Pastor weighing plans to burn Qurans amid U.S. warnings - Page 12

Gerald · 09-10-10, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STEED

I just wish this Pastor make his flipping mind up!

Perhaps a matter of time, he was expelled from Germany and who's to say what's on..

tater · 09-10-10, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STEED

I just wish this Pastor make his flipping mind up!

Agreed, stating he'd do it, causing a fuss, then backing out is in fact making the religious whackos (of the muslim variety, not HIS religious whackos) think they've won via their threats of violence.

The second any muslims claimed that they would retaliate, I think that the korans should have burned. I'd not have said I was going to in the first place, but backing down is the exact type of self-censorship that made the danish cartoon thing so abhorrent to me (or south park, etc).

09-10-10, 02:19 PM

Whoever is correct, the much more important issue is the violent petulance with which many Muslims around the world are responding to an event which has not even happened yet!

*An Indonesian Muslim cleric said that “whether or not he burns the Koran, Jones had already hurt the heart of the Muslim world. If he'd gone through with it, it would have been tantamount to war,” the cleric said in the coastal town of Lhokseumawe. “A war that would have rallied Muslims all over the world.”

*President Hamid Karzai, of Afghanistan, said “Humiliation of the holy book represents the humilation of our people.”

*Hamas’ leader, Isma’il Haniyah, said referred to Reverend Jones as “this criminal, this liar, this crazy priest who reflects a crazy Western attitude toward Islam and the Muslim nation.”

These over-the-top screeds of victimization are making Reverend Jones appear more and more sympathetic.

As a Christian, I do not accept that Muhammad received revelation from God, for many reasons (most of which would require a separate, and much longer, post), most saliently that he and his “revelation” deny (in Sura 4:157) the key doctrine of my, and 2.3 billion other Christians’, faith: the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, to atone for the entire human race’s sins. That does not mean Christians should run out to buy a Koran and toss it into the fireplace—but neither does it mean that we have to pay Muslim-mandated obeisance to its alleged “holiness,” either.

krashkart · 09-10-10, 02:23 PM

The whackos will always have something over the top to say. What have the moderates said?

And while we're on the subject.... who's having BBQ this weekend?

tater · 09-10-10, 02:27 PM

Which moderates would those be?

I'm fine with discussing "moderate" Islam as long as the exact same standard is used to call it "moderate" as might be used on other religions. If their doctrines are closer to Christians we'd call "fundamentalists" then they are by definition not "moderate" unless you mean moderate only when compared to extremism.

A rough head count on the "moderate" branch compared to the religion at large would also be instructive.

Gerald · 09-10-10, 02:28 PM

JU_88 · 09-10-10, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

Ahmadinejad's got his finger on the pulse of America:

So....did he not do his research on exactly who is burning the books? since his rather crude humor is taking a swipe at 'Americans'.

its the same 'us and them mentalitly' of the pastor.
As the president of Iran, that is an appalling statment -even as a joke.

09-10-10, 02:31 PM

I don't think there is any such thing as a 'moderate' muslim. By the standard of the Koran you are either all in or all out. it is the perfect doctrine for criminals. Which is why it was written.

antikristuseke · 09-10-10, 02:32 PM

There is no such thing as a moderate christian, every chrisstian is exactly like the Westboro baptist church loons and an ardent creationist. There simply can not be other kinds of christians.

Edit: Actually while we are at it all japanese are perverts who buy dirty knickers from vending machines, all russians are communists who love stalin and are drunk all the time, all germans are nazis and goose step everywhere, all finns are actually moose who are allso permanently drunk and all finnish women are fat, latvians suposedly have 6 toes, but actually have 5, 3 on the front and 2 on the back of the foot, all belgians are pedophiles who invented chocolate just to get to the children, all americans are fat and complete morons incapable of spelling hteir own names without geting all the letters wrong, all brits have bad teeth, all irish people are gigner, poland would be better if it were a lake as the people there are practically apmhibian, jews all have huge noses and are money grubbign backstabing bastards etc. etc. [i]ad nauseum[/]
/sarcasm

Begining to see how ****ing stupid your statement is?

09-10-10, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

There is no such thing as a moderate christian, every chrisstian is exactly like the Westboro baptist church loons and an ardent creationist. There simply can not be other kinds of christians.

/sarcasm

And the reason you posted

Quote:

/sarcasm

at the end is because everyone knows your previous statement isn't true?

antikristuseke · 09-10-10, 02:42 PM

No, it is because I concider you too dense to tell wether I was being sarcastic or not.

tater · 09-10-10, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

There is no such thing as a moderate christian, every chrisstian is exactly like the Westboro baptist church loons and an ardent creationist. There simply can not be other kinds of christians.

/sarcasm

I basically agree with you, but we have multiple ways of describing Christian groups. All I'd like is a consistent set of descriptors to be used.

Those Westboro loons are total outliers, as are a few similar groups we might all agree are total whackos. The total membership of such churches is statistically insignificant. "Fundamentalist" churches, however, are significant. I'd like to see the press use the same standards to pigeonhole muslims they do for christians. I imagine "moderates" are statistically insignificant (what are the largest "moderate" sects, and what are their memberships?)

09-10-10, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

No, it is because I concider you too dense to tell wether I was being sarcastic or not.

Me or others? Now you have folks agreeing with your comment.

tater · 09-10-10, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Third Man

Me or others? Now you have folks agreeing with your comment.

I understood his POINT, which I agree with.

antikristuseke · 09-10-10, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tater

I basically agree with you, but we have multiple ways of describing Christian groups. All I'd like is a consistent set of descriptors to be used.

Those Westboro loons are total outliers, as are a few similar groups we might all agree are total whackos. The total membership of such churches is statistically insignificant. "Fundamentalist" churches, however, are significant. I'd like to see the press use the same standards to pigeonhole muslims they do for christians. I imagine "moderates" are statistically insignificant (what are the largest "moderate" sects, and what are their memberships?)

I am of the opinion that moderates form up the largest portions of most major religions, but being moderates they dont shout from the rooftops and thus they are overlooked. I dont really have anything other than my personal experiences to fall back on here, so I dont proclaim this as a fact.

Edit yet again: Just evaluate people as individuals as much as possible or as small groups when they band together for a common cause, whatever that cause may be. That way you avoid ridiculous overgeneralisations and dont look like a loon yourself. That is what I try to do, but being human, I am fallible.

09-10-10, 02:28 PM	#171
Gerald SUBSIM Newsman Join Date: May 2008 Location: Close to sea Posts: 24,254 Downloads: 553 Uploads: 0	I have, free drinks and good pork, __________________ Nothing in life is to be feard,it is only to be understood. Marie Curie

09-10-10, 02:19 PM	#168
The Third Man Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Whoever is correct, the much more important issue is the violent petulance with which many Muslims around the world are responding to an event which has not even happened yet! An Indonesian Muslim cleric said that “whether or not he burns the Koran, Jones had already hurt the heart* of the Muslim world. If he'd gone through with it, it would have been tantamount to war,” the cleric said in the coastal town of Lhokseumawe. “A war that would have rallied Muslims all over the world.” President Hamid Karzai, of Afghanistan, said “Humiliation of the holy book represents the humilation of our people.” Hamas’ leader, Isma’il Haniyah, said referred to Reverend Jones as “this criminal, this liar, this crazy priest who reflects a crazy Western attitude toward Islam and the Muslim nation.” These over-the-top screeds of victimization are making Reverend Jones appear more and more sympathetic. As a Christian, I do not accept that Muhammad received revelation from God, for many reasons (most of which would require a separate, and much longer, post), most saliently that he and his “revelation” deny (in Sura 4:157) the key doctrine of my, and 2.3 billion other Christians’, faith: the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, to atone for the entire human race’s sins. That does not mean Christians should run out to buy a Koran and toss it into the fireplace—but neither does it mean that we have to pay Muslim-mandated obeisance to its alleged “holiness,” either.

09-10-10, 02:23 PM	#169
krashkart Navy Seal Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 5,292 Downloads: 100 Uploads: 0	The whackos will always have something over the top to say. What have the moderates said? And while we're on the subject.... who's having BBQ this weekend?

09-10-10, 02:27 PM	#170
tater Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Mexico, USA Posts: 9,023 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 2	Which moderates would those be? I'm fine with discussing "moderate" Islam as long as the exact same standard is used to call it "moderate" as might be used on other religions. If their doctrines are closer to Christians we'd call "fundamentalists" then they are by definition not "moderate" unless you mean moderate only when compared to extremism. A rough head count on the "moderate" branch compared to the religion at large would also be instructive.

09-10-10, 02:31 PM	#173
The Third Man Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	I don't think there is any such thing as a 'moderate' muslim. By the standard of the Koran you are either all in or all out. it is the perfect doctrine for criminals. Which is why it was written.

09-10-10, 02:32 PM	#174
antikristuseke Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Estland Posts: 4,330 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	There is no such thing as a moderate christian, every chrisstian is exactly like the Westboro baptist church loons and an ardent creationist. There simply can not be other kinds of christians. Edit: Actually while we are at it all japanese are perverts who buy dirty knickers from vending machines, all russians are communists who love stalin and are drunk all the time, all germans are nazis and goose step everywhere, all finns are actually moose who are allso permanently drunk and all finnish women are fat, latvians suposedly have 6 toes, but actually have 5, 3 on the front and 2 on the back of the foot, all belgians are pedophiles who invented chocolate just to get to the children, all americans are fat and complete morons incapable of spelling hteir own names without geting all the letters wrong, all brits have bad teeth, all irish people are gigner, poland would be better if it were a lake as the people there are practically apmhibian, jews all have huge noses and are money grubbign backstabing bastards etc. etc. [i]ad nauseum[/] /sarcasm Begining to see how ****ing stupid your statement is?

09-10-10, 02:42 PM	#176
antikristuseke Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Estland Posts: 4,330 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	No, it is because I concider you too dense to tell wether I was being sarcastic or not.