Deck gun or Torpedo - Page 2

JazzJR · 10-03-11, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desirableroasted

Yeah, well, is he playing GWX?

I think he has more knowledge about it then we all together.

sharkbit · 10-03-11, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by papa_smurf

Wait till Merchants are armed, then come back and tell us how it went using your deckgun

+1

I've since unbolted mine from my sub and placed it in the flotilla commander's front yard with flowers sticking out of the barrel.

Waste of time and space later in the war.

I seem to remember reading in the second volume of Clay Blair's book "Hitler's U-Boat War" that the IX's kept their guns throughout the war but the VII's weren't produced with them late in the war.

soopaman2 · 10-03-11, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desirableroasted

Yeah, well, is he playing GWX?

I'd be willing to bet he had his fill of submarine adventures. After all a depth charge attack was alot more "real" for him than us.

He would make a kick-butt modder for this game, talk about realism!

JazzJR · 10-03-11, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharkbit

member reading in the second volume of Clay Blair's book "Hitler's U-Boat War" that the IX's kept their guns throughout the war but the VII's weren't produced with them late in the war.

All submarines in the baltic sea were fitted with deckguns, and also some of the most decorated commanders were allowed to keep their guns. All others were removed.

Sailor Steve · 10-03-11, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazzJR

Reinhard Hardegen used the deck gun very often.

And he survived the war and is still living. You could ask him.

Really? Are you sure? Okay, let's check the records.

Augvald: 1 torpedo.
Ganda: 2 torpedoes, finished off with deck gun.
P.L.M. 22: 1 torpedo.
Oberon: 1 torpedo.
Rio Azul: 1 torpedo.
Auditor: 1 torpedo.
Aurania: 2 torpedoes.
Cyclops: 2 torpedoes.
Norness: 3 torpedoes.
Coimbra: 2 torpedoes.
Norvana: 1 torpedo.
City of Atlanta: 1 torpedo.
Malay: Attacked with deck gun, finally hit with 1 torpedo. Malay survived the attack.
Ciltvaira: 1 torpedo.
Culebra: Deck gun. Culebra fired back, resulting in five hits on U-123, any one of which could have killed the gun crew or Hardegen himself. I'm not an expert, but I'd say this makes him both foolish and lucky.
Pan Norway: Deck gun (out of torpedoes).
Muskogee: 1 torpedo.
Empire Steel: 2 torpedoes. Deck gun fired at burning wreck to hasten demise.
USS Atik (Q-ship): 2 torpedoes. Ship stopped by 1 torpedo. Attempt to finish target with deck gun resulted in 1 man killed on U-123. Ship finished by second torpedo.
Liebre: Deck gun.
Oklahoma: 1 torpedo.
Esso Baton Rouge: 1 torpedo.
Esparta: 1 torpedo.
Gulfamerica: 1 torpedo. Finished with deck gun.
Leslie: 1 torpedo. The last one.
Korsholm: Deck Gun. Out of torpedoes.
Alcoa Guide: Deck Gun. Out of torpedoes.

So, out of 21 ships sunk, only 4 were sunk solely with the deck gun, and 3 of those were because he was out of torpedoes. Hardly "very often". He also suffered damage twice while using the gun, and was lucky he didn't lose his life in the process.
http://uboat.net/men/hardegen.htm

JazzJR · 10-03-11, 02:04 PM

So it is better to have and use a Deckgun, so you can sink ships, even if you're out of torpedos. I won't waste a torpedo on a small sailing ship.

Sailor Steve · 10-03-11, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazzJR

So it is better to have and use a Deckgun, so you can sink ships, even if you're out of torpedos. I won't waste a torpedo on a small sailing ship.

Nor would I. I just don't make it my primary weapon, unless the target is small and undefended.

JazzJR · 10-03-11, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Nor would I. I just don't make it my primary weapon, unless the target is small and undefended.

Thats what i am talking about. But in 1941 there is no unarmed ship anymore.

Sailor Steve · 10-03-11, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazzJR

Thats what i am talking about. But in 1941 there is no unarmed ship anymore.

Then the deck gun isn't good for much except a coup-des-gras.

Fish In The Water · 10-03-11, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazzJR

All submarines in the baltic sea were fitted with deckguns, and also some of the most decorated commanders were allowed to keep their guns. All others were removed.

Too bad the game doesn't model the benefits of not having one installed. Less drag resulting in a slight increase in speed (even just a knot) would be nice.

Missing Name · 10-03-11, 06:54 PM

I am among those who consider the deck gun to be my primary weapon. This is a WWII sim and not a WWI sim, though. I suppose I've just had plenty of practice with the darned thing.

Angelo Cire · 10-04-11, 02:03 AM

I feel as though the game allows you to be far more accurate with the deck gun than seas would have permitted. Land-based guns didn't have to worry about the pitch and roll of the boat, so extremely long ranges would be far more feasible.

You can, with practice, lob rounds well over 2 or 3 km, which would have been (I imagine) extremely hard to do on even very calm seas with any accuracy.

Fish In The Water · 10-04-11, 04:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angelo Cire

I feel as though the game allows you to be far more accurate with the deck gun than seas would have permitted.

Perhaps...

In my case though I generally end up manning the gun myself as even when I have 'trained' personnel at the station half the shots end up hitting the ocean.

Sailor Steve · 10-04-11, 11:41 AM

I said I believe the deck gun was only used to finish off cripples, or against very small targets. So I just encountered four merchants in the space of a little over one day. Two went down with one torpedo each. When the weather cleared up I sank the other two with the deck gun. The 105 is nice!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish In The Water

Perhaps...

In my case though I generally end up manning the gun myself as even when I have 'trained' personnel at the station half the shots end up hitting the ocean.

Which is correct. Naval gunnery is the most imprecise of sciences, and the historical hit rate in WW2 was about 7% overall, with long-range gunnery dropping to 2% and close-range fire being about 12%. The game lets the player be far too accurate.

desirableroasted · 10-04-11, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

The game lets the player be far too accurate.

At least GWX takes down the power of the deck gun a few notches. In stock, that is one hell of a gun.

10-03-11, 02:04 PM	#21
JazzJR Lieutenant Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Germany - Berlin Posts: 263 Downloads: 98 Uploads: 0	So it is better to have and use a Deckgun, so you can sink ships, even if you're out of torpedos. I won't waste a torpedo on a small sailing ship. __________________

10-03-11, 06:54 PM	#26
Missing Name Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Westun New Yahk Posts: 748 Downloads: 131 Uploads: 0	I am among those who consider the deck gun to be my primary weapon. This is a WWII sim and not a WWI sim, though. I suppose I've just had plenty of practice with the darned thing. __________________ Largest target sunk with deck gun: Japanese auxiliary cruiser, 15000 tons Largest engaged: HMS Nelson. Results inconclusive. Read Brag's stuff

10-04-11, 02:03 AM	#27
Angelo Cire Swabbie Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: SF Posts: 13 Downloads: 12 Uploads: 0	I feel as though the game allows you to be far more accurate with the deck gun than seas would have permitted. Land-based guns didn't have to worry about the pitch and roll of the boat, so extremely long ranges would be far more feasible. You can, with practice, lob rounds well over 2 or 3 km, which would have been (I imagine) extremely hard to do on even very calm seas with any accuracy. __________________ Tauchen, Volle Fahrt voraus! Type VIIB U-83, Flotilla Saltzwedel, Wilhelmshaven. Sept. 6, 1939. Angelo Schilling.