Arizona Congresswoman Shot in the Head at Public Event

01-12-11, 09:00 AM

Blood libel?????
OK you could let Palins camp get away with nonsense about them really depicting surveyors instruments as that was so laughable, but to now claim they are the victims and to use such phrases really sinks Palin to new lows.

Takeda Shingen · 01-12-11, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Blood libel?????
OK you could let Palins camp get away with nonsense about them really depicting surveyors instruments as that was so laughable, but to now claim they are the victims and to use such phrases really sinks Palin to new lows.

I will give you that 'blood libel' was yet another poor selection of words by Sarah Palin, but aside from that, she does have a very good point. People jumped all over her for the picture on her website. People can call it 'unicode 2316' if that makes them feel more justified in their views, but the bottom line is that it was designed to look like a target reticule. However, the so-called Tea Party's message was also clear; they were unhappy with the voting records of certain politicians and were targeting their districts in attempts to get out the vote. There was no advocacy of assasination, and attemps to imply that there was are both diststasteful and insensitive.

Yes, it is true that Giffords herself was on television calling that image as advocacy of assasination. She was playing the political game, just like that all do; over react and make noise to demonize the opposition. There is no justification for what happened to her, but to imply that Palin is responsible is just as disgusting as other attempts to skew this tragedy for political gain.

Tchocky · 01-12-11, 10:52 AM

Anyone catch Monday's Daily Show? I thought Jon hit the nail on the head in a fairly serious way.

Growler · 01-12-11, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

There is no justification for what happened to her, but to imply that Palin is responsible is just as disgusting as other attempts to skew this tragedy for political gain.

This. Anything that ANY politician does publicly WILL be interpreted by both sides in ways favorable to their own position and, even better, detrimental to the opposition's.

Where I fault Palin's PAC is in creating such an image that was THAT open to abuse by the other side. Her handlers should have known better.

Fish · 01-12-11, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Growler

Her handlers should have known better.

Does this mean, you think, she hasn't a mind of here self?

mookiemookie · 01-12-11, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish

Does this mean, you think, she hasn't a mind of here self?

None of them do. When you elect a politician, you're electing a brand that comes with a supporting cast of hundreds. A politician is a product these days. It takes many people to build marketing campaigns around products. It doesn't stop after the election either - you have ongoing brand management.

AVGWarhawk · 01-12-11, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

None of them do. When you elect a politician, you're electing a brand that comes with a supporting cast of hundreds. A politician is a product these days. It takes many people to build marketing campaigns around products. It doesn't stop after the election either - you have ongoing brand management.

I have to agree here.

Growler · 01-12-11, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish

Does this mean, you think, she hasn't a mind of here self?

Not at all; once any person in the US becomes a "brand" it's all about "brand marketing" afterwards. Brand marketing means that you have people who evaluate everything you say, think, do, eat, etc. for possible "unforeseen negative engagement by opposition analysts" to use against your brand.

geetrue · 01-12-11, 03:54 PM

It's a miracle she's still alive ... that big warm hearted friend of hers put his hands on her head to stop the bleeding could be a clue, but surely shot in the head at close range and living this long with a 101% chance of survival given by her doctor points to many prayers have been answered, not that God wouldn't have cared anyway, but still they were prayed in faith.

If the devil is a chess player (God is not a chess player due to the limited moves) then the timing of this event will come to light when they try to repeal the Democratic health care plan. Hard to see how they can get any support in the Senate from the democrats and of course if it did pass President Obama would presumably reject any plan to his plan.

Not I says me, no not I, I will not blame the health care bill for this act, but this will play out in what they say next week in Congress.

The shooter didn't even watch the news according to one friend.

He was simply pissed off at the answer she gave him in person at a town hall meeting last year.

This was premeditated rage at a woman he blamed for all of his problems.

Sailor Steve · 01-12-11, 05:53 PM

People keep pointing fingers still. There is only one person who can be held responsible for this, and they're not even sure he's responsible.

DarkFish · 01-12-11, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by geetrue

It's a miracle she's still alive ... that big warm hearted friend of hers put his hands on her head to stop the bleeding could be a clue, but surely shot in the head at close range and living this long with a 101% chance of survival given by her doctor points to many prayers have been answered, not that God wouldn't have cared anyway, but still they were prayed in faith.

But saying that the Christian god is the reason why she is still alive? If I were god I'd certainly have saved the 9 year old girl instead.
I rather say she survived because of a quick and professional response by bystanders, good medical service and a huge portion of luck

Platapus · 01-12-11, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by geetrue

It's a miracle she's still alive ... that big warm hearted friend of hers put his hands on her head to stop the bleeding could be a clue, but surely shot in the head at close range and living this long with a 101% chance of survival given by her doctor points to many prayers have been answered, not that God wouldn't have cared anyway, but still they were prayed in faith.

So why didn't your god save all the victims then? Is a politician more worthy of saving than a 9 year old girl?

How does your god choose, and for that matter why would your god choose?

Freiwillige · 01-13-11, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

I will give you that 'blood libel' was yet another poor selection of words by Sarah Palin, but aside from that, she does have a very good point. People jumped all over her for the picture on her website. People can call it 'unicode 2316' if that makes them feel more justified in their views, but the bottom line is that it was designed to look like a target reticule. However, the so-called Tea Party's message was also clear; they were unhappy with the voting records of certain politicians and were targeting their districts in attempts to get out the vote. There was no advocacy of assasination, and attemps to imply that there was are both diststasteful and insensitive.

Yes, it is true that Giffords herself was on television calling that image as advocacy of assasination. She was playing the political game, just like that all do; over react and make noise to demonize the opposition. There is no justification for what happened to her, but to imply that Palin is responsible is just as disgusting as other attempts to skew this tragedy for political gain.

Skybird · 01-13-11, 09:34 AM

Palin (and some others of the Tea Party) so often have used vicious rethorics and verbal vitriol that she has no right to complain if now, justified or not, she is beeing given a share of responsibility for the extreme polarisizing of the political climate and the often hate-filled atmosphere in political debates. For many, in my perception dominantly from the right wing, martial rethorics and ultra-aggressive verbal atacks seem to have become a purpose in itself. America seems to be uniquze, in these regards - protect by the claim for "unlimited free speech", everything is allowed and acceptable, even rightout lies and most vicious offenses. For much what is being used as rethorical ammunition mostlky by the Amerian right, in man y european countries you would be sued over charges of intentional character-assassination, libel and slander. Yes, these laws can be abused for censorship, and soemtimes it happens. But the American way, to offer unlimited freedom of speech, often leads to the abuse of free speech, and rethorics gaining dominance over argument and reason. Anf this is not worthy of America.

tater · 01-13-11, 09:41 AM

Palin has not used "vicious" rhetoric (I'm not a Palin fan, and had you said she'd said plain "dumb" stuff, I'd agree—but not vicious, sorry), and has every right to complain about being made accessory to murder by the press, that idiot sheriff, and anyone else claiming the political climate is responsible for this when there is ZERO evidence that this nut was motivated by that (in fact, there is not even a suggestion of it).

"Vicious" would be that democrat from PA who said that an opposing pol should be shot (I quoted it up the thread a ways). THAT is vicious rhetoric.

tater

PS—Obama did a good job with the speech. The bit about living up to Christina Taylor Green's expectations was very moving. Well done.

01-12-11, 10:52 AM	#3
Tchocky Navy Seal Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 5,874 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	Anyone catch Monday's Daily Show? I thought Jon hit the nail on the head in a fairly serious way. __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

01-12-11, 03:54 PM	#9
geetrue Cold War Boomer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Walla Walla Posts: 2,837 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	It's a miracle she's still alive ... that big warm hearted friend of hers put his hands on her head to stop the bleeding could be a clue, but surely shot in the head at close range and living this long with a 101% chance of survival given by her doctor points to many prayers have been answered, not that God wouldn't have cared anyway, but still they were prayed in faith. If the devil is a chess player (God is not a chess player due to the limited moves) then the timing of this event will come to light when they try to repeal the Democratic health care plan. Hard to see how they can get any support in the Senate from the democrats and of course if it did pass President Obama would presumably reject any plan to his plan. Not I says me, no not I, I will not blame the health care bill for this act, but this will play out in what they say next week in Congress. The shooter didn't even watch the news according to one friend. He was simply pissed off at the answer she gave him in person at a town hall meeting last year. This was premeditated rage at a woman he blamed for all of his problems. __________________

01-12-11, 05:53 PM	#10
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	People keep pointing fingers still. There is only one person who can be held responsible for this, and they're not even sure he's responsible. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

01-13-11, 09:34 AM	#14
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,632 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Palin (and some others of the Tea Party) so often have used vicious rethorics and verbal vitriol that she has no right to complain if now, justified or not, she is beeing given a share of responsibility for the extreme polarisizing of the political climate and the often hate-filled atmosphere in political debates. For many, in my perception dominantly from the right wing, martial rethorics and ultra-aggressive verbal atacks seem to have become a purpose in itself. America seems to be uniquze, in these regards - protect by the claim for "unlimited free speech", everything is allowed and acceptable, even rightout lies and most vicious offenses. For much what is being used as rethorical ammunition mostlky by the Amerian right, in man y european countries you would be sued over charges of intentional character-assassination, libel and slander. Yes, these laws can be abused for censorship, and soemtimes it happens. But the American way, to offer unlimited freedom of speech, often leads to the abuse of free speech, and rethorics gaining dominance over argument and reason. Anf this is not worthy of America. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-12-11, 09:00 AM	#1
Tribesman Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Blood libel????? OK you could let Palins camp get away with nonsense about them really depicting surveyors instruments as that was so laughable, but to now claim they are the victims and to use such phrases really sinks Palin to new lows.

01-13-11, 09:41 AM	#15
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	Palin has not used "vicious" rhetoric (I'm not a Palin fan, and had you said she'd said plain "dumb" stuff, I'd agree—but not vicious, sorry), and has every right to complain about being made accessory to murder by the press, that idiot sheriff, and anyone else claiming the political climate is responsible for this when there is ZERO evidence that this nut was motivated by that (in fact, there is not even a suggestion of it). "Vicious" would be that democrat from PA who said that an opposing pol should be shot (I quoted it up the thread a ways). THAT is vicious rhetoric. tater PS—Obama did a good job with the speech. The bit about living up to Christina Taylor Green's expectations was very moving. Well done.