Should assault rifles be banned in the US?

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by soopaman2

I cannot speak for August myself. But I can speak on how I construed his comment.

Foreigners cannot understand American gun culture, or find us barbaric for clinging to it. It is like how outlanders cannot fully understand American racism, as they do not have the experiences we have with it.

Blacks used to have separate water fountains up until the late 60s. Alot of folks are still resisting this change.

It is what makes up our fabric, good or bad.

Guns is an American tradition.

I will say this, rural areas are very liberal with guns, come to Jersey and see the hoops I had to navigate and money I had to pay, red tape and bull-stuff to own my guns.

My cousin in Alabama can just walk into a walmart.

(edit: I own a so called "assault rifle (though I have no plans of assaulting anybody, I hate that term), because it is goddam fun to shoot, I murder paper targets with it, and giggle like a child as I do it. )

Yeah, but this is not just a national, but an international forum. As such, you had better get used to reading the opinions of people from other parts of the world. It is their right to give those opinions, whether you like it or not. This whole 'beat it, outlander' thing is just silly.

[Hottentot]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

This whole 'beat it, outlander' thing is just silly.

This. There are times when I'm wondering what would the experimental removal of the "location" part of the user profile do, provided that the long time posters didn't already know from where each of them was.

[soopaman2]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

Yeah, but this is not just a national, but an international forum. As such, you had better get used to reading the opinions of people from other parts of the world. It is their right to give those opinions, whether you like it or not. This whole 'beat it, outlander' thing is just silly.

Where did I say "beat it outlander"?

I was simply clarifying how Americans feel alot more passionatly about guns than most.

Or is it you do not agree with me, and felt like chastizing?

I never told anyone to beat it, I am confused...I didn't mean the term outlander in a demeaning way.

I did not minimize no ones opinion, once again, I was attempting to make him understand why we are the way we are about firearms.

I usually need to be told to calm down by you, man

Chill

(edit: thanks for painting me a xenophobic bigot, when I said nothing of the sort in my post)

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by soopaman2

Where did I say "beat it outlander"?

I was simply clarifying how Americans feel alot more passionatly about guns than most.

Or is it you do not agree with me, and felt like chastizing?

I never told anyone to beat it, I am confused...I didn't mean the term outlander in a demeaning way.

I did not minimize no ones opinion, once again, I was attempting to make him understand why we are the way we are about firearms.

I usually need to be told to calm down by you, man

Chill

Yeah, but you defended a 'beat it outlander' post. It is also becoming something of a theme on these forums lately, which is something that I don't think we should be doing. And that was the point.

I am chill. Trust me, you'll know when I'm angry.

[soopaman2]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

Yeah, but you defended a 'beat it outlander' post. And that was the point.

I am chill. Trust me, you'll know when I'm angry.

Yeah, but I kinda got his point. We all know August can be blunt, but I understood his point, even if he broadcasted it...well bluntly.

Trust me, I have my moments where I wanna strangle (figuratively) August, but I understand what he was getting at.

He was simply saying it can be hard to understand why we are the way we are, if you are not one of us.

I can never tell you how it is like to be german, where saying Hitler was a cool fella can get you thrown in jail, I find that silly. Just like people find our guns silly...

I took a long path to say this, it was all about perspective, August was simply stating that they can never understand our perspective.

He don't need me to defend him.
I am more defending how I took his post, which I took as a way of saying, you do not understand, because culturally we are different.

No love lost Daimyo-sama

[Sonarman]

Here's another "foreigner's" view...

Why not ban all lethal guns and allow the use of tranquilizer weapons instead?That way you could still subdue a perpetrator and not open yourself up to a manslaughter/murder rap and hopefully stop these nutters getting hold of life ending equipment.

As for the sport argument... I've never seen anything macho about hunting with guns a "real man" should surely be able to wrestle an animal to the ground and kill it with his bare hands instead taking the rather cowardly minimal risk/ hide behind a tree/sniper scope approach .

As for the "inshrined in the constitution" arguement... Bush and his cronies were fast enough to bend the constitution to take away suspected terrorists rights but suddenly now it can't be bent to protect America's children?

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by Sonarman

As for the sport argument... I've never seen anything macho about hunting with guns a "real man" should surely be able to wrestle an animal to the ground and kill it with his bare hands instead taking the rather cowardly minimal risk/ hide behind a tree/sniper scope approach

Or at least use a long bow like real men used to. None of this sissified compound bow with a scope garbage. And then there's this new-fangled bait crap. Don't get me started on this whole Gore Tex thing either. Real men wore sack cloth breeches and a hood on rainy days. In fact, I can't help but notice that the decline in social mores coincides with the increase in hunter amenities. Coincidence?

[GT182]

I don't think we're going to have much of a choise after what happened in Conneticut. The Pres will see to it assault guns are banned completely, and the handgun laws will change too. There's no way any new law will please everyone, but something has to happen so nothing like this ever happens again. They need some fool proof way to determine if someone is a potiential risk and not allowed to even have, let alone own a firearm.

Now I have a question. Would you feel uncomfortable with someone carrying a consealed handgun while you are working with them? This pereson is not a Federal officer and not a cop, but he does have a 'consealed handgun permit'. He's just a young guy that thinks he has to have it on him where ever he goes.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by GT182

Now I have a question. Would you feel uncomfortable with someone carrying a consealed handgun while you are working with them? This pereson is not a Federal officer and not a cop, but he does have a 'consealed handgun permit'. He's just a young guy that thinks he has to have it on him where ever he goes.

Since it's 'concealed' I think the proper question is how comfortable are you with the idea that the guy next to you might be carrying. Since there are a large number of CC permits in Utah and anybody I see anywhere might be carrying, no, I don't have a problem with it at all. On the other hand I've seen at least three men carrying openly in the last year, and after the initial surprise I wasn't bothered by that either. Your "Just a young guy who thinks he has to have it on him wherever he goes" might turn out to be a nutcase who shoots me dead without warning. He may also be the guy who saves my life when someone else tries to do just that.

A retired cop of my aquaintance once said he considered the armed citizen to be his best backup.

We had a thread on this not long ago.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...ght=open+carry

[August]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

Or at least use a long bow like real men used to. None of this sissified compound bow with a scope garbage. And then there's this new-fangled bait crap. Don't get me started on this whole Gore Tex thing either. Real men wore sack cloth breeches and a hood on rainy days. In fact, I can't help but notice that the decline in social mores coincides with the increase in hunter amenities. Coincidence?

Oh yeah you want to tell a woman who has a violent ex boyfriend stalking her to use a long bow like a real man if she wants to defend herself? You want to tell an elderly person or handicapped person what weapons you feel they don't need to protect themselves?

[Sonarman]

Originally Posted by August

Oh yeah you want to tell a woman who has a violent ex boyfriend stalking her to use a long bow like a real man if she wants to defend herself? You want to tell an elderly person or handicapped person what weapons you feel they don't need to protect themselves?

No but she could use some form of tranquilser weapon the longbow reference is out of context as it was a reference to hunting not home intrusion.

You're pushing the line again. No matter how strongly you feel about something, a personal insult is not the way to express it.

It depends on perspective, many people think that Heston wan't really making a prick of himself with his rant, many people even bought the bumber stickers and t-shirts with his nonsense lines on them, from their perpective it wouldn't be an insult if their statement was compared to his nonsense as they think his nonsense was really correct.

I took a long path to say this, it was all about perspective, August was simply stating that they can never understand our perspective.

Soopa, it has already been pointed out that that simply isn't true.

I live in the heart of Mormonville, and you don't get much more related than that.

Not even in West Virginia?

Now I have a question. Would you feel uncomfortable with someone carrying a consealed handgun while you are working with them? This pereson is not a Federal officer and not a cop, but he does have a 'consealed handgun permit'. He's just a young guy that thinks he has to have it on him where ever he goes.

Thats the problem, too many unknowns, every individual is individual could be a paranoid nut could be a complete fruitcake might just be a worrier maybe a wannabe hero or just a regular guy.
Plus you have to weigh in his tolerance threshold which is also different for everyone, he might be a nice regular guy at work who suddenly goes postal just because someone looked at him funny.

[andritsos]

OT.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

It depends on perspective, many people think that Heston wan't really making a prick of himself with his rant, many people even bought the bumber stickers and t-shirts with his nonsense lines on them, from their perpective it wouldn't be an insult if their statement was compared to his nonsense as they think his nonsense was really correct.

It doesn't matter if Heston was right or wrong, or what the perspective is. We don't insult other members. Well, some do, but we try to keep it in line.

Soopa, it has already been pointed out that that simply isn't true.

Except in the case of Sonarman's post I'd say it was very true.

Thats the problem, too many unknowns, every individual is individual could be a paranoid nut could be a complete fruitcake might just be a worrier maybe a wannabe hero or just a regular guy.
Plus you have to weigh in his tolerance threshold which is also different for everyone, he might be a nice regular guy at work who suddenly goes postal just because someone looked at him funny.

The unknowns can indeed be a problem, but where I live we consider the risk to be worth the possible downsides. Maybe you don't know as much about us as you think you do.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Sonarman

Here's another "foreigner's" view...

Why not ban all lethal guns and allow the use of tranquilizer weapons instead?That way you could still subdue a perpetrator and not open yourself up to a manslaughter/murder rap and hopefully stop these nutters getting hold of life ending equipment.

Because banning all lethal guns would require attempting to disarm a vast number of citizens who would rather be labelled outlaws than give up their guns.

As for the sport argument... I've never seen anything macho about hunting with guns a "real man" should surely be able to wrestle an animal to the ground and kill it with his bare hands instead taking the rather cowardly minimal risk/ hide behind a tree/sniper scope approach .

What you, or I, think is "macho" is irrelevant. What a gun owner uses the gun for is, within limits, his or her own business. The opposite argument would be to leave the guns alone but ban hunting. That isn't going to happen either.

On the other hand how "macho" is it to buy a steak cut from a cow that someone else clubbed on the head? It has nothing to do with anything.

As for the "inshrined in the constitution" arguement... Bush and his cronies were fast enough to bend the constitution to take away suspected terrorists rights but suddenly now it can't be bent to protect America's children?

And many Americans protested that, and still are.

You can't just remove something from the constitution. First a new amendment has to be proposed. Then it has to pass the appropriate committee. Then it has to be voted on by both House and Senate. Then it has to be ratified by two-thirds of the States. If the government tries to bypass that procedure then we no longer have a Constitutional government, and you will see an armed rebellion, which is the real reason the Second Amendment is there in the first place.

August's reply may have been cliched, but I feel the same way. If you want my guns, by all means come try to take them.

While people have taken August and Soopaman to task for the "Outlander" thing, I think Sonarman's post is a perfect example of that very thing. Opinion is fine, and criticizm is fine, but you obviously have no understanding at all of the way we think, or of the way things work here.