Unnarmed 17 year old shot dead "in self defence"

[CaptainHaplo]

He has been charged with 2nd Degree Murder.

In other words, non-premeditated murder. Max life sentence.

No telling if the judge will allow for lesser charges to be considered by the jury.... If so he gets convicted of a lesser charge - if not - he gets off.

Reasonable doubt exists as to the circumstances - and his injuries, along with witness testimony, give credibility to who started the fight. Given that he was seen on the ground with Martin on top of him - there is "reasonable doubt" easily found to let him walk on self defence if the only choice is murder 2.

I strongly hope that the judge allows lesser charges be considered as well.

[Platapus]

This is good news. This is why we have courts -- to determine, from a legal standpoint, what happened.

Thanks to the media the jury pool will be rather shallow.

[soopaman2]

Originally Posted by Platapus

This is good news. This is why we have courts -- to determine, from a legal standpoint, what happened.

Thanks to the media the jury pool will be rather shallow.

But without the media this would have been swept under the rug by daddy Judge, as was initially attempted. (Basis of a free media amendment, to prevent the well connected from victimizing the citizens)

That being said murder 2 is a bit over the top. I would go for a manslaughter 3 degree, as I do not think Zimmerman went into this wanting to kill him a colored boy.

Vigilantism should not be encouraged.

I am encouraged by the lack of hairtrigger "ban guns" comments that accompany stories like this in other forums.

[Platapus]

In looking at the Florida Statutes both Manslaughter and Murder in the Third Degree (they are different in Florida) don't seem to apply. While at first I also thought that Murder in the Second Degree was too much, It does appear to be the appropriate charge. Florida's homicide crimes are not the same as in other states.

It will be an interesting trial if it ever gets to that point.

[soopaman2]

Originally Posted by Platapus

In looking at the Florida Statutes both Manslaughter and Murder in the Third Degree (they are different in Florida) don't seem to apply. While at first I also thought that Murder in the Second Degree was too much, It does appear to be the appropriate charge. Florida's homicide crimes are not the same as in other states.

It will be an interesting trial if it ever gets to that point.

After the Casey Anthony case I have zero faith in Florida. The fact that Zimmerman has been villainized may work out in his advantage. And the fact that Florida prosecuters are hairbrained, twitch reaction bumpkins will also work out in his favor. I hope they actually built a case this time.

Don't worry Trayvon haters, your pistolero-gun-hero will get off. This is Florida...

The young adult deserves justice. (edit: But Zim deserves his day in court too)

[Ducimus]

You know, it occurs to me with all the hype and attention this is getting, (even here, 26, going on 27 pages), and in terms of attention and hype, I'm just going to start making comparisons to this:

[August]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

I'm just going to start making comparisons to this:

I've always said it was OJ's kid that done the deed.

[Bubblehead1980]

Ah, sad that this "special prosecutor" appointed to appease the ignorant masses, made the political decision instead of following the law.Now a man has been arrested without cause under the law. I have faith he will be cleared but under Florida law, he should not have been arrested at all.Really is a travesty that they bowed to the ignorance of Sharpton, Jackson etc etc.

[Sailor Steve]

There it is again: "I'm right and you're stupid." No discussion, no analysis, just opinion presented as fact.

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

There it is again: "I'm right and you're stupid." No discussion, no analysis, just opinion presented as fact.

Why bother? Some people are too far gone to try and talk sense to.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

There it is again: "I'm right and you're stupid." No discussion, no analysis, just opinion presented as fact.

Because it is a simple case under Florida Law, there is no cause for an arrest, which is why the Police(even thought one Detective wanted to arrest him) did not arrest him, they followed the LAW not their feelings.The SAO did not arrest him for the same reason.Now, after the ignorant ones got involved, screamed for a month etc A "special prosecutor" ignores the law and charges Zimmerman with second degree murder?? This lady did not take the case to the Grand Jury because she knew they would not indict him based on the evidence, because it supports Zimmerman.

Facts that have come to light supported by evidence:

Zimmerman was on the phone with the police, they told him to no longer follow Trayvon.Zimmerman says he turned around, and his behavior on the phone matches this story, as he talked to the dispatcher for over another minute and said he wanted to meet with the Police.This is consistent with Zimmerman walking back to his car as said, not pursuing Trayvon. Zimmerman did nothing that could be considered provocation.Moments after hanging up the phone, Zimmerman says Trayvon confronted him and attacked him.A witness saw this, called 911 and that is when the gunshot was heard during this call.The witness stated that Trayvon was on top of Zimmerman beating him.There are screams that are most likely Zimmerman as it is doubtful Trayvon was screaming for help while he is on top beating someone and slamming their head into the pavement.Trayvon was shot while on top of Zimmerman, one time.

Zimmerman suffered a broken nose and head injuries to the back of his head.Police report stated he had grass stains on his clothing.Between the physical evidence, and witness statement, Zimmerman's version is the truth of what happened.Make much more sense than the spin the media tried and some are still trying to put on this.

Now, no one being honest could say Zimmerman was not covered under stand your ground, clear cut case of self defense.This special prosecutor however is your typical self righteous prosecutor who thinks she is on some moral crusade, she forgets her job is to find the truth and uphold the law.I say this because she has a reputation in Florida not as a great lawyer, but more as a zealot.I read a statement of hers in some article where she says she only cares about the "victims", meaning to hell with the law and the rights of others, just those labeled the "victims", reminds me of Janet Reno in some ways as it turns out she put quite a few innocent people in jail who were later cleared.

The law protects Zimmerman but now this "SP" has allowed politics to enter into her decision and is abusing her power.Kind of like the casey anthony case, they sensed an easy win and went right for the throat with a 1st degree murder charge based on crappy evidence, politics influencing their decisions instead of rationality and the law.I believe it will work out for Zimmerman, but the travesty is he should not even have been arrested.Really a shame the ignorant masses can spur the government into action when its not needed.

[Ghostturd]

...

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Really a shame the ignorant masses can spur the government into action when its not needed.

And it's comments like that which get you laughed at. You may well be right; I don't know. Your opinions are as valid as anyone else's. The problem is your absolute conviction. It's not the fault of "the ignorant masses". When you use words like that you set yourself up as better than the rest of us, and it's obvious from your posting habits that you're less thoughtful and analytical than most. That's the problem I continue to have with you. As I said, you never discuss, or even debate. You preach, as if your words are the final authority.

[Takeda Shingen]

Don't get me started on the ignorant masses. I have to read their posts every day; with the same old one side against the other and the predictable knee-jerk responses all while pumping themselves up to be the ultimate authority on all matters while they demean and brow-beat anyone who has the audacity to disagree.

[soopaman2]

In an above post I stated vigilantism should not be encouraged.

Just to be clear I mean it on both sides.

My cousin made a point to me that alot of this reminds him of accused murderer in an old Wild West town, and how lynch mobs would hang the accused before a fair trial.

The blacks need to seriously calm down. (just saying)

This is not a case of racism, but a case of vigilante justice. A gun hero, who should not have a gun, and a dead kid with race on his side.

2 white guys in Arkansas and no one would give a hoot. 2 black guys in Detroit or South Central LA and no one would care. 2 Mexicans in East LA, same thing, who cares?

The only reason I consider Zimmerman wrong is because he pursued the conflict. He was the cause, to the sad effect.

But there is a such thing as justice, and an established law system, and my above statement is simply my moral opinion.