Bush tax cut analysis

[Torvald Von Mansee]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

"Essential" services not crap like teaching Africans how to wash their genetailia.

And yet...you conservatives never seem to mention the 600 pound hog feeding at the public trough: the military-industrial-congressional complex (I prefer the original term Eisenhower was going to use).

We need to spend twice as much on the military as something like the next largest 30 countries...why?

[tater]

Originally Posted by Torvald Von Mansee

And yet...you conservatives never seem to mention the 600 pound hog feeding at the public trough: the military-industrial-congressional complex (I prefer the original term Eisenhower was going to use).

We need to spend twice as much on the military as something like the next largest 30 countries...why?

If we didn't, the free world would have to invent a replacement for us, that's why.

The US occupies a unique geopolitical position in the world. It;s not just the size of the economy, but our physical location away from other major powers (Europe and Asia), and having access to both oceans (and a Navy to control both of them).

Regardless, the military is not the bulk of spending. It's maybe 50% of the discretionary budget, but the discretionary budget is only 1/3 of the US budget—2/3 is social programs (entitlements). That doesn't count debt service, either.

Any meaningful spending cuts MUST come from entitlements.

How about medicare/medicaid stop covering any non-palliative care for terminal disease? Yep, "death panels." If you want to pay for stuff like that, have private insurance. People on charity care should be SOL—that care is ineffective anyway, and the outcome—death—is certain anyway.

[tater]

BTW, can I just not pay, dunno, say 42 grand in taxes next year? Or heck, just the first 42 grand from Bush cut expiration over the next few years.

I promise to pay it all back if I'm ever made Secretary of the Treasury. Really, every penny. Heck, I'll pay it back if I get ANY cabinet position. That's fair, right?

Regardless, the military is not the bulk of spending. It's maybe 50% of the discretionary budget, but the discretionary budget is only 1/3 of the US budget—2/3 is social programs (entitlements). That doesn't count debt service, either.

Any meaningful spending cuts MUST come from entitlements.

Entitlements?
For a long long time the major expense the US govt had was pensions and payments to civil war vets or their relatives.
The current entitlements program for social spending on vets and their families is the 2nd biggest dept of the government ......after the military.
So where are you going to swing that axe on social spending?

[tater]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Entitlements?
For a long long time the major expense the US govt had was pensions and payments to civil war vets or their relatives.
The current entitlements program for social spending on vets and their families is the 2nd biggest dept of the government ......after the military.
So where are you going to swing that axe on social spending?

It's not the biggest expense, entitlements (SS, medicare, medicaid, etc) is BY FAR. Veteran's affairs is a fraction of entitlement spending.

Cut SS, medicare and medicaid first.

I don't expect to live off that, so I'm not expecting anyone else to. (obviously it would have to be a phased thing, I do not suggest ending payments to current retirees, but a phased increase in retirement age, and means testing so only people that are too poor to survive get any safety net. As a "retirement plan" it should cease to exist, the Constitution doesn't guarantee a life without work after some arbitrary age.

BTW, when pensions was a major outlay, total government spending as a % of GDP was a tiny fraction of what it is today. (like 2.5% vs 25%)

[AVGWarhawk]

SS is nothing but a revolving account or rainy day fund for Washington. Guess what...it is always raining in Washington. So yeah, SS is basically a joke.

Let dig into say...the welfare system..... Gosh...I know two that are on the governments tab. These are just 2 of thousands taking money were money is not due. High time welfare officials do spot check follow up. The insurance companies follow up on those claiming disablity...why does'nt uncle Sam?

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by tater

Regardless, the military is not the bulk of spending. It's maybe 50% of the discretionary budget, but the discretionary budget is only 1/3 of the US budget—2/3 is social programs (entitlements). That doesn't count debt service, either.

[tater]

Assuming to scale, that shows my point nicely. Military ~50% of discretionary. The bulk "mandatory."

[AVGWarhawk]

What do you believe the 'other' is for the mandatory part?

[antikristuseke]

Hookers and cocaine.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

Hookers and cocaine.

I was thinking Pelosi face lift fund.

Ok back on topic.

[Torvald Von Mansee]

Originally Posted by tater

It's not the biggest expense, entitlements (SS, medicare, medicaid, etc) is BY FAR. Veteran's affairs is a fraction of entitlement spending.

Cut SS, medicare and medicaid first.

I don't expect to live off that, so I'm not expecting anyone else to. (obviously it would have to be a phased thing, I do not suggest ending payments to current retirees, but a phased increase in retirement age, and means testing so only people that are too poor to survive get any safety net. As a "retirement plan" it should cease to exist, the Constitution doesn't guarantee a life without work after some arbitrary age.

BTW, when pensions was a major outlay, total government spending as a % of GDP was a tiny fraction of what it is today. (like 2.5% vs 25%)

So...cut charity so the wealthy can keep a tax cut?

Do you call yourself a Christian?

[gimpy117]

Originally Posted by Torvald Von Mansee

So...cut charity so the wealthy can keep a tax cut?

Do you call yourself a Christian?

Agree. The budget needs balancing. Time the rich ponied up like they used to.

[Torvald Von Mansee]

Originally Posted by tater

If we didn't, the free world would have to invent a replacement for us, that's why.

The US occupies a unique geopolitical position in the world. It;s not just the size of the economy, but our physical location away from other major powers (Europe and Asia), and having access to both oceans (and a Navy to control both of them).

It's not our job to police the world, only guard our interests. And there's PLENTY of bloat in the military budget.

[August]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

What I think we should do, is shut down some of our overseas bases, like say in Korea. Also shut down any and all foreign aid, and the like that only bennfit other nations. Use that money, and start a work program to work on our infrastructure. I think this would go much farther to stimulate the economy then a lousy 200 dollar check that most people probably deposit in their saving because income and job prospects are dismal.

Though I think Korea still deserves our military commitment I can agree with the general idea of closing foreign bases that have outlived their usefulness. Europe doesn't really need us there anymore and there is also a lot of boondoggle in our foreign aid that could be cut back as well.