Are you part of the 53%?

[CCIP]

I actually think both the 53% and the 99% (and the 1% and every other %) are an utterly moronic sloganization campaign that instantly takes away all credibility from these movements. The moment you start speaking for a % number, you're actually delegating your right to speak for yourself. And that's a terrible waste.

So, I delegate my further input on this matter to Sailor Steve's forum signature! (no, really, it's getting at exactly my problem with this whole % thing)

[geetrue]

I am 99.9% sure that someone is wrong on this percent stuff

It's like so easy to arrest the organizers and hold them personaly responcible for no viloence in a peaceful assembly.

Put up a bond and be willing to pay for any expenses your rally causes

[Krauter]

Did you know that 87% of facts, statistics and percentages on the Internet are made up?

[MothBalls]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

These "53%" have never heard of the payroll, sales or excise taxes that the rest of those that supposedly "don't pay taxes" you know, um, actually pay?

Guess what, you ignorant dips? http://actuallyyourethe47percent.tumblr.com/

You're missing the point, for one. Two, you picked the wrong person to tell they don't know about paying taxes, I own a small business. Might not be a fortune 500 company, but I've had over 20 people on my payroll at one time. So don't even begin to tell me about what you think I know or don't know, especially when it comes to paying taxes. Please don't get me started.

There's a lot of things I'm unhappy with. My unemployment insurance premium went up 8% to cover an extension for the unemployed. My answer to that is "if you pay people to not work, they won't". Want to help them get jobs? Quit cutting the checks, trust me, they'll look harder.

Health insurance, bailouts, economics, sure a lot of things suck right now. But don't blame 1% of the population for all of it. There are many other factors.

Originally Posted by CCIP

I actually think both the 53% and the 99% (and the 1% and every other %) are an utterly moronic sloganization campaign that instantly takes away all credibility from these movements. The moment you start speaking for a % number, you're actually delegating your right to speak for yourself. And that's a terrible waste.

So, I delegate my further input on this matter to Sailor Steve's forum signature! (no, really, it's getting at exactly my problem with this whole % thing)

See that's the point. The 99% who claim to be representing 99% of the population, aren't. The 53% group are there to tell them don't speak for me (us) because I've worked my ass off to get to where I am and I don't blame anyone for it. Don't blame your lot in life on the 1%. Times are tough, life sucks, drive on.

Originally Posted by Krauter

Did you know that 87% of facts, statistics and percentages on the Internet are made up?

I think you just made that up, cause I read it was more like 78%.

This is another Joe not the plumber happening where this "mr. I work 3 jobs" turned out to be a Republican journalist working one actual job but calling it three.

[AVGWarhawk]

Who is this Joe the Plumber?

[JU_88]

The top 1 % are not neccesarily evil greedy monsters. look at the charity work of Bill gates for example.
If you offered a person who despise the 1% a chance to join the 1% I doubt many would refuse based on principle.

The wall street protesters are not united in their beliefs, some are just anti captialst jumping on the band wagon, others are lazy freeloaders.
But the 56% are sorley mistaken if thats what they think the protest is about.

Alot of the portesters are genuinely concerned and about the amount of power and influence that has now been aquired by banks and co-operations, and that it had gone too far- which it has.
There is nothing wrong with having a successful enterprise or business. the problem is that many of them are now above the law and are infulencing goverment legistlation with cash - not ballots.

The top banks now have more power, wealth and influence than the US government itself.
Some thing is horribly wrong with that. in any country the Goverment should be at the very top of the heirachy, in America they are not.

They sold you out, the bail outs are proof of this - and now some people are angry.

Who is this Joe the Plumber?

A journalist called Erickson

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by JU_88

the problem is that many of them are now above the law and are infulencing goverment legistlation with cash - not ballots.

The top banks now have more power, wealth and influence than the US government itself.

Has there ever been a time when this was not true in the US? Being a student of 19th century history, I would say this has been pretty common for about 200 years. Compared with the 19th century, things are actually a little better now than back then.

Not that I am happy with this situation. But I wanted to point out that this is hardly a new situation.

I think I am part of the 99.9% who wish for the best, prepare for the worst and just keep on working hard every day getting through life.

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by JU_88

The top 1 % are not neccesarily evil greedy monsters. look at the charity work of Bill gates for example.
If you offered a person who despise the 1% a chance to join the 1% I doubt many would refuse based on principle.

The wall street protesters are not united in their beliefs, some are just anti captialst jumping on the band wagon, others are lazy freeloaders.
But the 56% are sorley mistaken if thats what they think the protest is about.

Alot of the portesters are genuinely concerned and about the amount of power and influence that has now been aquired by banks and co-operations, and that it had gone too far- which it has.
There is nothing wrong with having a successful enterprise or business. the problem is that many of them are now above the law and are infulencing goverment legistlation with cash - not ballots.

The top banks now have more power, wealth and influence than the US government itself.
Some thing is horribly wrong with that. in any country the Goverment should be at the very top of the heirachy, in America they are not.

They sold you out, the bail outs are proof of this - and now some people are angry.

I like the way you put this.

I just wish we could settle this whole tax debate with everyone pays a flat percentage on their income, period. No deductions, no write offs, no wiggle room. Just 12% comes out and goes to Washington. Then we would all be part of the 99% and no one could say "He isn't doing as much as me" or "I'm doing more than him".

Each man gets one vote, each man should pay the same percentage in taxes.

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by JU_88

The top 1 % are not neccesarily evil greedy monsters. look at the charity work of Bill gates for example.
If you offered a person who despise the 1% a chance to join the 1% I doubt many would refuse based on principle.

The wall street protesters are not united in their beliefs, some are just anti captialst jumping on the band wagon, others are lazy freeloaders.
But the 56% are sorley mistaken if thats what they think the protest is about.

Alot of the portesters are genuinely concerned and about the amount of power and influence that has now been aquired by banks and co-operations, and that it had gone too far- which it has.
There is nothing wrong with having a successful enterprise or business. the problem is that many of them are now above the law and are infulencing goverment legistlation with cash - not ballots.

The top banks now have more power, wealth and influence than the US government itself.
Some thing is horribly wrong with that. in any country the Goverment should be at the very top of the heirachy, in America they are not.

They sold you out, the bail outs are proof of this - and now some people are angry.

Very, very well said.

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by MothBalls

Two, you picked the wrong person to tell they don't know about paying taxes,

I was addressing the folks on that website, and not you. I apologize for being unclear on that. I try not to personally attack any member here. Again, that is my mistake.

The fact remains though, that this "47% of people don't pay taxes" meme is a blatant misrepresentation of the situation. Everyone who legally earns money or purchases anything in this country pays taxes.

There's a lot of things I'm unhappy with. My unemployment insurance premium went up 8% to cover an extension for the unemployed. My answer to that is "if you pay people to not work, they won't". Want to help them get jobs? Quit cutting the checks, trust me, they'll look harder.

By and large, most people on unemployment would rather be employed. And cutting off unemployment benefits to everyone would be an unmitigated disaster. You think the economy is bad now? Think about how bad it would be with people starving and dying in the streets. Think of the crime rates that would skyrocket as people turned to robbery as a means of survival. Think about the loss in GDP that would occur if all a sudden every person receiving unemployment benefits suddenly had no money to spend. Unemployment is a form of social insurance that we have deemed as preferable to the situation I've just described.

Health insurance, bailouts, economics, sure a lot of things suck right now. But don't blame 1% of the population for all of it. There are many other factors.

This is true. But the current economic climate was caused in large part by the excesses of Wall Street.

See that's the point. The 99% who claim to be representing 99% of the population, aren't.

Nobody is claiming that at all. You've completely misunderstood. You are the 99% unless your income puts you in the top 1% of wage earners in this country. Like it or not, you're the 99%.

The 53% group are there to tell them don't speak for me (us) because I've worked my ass off to get to where I am and I don't blame anyone for it. Don't blame your lot in life on the 1%. Times are tough, life sucks, drive on.

All the 99% movement is doing is drawing attention to the fact that the game is rigged and the deck is stacked against those that are trying to "drive on."

Originally Posted by MothBalls

My favorite posting on the 53% website;

"Blaming Wall Street for your financial shortcomings is like blaming Beyonce for your inability to sing."

And my favorite response:

"No dude, it's more like if Beyonce's vocal chords only still worked cause the federal government gave her trillions of dollars for throat surgery and then a few months after that she went on TV and was like "Wow, why are so many people angry about this? You must all be jealous. You guys should have spent more time practicing singing.""

[tater]

The subject is if they pay INCOME TAX. So payroll taxes are off-subject. As are sales taxes. We all pay those. Anyone not paying net income taxes doesn't have any ground to stand on to complain about anything.

In addition, those that don't pay income tax get a far better return on their payroll taxes than those that subsidize them do since the income levels that don't pay taxes have higher SS rates of return. They also use more government services, whereas I use virtually none aimed just at me (only roads, defense, etc—heck, we don't even use the school system, my kids go to private school).

For SS, the net benefit to taxes paid ratio gets pretty ugly at the point you make enough to pay real income tax (any lifetime average income much over 35k and your net is negative).

So FICA is a good investment for the poor, and a redistributive tax for anyone else.

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by tater

The subject is if they pay INCOME TAX.

So when people say that they don't pay taxes, you just keep narrowing the definition of "taxes" until you're right.

[Krauter]

Originally Posted by MothBalls

I think you just made that up, cause I read it was more like 78%.

How do I know you're telling the truth? How do I know if I'm telling the truth!? It's a conspiracy I tells ya!