Syria conflict: 'Chemical attacks kill hundreds'

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by August

I'm thinking little or nothing Jim.

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Jim, BO is golfing. Please leave a message.

I feared/thought as much

[eddie]

I'm sure BO is aware of what has happened over there. We've been fighting so damned long in the ME already, why should we get involved. We have spent trillions on the ME, isn't that enough? We've lost a lot of soldiers and have thousands of wounded, isn't that enough?

Unless of course you are part of that crowd who says war is good for business. American Defense Contractors are just waiting to get going into Syria, the sick bastids! They know where they can go, as far as I'm concerned!

[Oberon]

I think a lot of the fear is not so much the effects of the chemical weapons on a military level, but the fact that it's a new stage in the already bloody Syrian civil war, and it's going to cause even more fatalities than before.

Now, you take the average Scud missile, it has a payload ability of between 600-1000kg, that's about 2000lb, give or take a few hundred lb. Ironically, about the same size warhead of a V2 missile from WWII. So we can probably use this video as a fairly accurate representation of the blast effects of a conventional Scud:

http://vimeo.com/50445690
(About 17 minutes in)

And this video from Aleppo purports to show the impact of a Scud:


Now, with a conventional explosive blast there is a chance, in some cases, a very slim chance of survivors, especially if you're in a basement or some such place, which is where a lot of the casualties of this recent attack were. With a chemical attack, the basement is the worst place to be, and the likelihood of survival without protective equipment is lower.

Assad knows he can get away with pretty much anything because the West won't intervene because the general public of the West doesn't have the stomach for it, nor indeed do they really know which side to support.

Things fall apart, the centre cannot hold
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world

[Wolferz]

From the news reports of this alleged use of chemical weapons, well that's the word the talking heads have been using, "alleged"...
It must be some cheap Sarin gas, because even a small drop of Sarin on your skin is enough to make you do the dying cockroach dance and kill you if you don't have an Atropine injector handy. There shouldn't be any video of sickened survivors at all. That's why I think the reports are bogus BS. They're just trying to stir the public into backing a military incursion into Syria and by association, Iran. The public is so damned gullible it's ridiculous and the warmongers will use it to their advantage.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Wolferz

From the news reports of this alleged use of chemical weapons, well that's the word the talking heads have been using, "alleged"...
It must be some cheap Sarin gas, because even a small drop of Sarin on your skin is enough to make you do the dying cockroach dance and kill you if you don't have an Atropine injector handy. There shouldn't be any video of sickened survivors at all. That's why I think the reports are bogus BS. They're just trying to stir the public into backing a military incursion into Syria and by association, Iran. The public is so damned gullible it's ridiculous.

Sarin isn't the only chemical weapon in the world. The Syrians have Tabun, VX and Mustard Gas as well as Sarin. Also, bear in mind that in a few of the videos you see the victims being sprayed with hosepipes in an attempt to dilute and wash away the chemical agent, furthermore, it's likely that Syrian chemical agents don't have the same shelf life that Western and Russian Sarin does because of impurities in its creation, Iraqi Sarin, for example, only persisted for a couple of weeks, whereas advanced Sarin can linger between weeks and months.
It's pretty much accepted that a chemical incident has occurred, the unknown factor is who did it. Assad to attack the enemy, or the FSA to frame Assad? That's the question, and by stopping the UN inspectors from visiting the area and independently evaluating the situation, Assad is making himself look guilty in the way that Saddam did when he played roulette with IAEA inspectors.

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by Oberon

And this video from Aleppo purports to show the impact of a Scud:

Wonder what's that fire that flares few seconds before the explosion in the same
exact spot.

[CaptainMattJ.]

Chemical weapons are horrendously more cruel than a bullet. Have you never seen all the pictures of horribly disfigured people, who's skin is falling off and in unbearable pain? Nerve agents, biological warfare, mustard gas, all much, much worse than getting shot.

Aside from being burned alive or brutally tortured, chemical weapons easily top the horror of being shot or dying in an explosion. If you're in the kill radius, explosions are quick and easy. Chemical agents can take days to kill, and assuming you survive it, you can easily be left with permanent disfiguration and health issues.


As for a response, it would be a very bad idea to put any kind of significant number of boots on the ground. Many of our "short-term" conflicts started with "well only be here a few weeks, with a few thousand men".

[eddie]

The so called experts from the West finally guess as to what happened.

"They suspect an organophosphate agent, most likely sarin gas, was involved in Wednesday's attack. However, the basic chemical agent may have been mixed with other substances acting as preservatives and perhaps also to alter or add to the effects of the gas.
"Because they are non-persistent agents, they dissipate very quickly," said Hamish de Bretton-Gordon, a former head of Britain's military counter-nuclear, biological and chemical warfare force and now a private contractor.
"In pure military terms, the idea is to drop these things on a population, kill lots of people very quickly, and then your own forces can go in without suffering consequences."

http://news.msn.com/world/rockets-wi...d-syria-attack

[Feuer Frei!]

Originally Posted by eddie

The so called experts from the West finally guess as to what happened

The so-called experts know little more than we do.
Unless of course you were there and had taken blood samples and urine samples of the victims. And investigated the outfall areas. And taken samples. And analyzed those samples and confirmed that that is what happened.
So-called experts do however have more expertise in these matters than you or i.
Even from afar.
Which makes them much more qualified....and.....experts in the subject.

It seems there is movement from the US:

The Pentagon is moving forces closer to Syria as the US weighs its options in the conflict there, Defence Secretary Chuck Hagel has suggested.
He gave no details, but media reports say the US Navy is strengthening its presence in the eastern Mediterranean.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-23822440


24 August 2013 Last updated at 07:10