Obama Sends $3.7 Trillion Budget to Congress

[August]

Originally Posted by Armistead

You think the rich pay the bills, they do, but over the last 20 years due to corporate elitism, pandering to corporations, their profit ratio compared to anytime in past history have far exceeded the tax rates they pay.

Now 1% of people hold over 40% of all wealth, 20% hold 80% in america, compared to the 70's era where 60% of us held about 80% of all wealth.
When you create an elite class, they're the ones you go to for taxes...but they don't care as long as they can purchase congress and pass any regulation they want, they'll gladly pay more taxes for mass profit.

The rich don't care about taxes or the dollar, they invest in real assets that now have become out of reach for most americans.

The GOP sell elitism under a lie called capitalism. We could easily be heading for a two class system of 80% in poverty, the rest billionaires. Our children and grandchildren will live much differently than we.

You think the middle class don't pay taxes. Add your sales tax, property tax, gas tax, electric tax and all the small hidden taxes seemingly in every bill to your fed and state tax...most of us that make under 100K a year pay about 35% in total tax.

All that stuff you just is nothing but partisan posturing. Hear me now and believe me later, these class warfare tactics are going to bite you Liberals in the butt one day, hard. I just hope you don't tear my country apart in the meantime.

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by August

All that stuff you just is nothing but partisan posturing.

No it's not. If you can disprove something he said, disprove it. But waving it off as "partisan posturing" is admitting that you can't.

And it's my country too. And his. Not just "yours."

[August]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

No it's not. If you can disprove something he said, disprove it. But waving it off as "partisan posturing" is admitting that you can't.

I'm not admitting anything but I do note that you don't have anything to say about the class warfare flames you liberals keep fanning...

And it's my country too. And his. Not just "yours."

Well you just can't imagine how happy I am for you two...

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by August

I'm not admitting anything but I do note that you don't have anything to say about the class warfare flames you liberals keep fanning...

In the wise words of the philosopher Joel: "We didn't start the fire."

[August]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

In the wise words of the philosopher Joel: "We didn't start the fire."

Part of the problem is that you consider Billy Joel a philosopher! But yeah lets look at the rest of that quote:

"We didn't start the fire
It was always burning
Since the world's been turning
We didn't start the fire
No we didn't light it
But we tried to fight it"

Except that you're not trying to fight it now are you?

[tater]

What % of the wealth any group owns doesn't matter. It's a meaningless statistic, and the government should be blind to it. The distribution of income is not mandated by the Constitution.

Money is not a zero-sum game over time, the money supply grows. People in every bracket live different lives than when I was a kid in the 1970s. If you wish to say that X% more wealth is controlled by the top 1%, and is "gone" from the lower %s compared to some point in history, then demonstrate how this has impacted lives. You cannot complain that the poor cannot afford, say, broadband, when in the 70s there was no such thing in the first place. If home ownership numbers are different, if the square feet per capita is different, cell phone ownership (only the super rich had car-phones in their limos in 1970 (if even that)), etc, ad nauseum, then you cannot compare economic figures WRT to lifestyles (all that matters) over time without converting this increase in "value" into dollars.

I'll argue that even the poor wage earners are better off now than in 1971 (or '61, or '51) using any reasonable measure of how they live, and what they have.If they have better lives, then they "earn more" even if the % of wealth they own doesn't show this.

[gimpy117]

Originally Posted by tater

What % of the wealth any group owns doesn't matter. It's a meaningless statistic, and the government should be blind to it. The distribution of income is not mandated by the Constitution.

A meaningless statistic? WHAT? It's not a meaningless statistic. It means the erosion of the middle class and the birth of the modern aristocracy who rule not by title and wealth, but now purely by wealth and the power that comes from it.
It's not some thing we can just ignore...it is a fundamental change in our society from a nation of middle class, to a plutocracy where you are either a lord or a surf. It's even a change in our tax system, where now most of the governments revenue will HAVE to come from the people at the top because they have most of the cash.

If Congress ignores this they are plain stupid. Tax wise, and economy wise, large percents of the money in so few hands is a disaster. Simply put, theres no distributed safety net. If for some reason the rich stop spending at the rate they do the economy is Sunk.

[August]

Originally Posted by gimpy117

It's even a change in our tax system, where now most of the governments revenue will HAVE to come from the people at the top because they have most of the cash.

The people "at the top" have always supplied most of the governments revenue. Try seeing past your Democrat propaganda for once.

All that stuff you just is nothing but partisan posturing.

liberals democrats liberals democrat liberals....my country?????
partisan posturing eh

[gimpy117]

Originally Posted by August

The people "at the top" have always supplied most of the governments revenue. Try seeing past your Democrat propaganda for once.

fair enough. But now it's going to come even more so from the top. Try seeing past your republican agenda for once too.Things go both ways you now. Something about glass houses and what not. It's funny how the republican party is planning to screw the middle class and you all eat out of your palms. and when I say planning I mean that.

You know that new roadmap tax idea?

yeah, middle class pays on average $900 more in taxes while the top percent get hundreds of thousands to millions back. It would stack on top of the bush tax cuts and bring the official max to 25%. But effectively after itemizing and deductions its actually a lower effective rate than the middle class.

[Armistead]

Originally Posted by August

I'm not admitting anything but I do note that you don't have anything to say about the class warfare flames you liberals keep fanning...



Well you just can't imagine how happy I am for you two...

You don't think something is wrong when just 1% hold 40% of all wealth, 20% hold 80%...although more recent studies say 10% control over 90% of all wealth..compare to where we in the past and it should shock you.

I'm sure you believe Americans got lazy and we all had the same equal ability as those in power to gain mass wealth on our own. Corporations bought our congressional seats, both parties, but the GOP by far.. I'm far from liberal, I'm just not a panzy for a party. I look at facts and make up my own mind.
http://www.mybudget360.com/top-1-per...f-mega-wealth/

"According to research (PDF) carried out by Michael I. Norton of Harvard Business School and Dan Ariely of Duke University, and flagged by Paul Kedrosky at the Infectious Greed blog, 92 percent of Americans would choose to live in a society with far less income disparity than the US, choosing Sweden's model over that of the US.
According to research (PDF) carried out by Michael I. Norton of Harvard Business School and Dan Ariely of Duke University, and flagged by Paul Kedrosky at the Infectious Greed blog, 92 percent of Americans would choose to live in a society with far less income disparity than the US, choosing Sweden's model over that of the US."


You still think corporate american cares about america and probably believe in trickle down. This fiscal mess was created when Bush was in office, as were non ending wars. Corporations are now working globally minded, thinking a global future. They once worked well for america and made money, now they're only interested in a global economy, not what works for america.

I voted for Obama, not so much against McCain, but against a GOP that went totally mad under Bush. I would gladly for a Nadar, Paul, ect.. Heck, I would just vote for someone totally honest, even a King at this moment.

[August]

Originally Posted by Armistead

You don't think something is wrong when just 1% hold 40% of all wealth, 20% hold 80%...although more recent studies say 10% control over 90% of all wealth..compare to where we in the past and it should shock you.

Let's get something straight Arimstead. It's THEIR wealth! Private property. What you advocate is nothing less than legalized theft. Politics of the mob. Where will it end?

[yubba]

I'm sure not a fan of re-dis-tra-bu-tion of wealth, which is a commie ploy, some day, I would like to be rich without having to give 80 percent of it away to some illegal immigrant. Shut the government down I say, they don't produce anything any way. The dept of energy doesn't produce one watt of power.

[gimpy117]

Originally Posted by yubba

I'm sure not a fan of re-dis-tra-bu-tion of wealth, which is a commie ploy, some day, I would like to be rich without having to give 80 percent of it away to some illegal immigrant. Shut the government down I say, they don't produce anything any way. The dept of energy doesn't produce one watt of power.

and thats the carrot they dangle in front of your nose.

[Armistead]

Originally Posted by August

Let's get something straight Arimstead. It's THEIR wealth! Private property. What you advocate is nothing less than legalized theft. Politics of the mob. Where will it end?

You really think 10% of people that now control over 90% of wealth, mostly corporate america did so fairly, based on fair trade law, competition, tax code and proper regulation? That all the billions of corporate PAC's,,are just interested in social causes.

Naw, your right, they don't seek to buy congressional seats

And look where it's got us, now that small percent can't substain our government or debt load.

Don't worry, next generation or so when your kids here in america are working for a few bucks with no benefits or protection in sweat shops, have no health care, maybe corporate america will come back to work in america.