[REL] Open Horizons II (old thread)

[gap]

Originally Posted by Zedi

There is a trick can be used, same as is for the french now... there is a roster entry called FreeFrench and they are set as allied. Same can happen with the polish, belgian and other occupied nations.

Good idea
I'm splitting those nations in two, i.e. Poland and FreePoland. Then, yo'll have the task to assign them the right kind of merchant/naval traffic in the right dates.

Originally Posted by Zedi

Anyway the defside.cfg need to be fixed because after 43 its not much accuracy because the stock game end in 43. And Poland is listed as axis until end of 45, which is wrong. Thats why I need you Gap to fix this cfg, please.

yes, I've tracked down several inacurracies, not only toward the end of the conflict. For instance, in the .cfg file that you sent to me most of the commonwealth nations are set to align on the Allied side on September 10th 1939. According to historical records this is true for Canada, but wrong for Australia (real date: Sept. 3), South Africa (Sept. 6), etc.
I am trying do correct these errors. I hope I can finish before tomorrow

[gap]

Originally Posted by Zedi

Gap, I added the following new entries in the roster. Please see if they are alright and if is anything to change.

[SideEntry 74]
Country=Egypt
Side=1
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 75]
Country=Turkey
Side=0
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 76]
Country=Algeria
Side=0
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19400623

[SideEntry 77]
Country=Algeria
Side=2
StartDate=19400624
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 78]
Country=Uruguay
Side=0
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 79]
Country=Venezuela
Side=0
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 80]
Country=Nicaragua
Side=0
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 81]
Country=Angola
Side=0
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 82]
Country=Namibia
Side=1
StartDate=19380101
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 83]
Country=Libia
Side=2
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 84]
Country=Morocco
Side=0
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 85]
Country=Morocco
Side=2
StartDate=19400625
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 86]
Country=Israel
Side=1
StartDate=19400625
EndDate=19451231

[SideEntry 87]
Country=Lebanon
Side=0
StartDate=19360101
EndDate=19411125

[SideEntry 88]
Country=Lebanon
Side=2
StartDate=19411126
EndDate=19451231

Okay,
I'll have a look into them once I finish with the stock nations, and then I'll append them in the same .cfg file.

[Zedi]

Originally Posted by gap

Good idea
I'm splitting those nations in two, i.e. Poland and FreePoland. Then, yo'll have the task to assign them the right kind of merchant/naval traffic in the right dates.

Free Poland will sail in convoys and Poland in the normal coasta traffic. But as far as I know, there were no polish ships in the convoys. But I found a lot of ships from Greece, Norway, Panama, Sweden. So I will need a "free" entry for these ones too. Im using Hague records for documentation over the ww2 convoys.

[gap]

Originally Posted by Zedi

Free Poland will sail in convoys and Poland in the normal coasta traffic. But as far as I know, there were no polish ships in the convoys. But I found a lot of ships from Greece, Norway, Panama, Sweden. So I will need a "free" entry for these ones too. Im using Hague records for documentation over the ww2 convoys.

According to the info that I was able collect from the net, Polish never surrendered formally to German (neither to Russian, for this matter) invaders. Hence, Germany could not issue any puppet government there and they ruled directly on the occupied Poland. As a consequence, I think that around Polish ports shipping traffic was made mostly of German (and other Axis nations's) ships, but it is reasonable that some ships kept sailing around Polish coastal waters under their national flag, just as you're suggesting.

As for "Free Poland" traffic, please read carefully this short article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_...ld_War_II#Navy

seems that most of Polish Navy was made up of ships provided by British after the beginning of the war. Polish were heavily invoved alongside Allied Navies both in convoys escorting and in task forces operations mostly in Atlantic Ocean, Baltic, North and Mediterranean Sea (notably they partecipated to the operation agaist German Carrier Bismarck!).
Besides this, according to the same article, Polish Merchant Fleet had an important role in the history of the conflict. Though, in wich convoys Polish merchants were found it is something out of my (limited) knowledge. I'll try to do so extra research on it if you're interested

[Zedi]

Im working on the Arctic Convoys campaign and followed very careful the PQ and JW convoys.. found only 1 ship. See here http://www.convoyweb.org.uk/russian/...ome.htm~rumain

Same apply for the Atlantic convoys. I can insert polish ships as many as I want, but I dont wanna hear later criticism about interpreting in my own way the history Anyway, I will use the freepolish ships, but not so many. Waiting four the cfg file so I can start working out the convoys. Thanks.

[gap]

Originally Posted by Zedi

Im working on the Arctic Convoys campaign and followed very careful the PQ and JW convoys.. found only 1 ship. See here http://www.convoyweb.org.uk/russian/...ome.htm~rumain

Same apply for the Atlantic convoys. I can insert polish ships as many as I want, but I dont wanna hear later criticism about interpreting in my own way the history Anyway, I will use the freepolish ships, but not so many. Waiting four the cfg file so I can start working out the convoys. Thanks.

yes, not so many of them and....
-if you like the idea- don't forget to put in also some FreePolish war ships/submarines as escorts or as memebers of mixed task forces. Getting historical info on them shoud be easier than for merchant fleet, as almost all of the naval units in service in the Polish Navy during WWII are listed in the wikipedia link that I posted before. If you click on their names you wil get a description of the most notable operations in wich each of them was involved, just for getting an idea on when and where (more or less) they should spawn in game.

...Still working on the .cfg file. As I told you I hope to send it to you before monday morning.

[tonschk]

Hello Zedi, thank you very much for this important Mod , I got some conflicts with JSGME when enabling this Mod (please see below) , can you please tell me in which order I need to enable this "das Campaign the SH5 campaignreworked" ?, thank you for your help


"Zones.cfg" has already been altered by the "FX_Update_0_0_16_2_ByTheDarkWraith" mod.
"Mare_Nostrum.pj" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"Common.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"GroupTypeDefs.cfg" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"GroupTypes.cfg" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"PlayerBases.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"PortTraffic_MN.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"Taskforces.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"Traffic.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"Uboats.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"waterPS.fx" has already been altered by the "Dynamic Environment SH5 Basemod (realistic version) V2.1" mod.
"Sh.sdl" has already been altered by the "FX_Update_0_0_16_2_ByTheDarkWraith" mod.

[Trevally.]

I like the new roster, good work guys

[Zedi]

Originally Posted by tonschk

Hello Zedi, thank you very much for this important Mod , I got some conflicts with JSGME when enabling this Mod (please see below) , can you please tell me in which order I need to enable this "das Campaign the SH5 campaignreworked" ?, thank you for your help


"Zones.cfg" has already been altered by the "FX_Update_0_0_16_2_ByTheDarkWraith" mod.
"Mare_Nostrum.pj" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"Common.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"GroupTypeDefs.cfg" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"GroupTypes.cfg" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"PlayerBases.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"PortTraffic_MN.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"Taskforces.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"Traffic.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"Uboats.mis" has already been altered by the "Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod_v1_2_1" mod.
"waterPS.fx" has already been altered by the "Dynamic Environment SH5 Basemod (realistic version) V2.1" mod.
"Sh.sdl" has already been altered by the "FX_Update_0_0_16_2_ByTheDarkWraith" mod.

Hard to answer.
Zones.cfg are compatible with FX and sh.sdl has the buoys sound. I say, you can overwrite FX.

waterPS.fx ... you can delete this file is not something critical.

Not sure whats this Terrain_harbour_flags_Mod and why has layers like uboats.mis etc. Anyway, this test mod contain only the Mare Nostrum campaign.. so I would say its safe to install last and remove it if you dont play MN anymore.

[tonschk]

Thank you Zedi

[PL_Andrev]

Originally Posted by gap

I'm splitting those nations in two, i.e. Poland and FreePoland. Then, yo'll have the task to assign them the right kind of merchant/naval traffic in the right dates.

You're wrong. This in no reason to split Polish to "Polish" and "Free Polish". As a our colleague told, there are no occupied Poland territory like Vichy's France or Quisling's Norvay.

Germany and the Soviet Union invaded, on September 1 and 17 respectively, their respective sides of Poland, dividing the country between them. The Soviet Union denied the idea of Polish behaviour in any shape, the Polish state was to be abolished once and for all, and the Polish territory completely annexed and incorporated by the two aggressors (the Third Reich and the USSR).

As you see the idea of "collaborated Polish units" is the capital crime for all polish players.

About polish navy units at IIWW:

Military - (all units at bottom section of this page, translated from polish wikipedia):
http://translate.google.pl/translate...i%2FORP_Conrad

Merchants - (all polish units during IIWW were military troop transports)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_Batory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_Pi%C5%82sudski
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_Chrobry
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Ko%C5%9Bciuszko
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Czar

[Sbygneus]

Originally Posted by gap

According to the info that I was able collect from the net, Polish never surrendered formally to German (neither to Russian, for this matter) invaders. Hence, Germany could not issue any puppet government there and they ruled directly on the occupied Poland. As a consequence, I think that around Polish ports shipping traffic was made mostly of German (and other Axis nations's) ships, but it is reasonable that some ships kept sailing around Polish coastal waters under their national flag, just as you're suggesting.

As for "Free Poland" traffic, please read carefully this short article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_...ld_War_II#Navy

seems that most of Polish Navy was made up of ships provided by British after the beginning of the war. Polish were heavily invoved alongside Allied Navies both in convoys escorting and in task forces operations mostly in Atlantic Ocean, Baltic, North and Mediterranean Sea (notably they partecipated to the operation agaist German Carrier Bismarck!).
Besides this, according to the same article, Polish Merchant Fleet had an important role in the history of the conflict. Though, in wich convoys Polish merchants were found it is something out of my (limited) knowledge. I'll try to do so extra research on it if you're interested

This is the list of Polish merchant ships I know, hit by U-boats in convoys:

PADEREWSKI motor merchant sunk 30 Dec 1942 by U-214 4,426 tons
ROZEWIE Motor merchant sunk 6 Aug 1942 by U-66 766 tons
WARSAW steam merchant sunk 26 Dec 1941 by U-559 2,487 tons
ZAGLOBA steam merchant sunk 6 Feb 1943 by U-262 2,864 tons
(straggler from convoy SC-118)

In another book I read that the only survivor from HMCS St.Croix town class destroyer was rescued by Polish merchant WISLA in 1943 convoy ON202

So there were some Polish merchant units by the 1939 in foreign ports, that later took part in convoys.

I hope it helps somehow

[Zedi]

Originally Posted by Sbygneus

...
In another book I read that the only survivor from HMCS St.Croix town class destroyer was rescued by Polish merchant WISLA in 1943 convoy ON202
...

No polish ship was sailing in ON 202. That convoy was the main target for Operation Leuthen, a mission I (re)created in Open Horizons. Here is the complete list af every ship from ON 202 http://www.convoyweb.org.uk/on/index.html From the left side menu choose ON 202 and see the details.

Hagues record is like a Bible for me, spent days in checking the convoys and Im pretty sure there was not much polish ships.. I remember seeing only once or twice polish ships and even those were joining the convoy for a short period of time. Mainly the ships from other nations than UK, CA and US were Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Greece and a LOT from Panama.

Actually Panama had an impressive merchants fleet that helped in carry supply to UK. Not sure if these ships were under the Panama government orders or only loaned ships, same as the greek ships where the greeks made huge fortunes by loaning their merchant fleets to the allied forces.. remember Onasis.

War is not only about killing and atrocities, but also a HUGE opportunity to exploit the pain and sufferings and get rich. Is why war is the most profitable business ever.

[THE_MASK]

Never noticed this before . Is it easy to use ?

[Zedi]

Is how you create convoys and traffic and control their content. For example, is how I create the new coastal traffic for the new nations.

Create a new group and call it TRAF_ES. Edit the group and from the roster choose Spain. Check only the merchants on the right side and at the Type use Generic if you want random merchants pulled into the group. Add them to the convoy and set the number of the ships. Play with the spawn rate if you want more randomness. Like... 1 Generic cargo 100% 1 Liberty cargo 50%

If you want to add escort, you add them to the escort section using the same way as you did for the merchants. You can mix these ship by adding more nations to a single convoy, but you have to be careful with their side. When don, Save then add this group to a generator in the editor and control their route with a mission. Check the [TEC] for working with ME, there is a lot of helpful info about working with ME.


Any news on reworking the terrain for Kiel?