. i modificated the ui mod of the dark wraith to german by changing the menu.txt file (easy one ). so every call in the message-box is in german, except messages indicating the direction of a contact. it's not a big deal, but it bothers me more than it should. if there is any advice how it could changed would be very welcome! wohl auf! "Die Südfrüchte runter vom Kartentisch. Auf Bananen kann ich nicht navigieren." |
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