Tuition hike protesters attack car carrying Prince Charles, Camilla

XabbaRus · 12-11-10, 04:41 PM

Ironically the tories are to blame for all this.

Back when they were last in power in this great effort to show that the UK was a leading educational establishment they decided to allow polytechnics and other colleges that were perfectly good in their role as vocational educational establishments become universities. Therefore there were more institutions chasing the same amount of money, coupled with the fact that it was now derigeur for everyone to go to university as that is how we have been conditioned. Therefore, more uni's, more students, less money.

The quality of these new unis is debatable and has led to the rise of degree course such as "media studies", "sanitation and hygiene" which I am not joking is a bin man's course. Now with every tom dick and harry having a degree it has been devalued, therefore the leading institutions want to maintain their status as they do leading research, therefore need more money.

nikimcbee · 12-12-10, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XabbaRus

Ironically the tories are to blame for all this.

Back when they were last in power in this great effort to show that the UK was a leading educational establishment they decided to allow polytechnics and other colleges that were perfectly good in their role as vocational educational establishments become universities. Therefore there were more institutions chasing the same amount of money, coupled with the fact that it was now derigeur for everyone to go to university as that is how we have been conditioned. Therefore, more uni's, more students, less money.

The quality of these new unis is debatable and has led to the rise of degree course such as "media studies", "sanitation and hygiene" which I am not joking is a bin man's course. Now with every tom dick and harry having a degree it has been devalued, therefore the leading institutions want to maintain their status as they do leading research, therefore need more money.

So, do you guys have a feminist studies program? Does the UK higher ed/ uni system waste as much money on sports as the US does?

XabbaRus · 12-12-10, 03:17 PM

I understand the students being upset, but they do my head in as much as the politicians.

Given the last lot of protests ended in violence can you blame the police for wanting to contain them. Like I said too many students doing too many stupid courses, needs money. The tax payers are paying enough.

gimpy117 · 12-12-10, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XabbaRus

Like I said too many students doing too many stupid courses, needs money. The tax payers are paying enough.

Well unfortunately these "stupid courses" no matter how dumb are becoming REQUIRED by the schools. I'm doing a technical degree and for some reason WMU thinks I need a music class. I'm sure its the same in england. Its a simple tool the schools use to get more money.

Jimbuna · 12-12-10, 04:17 PM

I'm not going to debate the rights and wrongs or who I believe is at fault but having been involved in civil disorder on quite a few occasions and commenting only on the live coverage I have seen on tv it is obvious there are faults on both sides.

If a protest is peaceful and the advice of the authorities is adhered to....and don't forget that is the job of the police and not the protestors as far as the statute books go....then there should be no need for violence.

There were obviously anarchists within the ranks of the protestors and the physical input originally stemmed from those within the protestors ranks.

As soon as that happens it is obviously seen as a breach of the law and the police have the lawful right to take whatever corrective measures their superiors deem acceptable.

Those measures must be 'reasonable' and whilst I readily admit there are faults on both sides, there may not have been any injured parties had the protestors remained 'peaceful' and not resorted to attempts at assaulting officers in the course of their lawful duty.

The protestors feel passionate about their treatment by the government and I agree with them but the minute they resort to violence I suspect they lose the majority of the public sympathy vote.

I watched a documentary about Rev Jessie Jackson today and was frankly shocked at the way Dr King and peaceful protestors were treated by the authorities in areas such as Alabama....now that is what I call excessive.

If similar treatment is passed out by one of our officers (the case above about the death of an innocent byestander being a classic example) and film/video footage is available (which is generally the case considering the depth of media coverage these days) then that officer will be dealt with under the same laws as those of said protestors who commit offences....of that I am confident.

Oberon · 12-12-10, 04:26 PM

It is a terrible shame that the police always get the short end of the stick in this, stuck between a rock and a hard place, I dare say more than a couple of them think that Tweedledum and Tweedledummer are doing a great job of annoying an already tense country, but it's their job to keep public order and so they have to protect the idiots that have gotten us into this mess to begin with.

Jimbuna · 12-12-10, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oberon

It is a terrible shame that the police always get the short end of the stick in this, stuck between a rock and a hard place, I dare say more than a couple of them think that Tweedledum and Tweedledummer are doing a great job of annoying an already tense country, but it's their job to keep public order and so they have to protect the idiots that have gotten us into this mess to begin with.

Of that I am confident.

DarkFish · 12-12-10, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XabbaRus

Like I said too many students doing too many stupid courses, needs money.

But are all these "stupid courses" really university courses? That would make no sense, would it?
In the Netherlands, we've got courses like that as well, but they aren't universitary, and are subject to other much cheaper regulations AFAIK.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gimpy117

Well unfortunately these "stupid courses" no matter how dumb are becoming REQUIRED by the schools. I'm doing a technical degree and for some reason WMU thinks I need a music class. I'm sure its the same in england. Its a simple tool the schools use to get more money.

Of course I can't speak for the Brits, but here in the Netherlands I've never heard of stupid courses like that. I'm studying electrical engineering, and while certainly not every course we follow is related to engineering, all of them are related to engineering jobs (like writing reports, presentation, even an English course)

gimpy117 · 12-12-10, 05:11 PM

well again Darkfish, I'm doing Aviation maintainance, and I had to take a "Music appreciation" class last year. Why? I don't know

DarkFish · 12-12-10, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gimpy117

well again Darkfish, I'm doing Aviation maintainance, and I had to take a "Music appreciation" class last year. Why? I don't know

To appreciate the beautiful sound of an aircraft engine of course

12-11-10, 04:41 PM	#1
XabbaRus Navy Seal Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 5,330 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Ironically the tories are to blame for all this. Back when they were last in power in this great effort to show that the UK was a leading educational establishment they decided to allow polytechnics and other colleges that were perfectly good in their role as vocational educational establishments become universities. Therefore there were more institutions chasing the same amount of money, coupled with the fact that it was now derigeur for everyone to go to university as that is how we have been conditioned. Therefore, more uni's, more students, less money. The quality of these new unis is debatable and has led to the rise of degree course such as "media studies", "sanitation and hygiene" which I am not joking is a bin man's course. Now with every tom dick and harry having a degree it has been devalued, therefore the leading institutions want to maintain their status as they do leading research, therefore need more money. __________________

12-12-10, 03:17 PM	#3
XabbaRus Navy Seal Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 5,330 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	I understand the students being upset, but they do my head in as much as the politicians. Given the last lot of protests ended in violence can you blame the police for wanting to contain them. Like I said too many students doing too many stupid courses, needs money. The tax payers are paying enough. __________________

12-12-10, 04:17 PM	#5
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,918 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	I'm not going to debate the rights and wrongs or who I believe is at fault but having been involved in civil disorder on quite a few occasions and commenting only on the live coverage I have seen on tv it is obvious there are faults on both sides. If a protest is peaceful and the advice of the authorities is adhered to....and don't forget that is the job of the police and not the protestors as far as the statute books go....then there should be no need for violence. There were obviously anarchists within the ranks of the protestors and the physical input originally stemmed from those within the protestors ranks. As soon as that happens it is obviously seen as a breach of the law and the police have the lawful right to take whatever corrective measures their superiors deem acceptable. Those measures must be 'reasonable' and whilst I readily admit there are faults on both sides, there may not have been any injured parties had the protestors remained 'peaceful' and not resorted to attempts at assaulting officers in the course of their lawful duty. The protestors feel passionate about their treatment by the government and I agree with them but the minute they resort to violence I suspect they lose the majority of the public sympathy vote. I watched a documentary about Rev Jessie Jackson today and was frankly shocked at the way Dr King and peaceful protestors were treated by the authorities in areas such as Alabama....now that is what I call excessive. If similar treatment is passed out by one of our officers (the case above about the death of an innocent byestander being a classic example) and film/video footage is available (which is generally the case considering the depth of media coverage these days) then that officer will be dealt with under the same laws as those of said protestors who commit offences....of that I am confident. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

12-12-10, 05:11 PM	#9
gimpy117 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Posts: 3,243 Downloads: 108 Uploads: 0	well again Darkfish, I'm doing Aviation maintainance, and I had to take a "Music appreciation" class last year. Why? I don't know __________________ Member of the Subsim Zombie Army

12-12-10, 04:26 PM	#6
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	It is a terrible shame that the police always get the short end of the stick in this, stuck between a rock and a hard place, I dare say more than a couple of them think that Tweedledum and Tweedledummer are doing a great job of annoying an already tense country, but it's their job to keep public order and so they have to protect the idiots that have gotten us into this mess to begin with.