Union Law in Wisconsin Blocked by Judge

[gimpy117]

Originally Posted by Aramike

Dude, REALLY?

The LAW is what makes it illegal for public sector employees in Wisconsin to strike. This isn't exactly classified information.

You're reminding me of a kid who's being told something he doesn't want to hear and just plugs his ears, screaming "BLAH BLAH BLAH". Are there any facts that you wish to contribute or are you more inclined to just assume everyone opposing your ideology just must be wrong?

well not that i won't believe you but i wanna see the law that says that first...I did a search and couldn't find anything.

[Aramike]

Originally Posted by gimpy117

well not that i won't believe you but i wanna see the law that says that first...I did a search and couldn't find anything.

Wisconsin State Statute 111.70.

And seriously - during the "sick out" every major media outlet pointed that out, because they were explaining as to why the teachers tried the "sick out" technique rather than a strike.

I'm shocked you missed it, unless you weren't interested in such facts...

[Aramike]

Actually, it's not illegal. You cannot be sent to jail or prison or arrested for striking in Wisconsin if you are a public worker. It's not a crime. You can only be discharged from your duties.

Yes it IS illegal.

There are plenty of things that are illegal but not criminal, and this is one of them. That's Lawyer 101. Perhaps you should brush up on the basics.

(Odd you didn't know that considering that practically the entire illegal immigrant debate's legal basis is the fact that an illegal immigrant, by being here, is not committing a crime.)

Furthermore, you're cherry picking the open meetings law. I'll just be patient and let the upcoming rulings explain specifically why you're wrong, as you're clearly choosing to ignore other points on the books ... which I've already presented.

[Stealth Hunter]

Originally Posted by Aramike

Yes it IS illegal.

There are plenty of things that are illegal but not criminal, and this is one of them. That's Lawyer 101. Perhaps you should brush up on the basics.

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/2011-...11_AB%2011.pdf

No, it is not. You can only be discharged from your duties if you are a public worker and go on a strike (that is, fail to report to work for three days straight and/or show a clear dereliction in your job's tasks which have been presented to you). It is not a crime, and you cannot be sent to jail or prison or even be arrested for it... you do know what a crime is, don't you? I guess not.

To use an excerpt from your earlier post:

You're reminding me of a kid who's being told something he doesn't want to hear and just plugs his ears, screaming "BLAH BLAH BLAH". Are there any facts that you wish to contribute or are you more inclined to just assume everyone opposing your ideology just must be wrong?

Originally Posted by Aramike

Furthermore, you're cherry picking the open meetings law.

Do tell how. I merely explained how Judge Sumi was correct in citing this portion of the OML and was also correct in her verdict that the state senate had violated it by not providing adequate notice as they are required to... and that, furthermore, it does not qualify for an exemption. Nothing more or less.

Originally Posted by Aramike

I'll just be patient and let the upcoming rulings explain specifically why you're wrong, as you're clearly choosing to ignore other points on the books ... which I've already presented.

By that, you mean you'll just ignore my points and the legitimate legal aspects of this case and continue to spout that atrocious rhetoric you call "points". You have posted 8 times in this thread, yet have presented no legal argument for your side and a counterargument against Judge Sumi, whereas I have taken the time and put forth the effort to do so for you in order to explain the legal background behind this case and how there are indeed issues to be had with how this bill was passed, both of which with regards to the OML (proving why it was, moreoever, illegal in the first place with regards to the notice).

By all means, do so. I'll more than gladly oblige you in the coming weeks.

[Aramike]

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/2011-...11_AB%2011.pdf

No, it is not. You can only be discharged from your duties if you are a public worker and go on a strike (that is, fail to report to work for three days straight and/or show a clear dereliction in your job's tasks which have been presented to you). It is not a crime, and you cannot be sent to jail or prison or even be arrested for it... you do know what a crime is, don't you? I guess not.

To use an excerpt from your earlier post:

You're reminding me of a kid who's being told something he doesn't want to hear and just plugs his ears, screaming "BLAH BLAH BLAH". Are there any facts that you wish to contribute or are you more inclined to just assume everyone opposing your ideology just must be wrong?

No, YOU don't know what a crime is. You should consult an attorney.

All things that are illegal are not crimes.

For instance, parking illegally in a handicapped zone is NOT a crime. Dude, this is basic stuff. It IS illegal, it IS punishable, but it is NOT a criminal violation.

[Stealth Hunter]

Originally Posted by Aramike

No, YOU don't know what a crime is. You should consult an attorney.

Such comments from ignorance are most pitiful. Let me put it to you in this fashion: how does striking in Wisconsin constitute a crime, as you claim? What are the civil punishments or charges, etc. that can be filed against a person?

Originally Posted by Aramike

All things that are illegal are not crimes.

If something is illegal in this sense, then it is prohibited by law. If you violate the law by doing something illegal, you are committing a crime (an act which is punishable for breaking the law).

I need to consult an attorney? YOU need to consult an attorney.

Originally Posted by Aramike

For instance, parking illegally in a handicapped zone is NOT a crime.

Actually, it constitutes a civil citation. You still are probably going to be fined and might have to appear in front of a court to pay that fine. It's not any different with speeding tickets. You won't have a criminal record, so long as you aren't a repeat offender, but you still will be punished, ergo it constitutes a crime.

Originally Posted by Aramike

Dude, this is basic stuff. It IS illegal, it IS punishable, but it is NOT a criminal violation.

For the third time, it is not illegal. You are not fined, you are not held in jail, you are not required to appear in front of a court... you are simply discharged from your duties as a public employee. The employee is given notice about the action and reasons are listed.

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/2011-...11_AB%2011.pdf

Originally Posted by Aramike

Abolsutely, 100% wrong.

http://legis.wisconsin.gov/spotlight/

The special session was called by Gov. Walker and is ongoing. Again, this is not classified information.

(2) No notice of hearing before a committee shall be required other than posting on the legislative bulletin board . . .

Committees and only committees not required to do so under special sessions. The problem for you, however, is that, as I pointed out earlier and perhaps should have been more specific on just a short while ago, the state senate does not act as a committee; it is its own collective governmental entity with common legislative powers- created and specified from the state constitution.

The definition of “governmental body” includes a “state or local agency, board, commission, committee,
council, department or public body corporate and politic created by constitution, statute, ordinance, rule or
order[.]” Wis. Stat. § 19.82(1). This definition is broad enough to include virtually any collective governmental
entity, regardless of what it is labeled. It is important to note that a governmental body is defined primarily in
terms of the manner in which it is created, rather than in terms of the type of authority it possesses. Purely
advisory bodies are therefore subject to the law, even though they do not possess final decision making power, as
long as they are created by constitution, statute, ordinance, rule, or order.

http://www.doj.state.wi.us/dls/OMPR/...ance_Guide.pdf

It would be different if it was a committee, but it's not.