Sonar used in WW2.

BogdaNz · 08-21-11, 12:01 AM

I remeber read somewhere,that the sonar was ineffective at excesive speed of 12-13 knots. So that always destroyes had less that 12 knots to detect submarine
Is this true ?

Sailor Steve · 08-21-11, 12:11 AM

I've read that as well, yet there doesn't seem to be a definitive answer that I can find now. I've also read that by 1945 the US and UK had upped the usable speed to 18 knots. Can't find solid evidence of either one now.

Captain Nemo · 08-25-11, 09:31 AM

This document might be of interest http://traktoria.org/files/sonar/son...104_(1946).pdf

Nemo

Jimbuna · 08-25-11, 10:40 AM

Nice find

Sailor Steve · 08-25-11, 10:40 AM

"Might be..."? That's fascinating! Thanks for the link.

Early on the document talks about streamlined sonar domes upping the effective speed from 10 to 15 knots, but while it implies this happening prior to the US entry into the war it doesn't give specific dates for the actual adoption of the equipment, or for the British development of it.

It also claims that we were detecting surfaced submarines, and I've never heard that claimed anywhere. It would be interesting to find out more about this.

Osmium Steele · 08-25-11, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

It also claims that we were detecting surfaced submarines, and I've never heard that claimed anywhere.

Not sure about american sonar, but ASDIC could not detect a surfaced submarine. I've seen numerous references to that fact from both british and german sources.

Captain Nemo · 08-26-11, 02:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

"Might be..."? That's fascinating! Thanks for the link.

Glad you found it a fascinating read.

Nemo

theroc44 · 08-26-11, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osmium Steele

Not sure about american sonar, but ASDIC could not detect a surfaced submarine. I've seen numerous references to that fact from both british and german sources.

Ive read that as well, "hitlers uboat war" Hardcover says that in there.

theroc44 · 08-26-11, 02:30 AM

does anyone know if any U-boats or any sub for that matter, that operated in the atlantic that were lost to hurricanes off of africa or the atlantic? Im battening down the hatches here in NYC for irene and got me thinking did any subs get caught in the "perfect storm" after all past and present naval warfare.

Jimbuna · 08-26-11, 05:14 AM

I can't say definitively (no references where I'm currently located) but I do belive the odd boat may have floundered/succumbed to extremely inclement weather.

The usual practice was to dive and wait out the storm, the practice was also useful because it rested the majority of the crew and gave them the chance to have an uninterrupted meal.

difool2 · 08-26-11, 12:35 PM

Fair warning to those who read the above and thought that any escort running above 12/18 knots can't hear you in the sim...well they can.

Sailor Steve · 08-26-11, 03:03 PM

Of course they can. That's why we discuss the reality - so we can bring out the flaws and talk about what's wrong with the game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by difool2

...the sim...

And that's why it's not a sim, but just a game.

Sailor Steve · 08-26-11, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbuna

I can't say definitively (no references where I'm currently located) but I do belive the odd boat may have floundered/succumbed to extremely inclement weather.

I've not heard of any, because they usually tethered the watch crew and kept the hatch closed. Of course there was the one boat in which the replacement watch went to the bridge to find no one there. They had all been washed overboard.

Jimbuna · 08-26-11, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

I've not heard of any, because they usually tethered the watch crew and kept the hatch closed. Of course there was the one boat in which the replacement watch went to the bridge to find no one there. They had all been washed overboard.

Yep....U-106

U-106, 23 Oct 1941
An incredibly sad event befell U-106 on this date. When the replacement watch opened the tower hatch in rough seas they found out that the entire previous tower watch of 4 men had been washed overboard. [Oberleutnant zur See Werner Grüneberg, Fähnrich zur See Herbert von Bruchhausen, Oberbootsmannmaat Karl Heemann, Matrose Ewald Brühl]

theroc44 · 08-26-11, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbuna

Yep....U-106

U-106, 23 Oct 1941
An incredibly sad event befell U-106 on this date. When the replacement watch opened the tower hatch in rough seas they found out that the entire previous tower watch of 4 men had been washed overboard. [Oberleutnant zur See Werner Grüneberg, Fähnrich zur See Herbert von Bruchhausen, Oberbootsmannmaat Karl Heemann, Matrose Ewald Brühl]

Sounds like a massive rogue wave..sad indeed

08-21-11, 12:01 AM	#1
BogdaNz Loader Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 83 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 0	Sonar used in WW2. I remeber read somewhere,that the sonar was ineffective at excesive speed of 12-13 knots. So that always destroyes had less that 12 knots to detect submarine Is this true ? __________________

08-21-11, 12:11 AM	#2
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	I've read that as well, yet there doesn't seem to be a definitive answer that I can find now. I've also read that by 1945 the US and UK had upped the usable speed to 18 knots. Can't find solid evidence of either one now. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

08-25-11, 09:31 AM	#3
Captain Nemo Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: London, England Posts: 1,144 Downloads: 54 Uploads: 0	This document might be of interest http://traktoria.org/files/sonar/son...104_(1946).pdf Nemo __________________ "I'm afraid there is no disguising the fact that King's obsession with the Pacific and the Battle of Washington cost us dear in the Battle of the Atlantic". Sir John Slessor GCB, DSO, MC, DL AOC-in-C Coastal Command RAF ___________________________________________

08-25-11, 10:40 AM	#4
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,788 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	Nice find __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

08-25-11, 10:40 AM	#5
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	"Might be..."? That's fascinating! Thanks for the link. Early on the document talks about streamlined sonar domes upping the effective speed from 10 to 15 knots, but while it implies this happening prior to the US entry into the war it doesn't give specific dates for the actual adoption of the equipment, or for the British development of it. It also claims that we were detecting surfaced submarines, and I've never heard that claimed anywhere. It would be interesting to find out more about this. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

08-26-11, 02:30 AM	#9
theroc44 Lieutenant Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: New York City Posts: 261 Downloads: 101 Uploads: 0	does anyone know if any U-boats or any sub for that matter, that operated in the atlantic that were lost to hurricanes off of africa or the atlantic? Im battening down the hatches here in NYC for irene and got me thinking did any subs get caught in the "perfect storm" after all past and present naval warfare. __________________ "A few stood against many that is all that matters"

08-26-11, 05:14 AM	#10
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,788 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	I can't say definitively (no references where I'm currently located) but I do belive the odd boat may have floundered/succumbed to extremely inclement weather. The usual practice was to dive and wait out the storm, the practice was also useful because it rested the majority of the crew and gave them the chance to have an uninterrupted meal. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

08-26-11, 12:35 PM	#11
difool2 Commander Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 459 Downloads: 31 Uploads: 0	Fair warning to those who read the above and thought that any escort running above 12/18 knots can't hear you in the sim...well they can.