Yep, another sunrise/sunset topic.

reaper7 · 08-01-12, 05:00 PM

Have you seen this thread regarding the way SH3 handles the clocks:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=193974
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...1&postcount=21

Gargamel · 08-01-12, 06:59 PM

Betcha the engine handles the sun as a point particle and then draws a radius from that.

@SS: The south east Asian campaign in gwx?

Von Due · 08-01-12, 07:32 PM

reaper: Thanks and I will digest it the best I can. I did find that the longitudes where time would jump between zones weren't where I entered the zone but it was halfway through that zone. Glad to read others agree!

...and then it went haywire. I traveled 22.5 degrees west and up to 60 north and both the ship time and local time missed the mark by around 20 minutes iirc, nothing time zones could explain.

Von Due · 08-02-12, 11:07 AM

Ok, now I feel stupid. Let me see if I can get this right.

At say, 1200 GMT, local times at 15* west and 15* east will then be 1100 and 1300 respectively. At 7* 30' local time would be (west) 1130 and (east) 1230 but the displayed local time is only valid for each multiple of 15*. So: To get the actual sun time for the longitude I am at I will need to know how far off I am from the mean median of that time zone and subtract/add from/to the displayed local time 4 minutes per degree or 30 seconds per km. I hope I am correct so far or else I'll trade this VIIB for a moped.

The further north and off the Greenwich median I go, the worse the discrepancy between calculated sunrise hour and actual in game sunrise hour becomes. The parallel longitude lines are the prime suspect as the warping to fit the cylinder world would get worse the farther from Equator I get. It would be good for a laugh to see what the game would suggest to be local time at E 60* N 89*

What I could need it seems, is the maths to convert in game long/lat positions on planet Cylinder Prime to actual long/lat positions of Planet Earth that would give me the correct hours. I am a bit at loss how to go about that other than spending a few weeks real time mapping the GMT time when the sun is at its highest position. The visual warping in the optics does not help either.

danzig70 · 08-02-12, 06:57 PM

Here's a good map with lat/long and time zones. Note that the map projection may not be the same as the game uses. http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/world...zones_2001.jpg

PS: I am in the pacific because I write my own campaign files and do not follow a historical scenario.

Von Due · 08-02-12, 08:53 PM

Thanks! I did find a suitable projection which not only look nice and coloury and a lot like the SH3 worl map but also makes the longitudes I'm reading at high latitudes make sense. It's an equirectangular projection

Here's a comparison between SH3 at E 60 N 80 (measuring the distances 80x120 km and 60x120 km from Equator and the GM median, also verified with the degree marks on the map) and Google map at the same coordinates

The lat/long positions I am reading are correct. I am now assuming it is the sun cycle itself that isn't correct for all positions. That would be a blow to my attempts of finding the sunrise/-set hours and perhaps the reason for all I know Ubi never mentioned these hours in SH3 but hid the almanac in that locker I can't open.

Von Due · 08-03-12, 08:53 AM

On one of the last test runs I will do, it seems, the in game sunrise hour happened at calculated sunrise hour for a position 258-230 km west of my position, ingame sunset happened at calculated hour for a position 274-302 km east of my position. This makes no sense at all. No time zone or mismatching ship/local/GMT time can explain that as far as I'm aware.

I will do one last attempt, going to various positions at a few constant latitudes to see if the offsets show any pattern, then at a few constant longitudes. Unless I can find that pattern, I will say the game runs a sun cycle of its own creation.

08-01-12, 06:59 PM	#2
Gargamel Lucky Sailor Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Rome Posts: 4,273 Downloads: 81 Uploads: 0	Betcha the engine handles the sun as a point particle and then draws a radius from that. @SS: The south east Asian campaign in gwx? __________________ Luck is a residue of Design.

08-02-12, 06:57 PM	#5
danzig70 Planesman Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Phoenix Arizona Posts: 195 Downloads: 290 Uploads: 0	Here's a good map with lat/long and time zones. Note that the map projection may not be the same as the game uses. http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/world...zones_2001.jpg PS: I am in the pacific because I write my own campaign files and do not follow a historical scenario. __________________

08-02-12, 08:53 PM	#6
Von Due Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,690 Downloads: 30 Uploads: 0	Thanks! I did find a suitable projection which not only look nice and coloury and a lot like the SH3 worl map but also makes the longitudes I'm reading at high latitudes make sense. It's an equirectangular projection Here's a comparison between SH3 at E 60 N 80 (measuring the distances 80x120 km and 60x120 km from Equator and the GM median, also verified with the degree marks on the map) and Google map at the same coordinates The lat/long positions I am reading are correct. I am now assuming it is the sun cycle itself that isn't correct for all positions. That would be a blow to my attempts of finding the sunrise/-set hours and perhaps the reason for all I know Ubi never mentioned these hours in SH3 but hid the almanac in that locker I can't open. Last edited by Von Due; 08-02-12 at 09:06 PM.

08-01-12, 05:00 PM	#1
reaper7 sim2reality Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: AM 82 Posts: 2,280 Downloads: 258 Uploads: 30	Have you seen this thread regarding the way SH3 handles the clocks: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=193974 http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...1&postcount=21

08-01-12, 07:32 PM	#3
Von Due Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,690 Downloads: 30 Uploads: 0	reaper: Thanks and I will digest it the best I can. I did find that the longitudes where time would jump between zones weren't where I entered the zone but it was halfway through that zone. Glad to read others agree! ...and then it went haywire. I traveled 22.5 degrees west and up to 60 north and both the ship time and local time missed the mark by around 20 minutes iirc, nothing time zones could explain.

08-02-12, 11:07 AM	#4
Von Due Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,690 Downloads: 30 Uploads: 0	Ok, now I feel stupid. Let me see if I can get this right. At say, 1200 GMT, local times at 15* west and 15* east will then be 1100 and 1300 respectively. At 7* 30' local time would be (west) 1130 and (east) 1230 but the displayed local time is only valid for each multiple of 15. So: To get the actual sun time for the longitude I am at I will need to know how far off I am from the mean median of that time zone and subtract/add from/to the displayed local time 4 minutes per degree or 30 seconds per km. I hope I am correct so far or else I'll trade this VIIB for a moped. The further north and off the Greenwich median I go, the worse the discrepancy between calculated sunrise hour and actual in game sunrise hour becomes. The parallel longitude lines are the prime suspect as the warping to fit the cylinder world would get worse the farther from Equator I get. It would be good for a laugh to see what the game would suggest to be local time at E 60 N 89* What I could need it seems, is the maths to convert in game long/lat positions on planet Cylinder Prime to actual long/lat positions of Planet Earth that would give me the correct hours. I am a bit at loss how to go about that other than spending a few weeks real time mapping the GMT time when the sun is at its highest position. The visual warping in the optics does not help either.

08-03-12, 08:53 AM	#7
Von Due Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,690 Downloads: 30 Uploads: 0	On one of the last test runs I will do, it seems, the in game sunrise hour happened at calculated sunrise hour for a position 258-230 km west of my position, ingame sunset happened at calculated hour for a position 274-302 km east of my position. This makes no sense at all. No time zone or mismatching ship/local/GMT time can explain that as far as I'm aware. I will do one last attempt, going to various positions at a few constant latitudes to see if the offsets show any pattern, then at a few constant longitudes. Unless I can find that pattern, I will say the game runs a sun cycle of its own creation.