9/11 anniversary: Attacks made US stronger, Obama says

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

How much of this stuff can you actually watch?

Umm, none? Families of the fallen can memorialize, but I'm just hanging out.

Originally Posted by Iceman

Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it.

Georges Santayana. As has been pointed out, there is a big difference between remembering the past, and learning the lesson, and just morbidly dwelling on it.

Love it or Leave it...

People like to put down the hippies, but in the '60s, when "America - love it or leave it!" was the catch-phrase of the day, they came up with one that was equally valid: "America - change it or lose it!"

[August]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

People like to put down the hippies, but in the '60s, when "America - love it or leave it!" was the catch-phrase of the day, they came up with one that was equally valid: "America - change it or lose it!"

The problem with catch phrases is they are always too vague.

For instance love what about America? That we enjoy a higher standard of living and personal liberty that anywhere else? If a person hates that then I hope the door does hit them on the butts on their way out.

On the other side of the coin "change it" means many things to different people. The hippies themselves couldn't agree on what to change. Personally I am kind of leery about changing a society that has served us pretty well for the past two centuries. We stand to loose an awful lot if one of these ill conceived social experiments go wrong.

[Crécy]

Originally Posted by August

That we enjoy a higher standard of living and personal liberty that anywhere else?

Than anywhere else? Hardly.

[JU_88]

Originally Posted by Crécy

Than anywhere else? Hardly.

Yeah - I picked up on that one too , I'd like to think that he merely meant it as a rough example rather than literally.
(Unless he has somehow managed to live in all the developed nations accross the world for several years each)

[danlisa]

I have to agree with Privateer to some extent.

I find it quite laughable that in the wake of 9/11 the world went to war to 'protect our freedom' when in actuality our own countries have done more to erode our freedom than some foreign lands occupants.

Unfortunately it's never going to go back to the way it was. Now they have the 'power' over us, they will be reluctant to relinquish it.

[JU_88]

You know what I find most horrific
The 9/11 commission was given $15 million (and they had to beg for most of it). while cost of the Lewinsky investigation was $30 million.
Priorities.....

[mookiemookie]

What I found ghoulish and inappropriate were all the 9/11 themed commercials during the football games yesterday. Using a tragedy in an attempt to advertise your company as patriotic and benevolent is just plain exploitative. State Farm, Southwest Airlines and Budweiser were the ones I can remember offhand.

Pure crass marketing and a slap in the face to the people who lost loved ones that day.

[Alex]

Originally Posted by danlisa

I find it quite laughable that in the wake of 9/11 the world went to war to 'protect our freedom' when in actuality our own countries have done more to erode our freedom than some foreign lands occupants.

A few centuries ago, someone from this continent (?!) said that any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.

At least they know they head toward their fall.

[MH]

Originally Posted by Alex

A few centuries ago, someone from this continent (?!) said that any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.

At least they know they head toward their fall.

Is that your wishful thinking or analysis of situation?

What MH wrote was clearly a patriotic statement

Good one...actually i get paid to write pro American.
As far as freedom and way of life its a matter of taste for me.
I'm not American or EU.

[August]

Originally Posted by Alex

A few centuries ago, someone from this continent (?!) said that any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.

At least they know they head toward their fall.

It was Benjamin Frankin and the actual quote is:

"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."

An earlier variation of his that always intrigued me is:

"Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power"

[August]

Originally Posted by Crécy

Than anywhere else? Hardly.

Believe what you want but i'd match our standard of living over the past two hundred years with that of any other countries.

[Crécy]

Originally Posted by August

Believe what you want but i'd match our standard of living over the past two hundred years with that of any other countries.

Now you match your standard of living with any other country? Yet a moment ago you claimed that you have a higher standard of living than any other country.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Crécy

Now you match your standard of living with any other country? Yet a moment ago you claimed that you have a higher standard of living than any other country.

Translation misunderstanding. In this case "match" equals "compare", and his meaning is the same.

Translation misunderstanding. In this case "match" equals "compare", and his meaning is the same.

So all thats needed is any one of the dozens of examples from any one of the hundreds of tables that do the comparisons and simply pick any of the numerous countries that top the US.

[Crécy]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Translation misunderstanding. In this case "match" equals "compare", and his meaning is the same.

I see. Thank you for clarification.

Anyway, debating over this matter is quite futile. August seems to look the world through red-white-blue glasses so unless he doesn't take them off, this is a fruitless discussion.