Ayn Rand

Skybird · 04-06-13, 04:54 PM

150 pages deep (of 1260 in the German edition), and I love it. I love the descriptions of characters, the way these descriptions are given in vivid and deep-going detail - without making too much words. That means her writing style aims and hits precisely - its economic. I love the moods and atmospheres of places and sceneries coming to life. I like her narrative style. I like the political, philosophical and economical multi-aspect complexity of the book that becomes apparent more and more. I like the presented ideals on what makes man noble and courageous - and what does the opposite. I like that it gives me the feeling of watching an old black-white crime movie from the 40s or 50s. I like the alternative reality setting, the silent undertone of science fiction. I just love it all.

This is a great book both in size and content. Happy that I found it. If you do not know it, check it out.

I only wish they would have published it in two smaller volumes instead of just one big one.

Platapus · 04-06-13, 05:32 PM

I guess she is OK as a fiction writer.

Skybird · 04-12-13, 04:32 PM

Quote:

“What is morality", she asked.
"Judgement to distinguish right and wrong, vision to see the truth, and courage to act upon it, dedication to that which is good, integrity to stand by the good at any price. ”

Have read it in one scene, felt a laser engraving it directly into my brain.

Bubblehead1980 · 04-12-13, 04:54 PM

Great book and if you are intelligent enough to understand the philosophy behind it(a lot of libs are not I have noticed) it will mean something. I have not read the book since I was 18 but it definitely had an impact along with 1984. The Fountainhead is another book of hers you should read after Shrugged. Rand lived under marxism and the evils that collective thinking/actions will inevitably bring upon the people of a nation.Rand went from living a comfortable live until the communists took over, then they were poor and starving, like everyone else, all in the name of fairness though right? lol. Shrugged is sadly, almost prophetic in the sense that all these years later, we are well on the way the dystopian world created in the novel.

Skybird · 04-12-13, 06:04 PM

As far as I can say after having read short of one quarter of this epos, I already agree on all that, Bubblehead. It already now rates as one of the most impressive readings I ever stumbled over. A multi-facetted novel for sure.

To complete the biography you already gave, her family then fled from Russia and emigrated finally to America, where she then met and learned capitalism. So communistic collectivism and individualist capitalism - she both saw it at closest range. And the book shows it, both. Maybe her characters are a bit too prototyped - but I think it indeed is a stylistic tool of narration she used there, like I earlier assumed already, also a condensate of her close-range witnessing of both communism and capitalism.

She also had a strong disgust of the state and government and expressed strong hostility towards it. Which however did not stop her to accept to live by state's wellfare at the end of her life. That is the one big contradiction that struck me when reading about her biography.

Atlas Shrugged was her last fiction novel. After that she wrote only philosophical essays anymore.

Oberon · 04-12-13, 06:26 PM

Quote:

“What is morality", she asked.
"Judgement to distinguish right and wrong, vision to see the truth, and courage to act upon it, dedication to that which is good, integrity to stand by the good at any price. ”

Well written, but what IS right and wrong?

Considering that the answer to this varies from not only person to person but nation to nation, the definitive answer is something that I don't think can actually be given because it changes from era to era.

Skybird · 04-13-13, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oberon

Well written, but what IS right and wrong?

Considering that the answer to this varies from not only person to person but nation to nation, the definitive answer is something that I don't think can actually be given because it changes from era to era.

The novel last but not least also is a political and a philosophical work. Right and wrong in context of the characters in this book have a lot to do with freedom, dignity, and security, as these things can be concluded on by libertarian views on guaranteeing private property and its safety to the owner. Also, in context of the book, creating value versus parasitic behavior of claiming rights for the working results of others.

Beyond the book, I think that there are many things that we can declare consensus on regarding whether they are right or wrong. Some of that is covered in basic rules of some philosophies and religions. Do not steal. Do not murder. Do not rape. Do not do against others what you would not accept to be done to you. Do not be intentionally cruel for the sake of enjoying it. And so on, basic stuff like that. While some values are indeed depending on cultural context, I also think that some things are so obvious and basic in their value for us as we define ourselves as humans, that I refuse to negotiate any possible relativizing of them (speaking generally, not meaning you specifically).

The full quote beyonds "distinguish between right and wrong" leads to all this, doesn't it, implicitly refusing a too far-reaching relativizing of good and evil.

Onkel Neal · 04-13-13, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

So far there only are two of planned three films. And audience reception and critics' verdicts alike both sank the movies. Some rate them amongst the worst movies ever done.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlas_Shrugged:_Part_I

Well, the movies were very low budget.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

150 pages deep (of 1260 in the German edition), and I love it. I love the descriptions of characters, the way these descriptions are given in vivid and deep-going detail - without making too much words. That means her writing style aims and hits precisely - its economic. I love the moods and atmospheres of places and sceneries coming to life. I like her narrative style. I like the political, philosophical and economical multi-aspect complexity of the book that becomes apparent more and more. I like the presented ideals on what makes man noble and courageous - and what does the opposite. I like that it gives me the feeling of watching an old black-white crime movie from the 40s or 50s. I like the alternative reality setting, the silent undertone of science fiction. I just love it all.

This is a great book both in size and content. Happy that I found it. If you do not know it, check it out.

I only wish they would have published it in two smaller volumes instead of just one big one.

Glad you are enjoying it and getting something out of. Right or wrong, it does make you think.

04-06-13, 04:54 PM	#1
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,660 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	150 pages deep (of 1260 in the German edition), and I love it. I love the descriptions of characters, the way these descriptions are given in vivid and deep-going detail - without making too much words. That means her writing style aims and hits precisely - its economic. I love the moods and atmospheres of places and sceneries coming to life. I like her narrative style. I like the political, philosophical and economical multi-aspect complexity of the book that becomes apparent more and more. I like the presented ideals on what makes man noble and courageous - and what does the opposite. I like that it gives me the feeling of watching an old black-white crime movie from the 40s or 50s. I like the alternative reality setting, the silent undertone of science fiction. I just love it all. This is a great book both in size and content. Happy that I found it. If you do not know it, check it out. I only wish they would have published it in two smaller volumes instead of just one big one. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

04-06-13, 05:32 PM	#2
Platapus Fleet Admiral Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 19,379 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 0	I guess she is OK as a fiction writer. __________________ abusus non tollit usum - A right should NOT be withheld from people on the basis that some tend to abuse that right.

04-12-13, 06:04 PM	#5
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,660 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	As far as I can say after having read short of one quarter of this epos, I already agree on all that, Bubblehead. It already now rates as one of the most impressive readings I ever stumbled over. A multi-facetted novel for sure. To complete the biography you already gave, her family then fled from Russia and emigrated finally to America, where she then met and learned capitalism. So communistic collectivism and individualist capitalism - she both saw it at closest range. And the book shows it, both. Maybe her characters are a bit too prototyped - but I think it indeed is a stylistic tool of narration she used there, like I earlier assumed already, also a condensate of her close-range witnessing of both communism and capitalism. She also had a strong disgust of the state and government and expressed strong hostility towards it. Which however did not stop her to accept to live by state's wellfare at the end of her life. That is the one big contradiction that struck me when reading about her biography. Atlas Shrugged was her last fiction novel. After that she wrote only philosophical essays anymore. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert. Last edited by Skybird; 04-12-13 at 06:16 PM.

04-12-13, 04:54 PM	#4
Bubblehead1980 Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Florida USA Posts: 7,121 Downloads: 605 Uploads: 44	Great book and if you are intelligent enough to understand the philosophy behind it(a lot of libs are not I have noticed) it will mean something. I have not read the book since I was 18 but it definitely had an impact along with 1984. The Fountainhead is another book of hers you should read after Shrugged. Rand lived under marxism and the evils that collective thinking/actions will inevitably bring upon the people of a nation.Rand went from living a comfortable live until the communists took over, then they were poor and starving, like everyone else, all in the name of fairness though right? lol. Shrugged is sadly, almost prophetic in the sense that all these years later, we are well on the way the dystopian world created in the novel.