Metal Gear Solid revisited, a review of the HD collection

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by Stealhead

How does USNSRCaseySmith being drunk and typing have anything to do with Dowly?

Back in the day, Dowly was notorious for drinking and posting. We still tease him about it. While it was well before Red October's time, he seems to have picked up on it.

[Red October1984]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

Back in the day, Dowly was notorious for drinking and posting. We still tease him about it. While it was well before Red October's time, he seems to have picked up on it.

I was on the Subsim IRC Channel one time with Dowly and HunterICX. Dowly was drunk.

It made for an interesting evening. The entire time, though, i don't think Dowly made spelling or grammar mistakes.

[Spike88]

Originally Posted by Red October1984

I was on the Subsim IRC Channel one time with Dowly and HunterICX. Dowly was drunk.

It made for an interesting evening. The entire time, though, i don't think Dowly made spelling or grammar mistakes.

Dowly's been drunk on Minecraft, at which point he tried to rape everyone, and was ultimately buried into a hole.

Originally Posted by Spike88

Dowly's been drunk on Minecraft, at which point he tried to rape everyone, and was ultimately buried into a hole.

AHAHAHAHAH! Thats classic.

Oh and I do agree about the hit marker. I don't like seeing hit markers in games that I am trying to be immersed in.

I also agree about the MGS series, I really do enjoy the stories either way, easily some of the best storylines in gaming and in movies. Kojima masterfully directs them all with underlying tones, and multiple metaphors. I also love the fact that they have so many Easter Eggs and/or nods to other games or series. Gives it some replay value to go back and discover them. All I was saying was that personally I did not like 2's story as well as the others. Three had a great story and gameplay I loved, even with the outdated mechanics now, and 4's was a BIT out there but ultimately an unbelievable story. You are definitely correct though, while good, SP even Chaos Theory (the best as a true stealth game IMO) will never reach the level that MGS did, because even while being the first series to break ground on the stealth genre, they kept evolving it and updating it each addition to make it fresh, but not in a bad sort of way.

[the_tyrant]

Ok, quick update for tonight.

When I say that the controls and mechanics feel archaic, its not because I am playing it on the Vita. The PSvita is actually an amazing piece of technology, in fact, many games on the Vita (the best example being MLB the show) is just as good as it is on the PS3.

After carefully playing certain portions of the game, I will say that it is truly the game itself that has aged poorly.

Metal gear solid 2 has probably some of the worst shooting mechanics I have ever seen. It feels like I'm back at playing goldeneye 64, and that game really aged poorly.

Splinter Cell has a very good set of mechanics. because when it comes to the action, Splinter Cell is a solid duel stick shooter. you move with the left stick, and aim with the right stick.

Unfortunately, Metal Gear Solid 2 is at its core, a single stick game. You move and aim with the same stick (a baffling design decision, since the duelshock controller has 2 sticks). An enemy can be 3 meters away from me, but for Solid Snake to shoot him, he has to go through up to 4 steps. (move into position with the left stick, go into first person mode by holding down the right trigger, aim using the left stick while holding down the right trigger, and finally, press a face button to shoot)

the cover mechanics also didn't age too well. Shooting from cover is pretty much impossible, and you can accidentally move from cover with an accidental flick of the left stick (something that will get you killed)

In fact, the boss fights in Metal gear solid aren't that hard if the mechanics are better. I can see myself easily defeating the bosses if the shooter mechanics were better.


However, despite my complaints regarding the mechanics, Metal Gear Solid 2 is still an amazing game.

Originally Posted by the_tyrant

Ok, quick update for tonight.

When I say that the controls and mechanics feel archaic, its not because I am playing it on the Vita. The PSvita is actually an amazing piece of technology, in fact, many games on the Vita (the best example being MLB the show) is just as good as it is on the PS3.

After carefully playing certain portions of the game, I will say that it is truly the game itself that has aged poorly.

Metal gear solid 2 has probably some of the worst shooting mechanics I have ever seen. It feels like I'm back at playing goldeneye 64, and that game really aged poorly.

Splinter Cell has a very good set of mechanics. because when it comes to the action, Splinter Cell is a solid duel stick shooter. you move with the left stick, and aim with the right stick.

Unfortunately, Metal Gear Solid 2 is at its core, a single stick game. You move and aim with the same stick (a baffling design decision, since the duelshock controller has 2 sticks). An enemy can be 3 meters away from me, but for Solid Snake to shoot him, he has to go through up to 4 steps. (move into position with the left stick, go into first person mode by holding down the right trigger, aim using the left stick while holding down the right trigger, and finally, press a face button to shoot)

the cover mechanics also didn't age too well. Shooting from cover is pretty much impossible, and you can accidentally move from cover with an accidental flick of the left stick (something that will get you killed)

In fact, the boss fights in Metal gear solid aren't that hard if the mechanics are better. I can see myself easily defeating the bosses if the shooter mechanics were better.


However, despite my complaints regarding the mechanics, Metal Gear Solid 2 is still an amazing game.

I will give you that, the mechanics of 2 are quite aged. They made them quite a bit better with 3, and 4 is a whole new ball game. Please do continue this thread, I am quite enjoying it!

[danlisa]

Here's the thing about control mechanics in MGS2, they seem difficult and clumsy because everyone has become accustomed to the CoD layout from the current gen FPS/TPS.

This is borne out by the fact that nobody had any issues at all using/adapting to the MGS2 control set when the game released, in fact they were a joy to use. However, going back to the HD conversion years later and they just can't adapt. I find it difficult and I'm not even a FPS/TPS player in general.

I do think the MGS2 layout was a deliberate choice to force the player to be deliberate and slow in their action, after all it's a stealth game before a shooter. Aside from boss fights, nearly the entire game can be completed without firing a single shot.

During the PS1/PS2 era, developers were very splintered in their approach to control layout, whereas everyone currently aims for uniformity (because of the "if it don't control like Cod, no one will play it" attitude ).

Originally Posted by danlisa

Here's the thing about control mechanics in MGS2, they seem difficult and clumsy because everyone has become accustomed to the CoD layout from the current gen FPS/TPS.

This is borne out by the fact that nobody had any issues at all using/adapting to the MGS2 control set when the game released, in fact they were a joy to use. However, going back to the HD conversion years later and they just can't adapt. I find it difficult and I'm not even a FPS/TPS player in general.

I do think the MGS2 layout was a deliberate choice to force the player to be deliberate and slow in their action, after all it's a stealth game before a shooter. Aside from boss fights, nearly the entire game can be completed without firing a single shot.

During the PS1/PS2 era, developers were very splintered in their approach to control layout, whereas everyone currently aims for uniformity (because of the "if it don't control like Cod, no one will play it" attitude ).

I agree, hence why we said the controls didn't age well. Don't get me wrong, at the timeand still currently, the game controls beautifully. However when thrown up against say MGS4, the scheme just isn't near as fluid. I love MGS4 controls immensely.

On a side note, does anyone feel like playing the HD version or collection it seems like the controls actually got a bit worse?? This could have been due to the fact that I was playing it on the 360, the touch sensitive control of the PS2/3 is definitely FTW.