Resupplying

Flaxpants · 08-02-10, 12:38 AM

Just a quick question re the foreign port colour status on the map. I'm currently playng a campaign and the date is 18th June 1940, my patrol started on the 1st June 1940. I needed to resupply and the nearest 'blue' port to my position on the nav map was in the Netherlands, though after checking the Flaggen and the GWX 'Enemies of Germany' list, Germany was at war with NL from 10th May 1940. I decided to check how the game was treating this and so proceeded to my chosen port, only to come under heavy fire from a dutch patrol vessel, fortunately I managed to dive and sneak away succesfully.

My nav map currently shows all Dutch, Belgian, Danish, Norwegian and French ports as being 'friendlies', but according to the Flaggen etc, these are all my enemies at this point time.

I post this with a certain sense of dread that I may be missing something obvious, if so apologies in advance! Can anyone enlighten me?

CherryHarbey · 08-02-10, 05:13 PM

maybe the German army has captured that particular port hence blue but the Dutch haven't surrendered yet so forces like your destroyer are still fighting the war. can't say I've checked the dates but it seems to fit.

frau kaleun · 08-02-10, 09:38 PM

The sources I checked say that the Dutch capitulated on May 15 1940, except for a small force in Zeeland which continued to resist until the 17th.

After that it would appear that the capitulation of the Netherlands was complete and all ports would have been under the control of German occupying forces and therefore friendly as your map indicated.

Seems odd that you'd take fire from a Dutch vessel in the vicinity of a German-occupied Dutch harbor almost a month later.

Unless - did you perchance attack any Dutch vessels within 24 hours of approaching the Dutch port?

Attacking a non-enemy ship will cause its nation of origin to consider you, personally, to be an enemy combatant for the following 24 hours of game time - regardless of that nation's stance toward the Axis powers overall.

Flaxpants · 08-02-10, 10:48 PM

I definately did not attack any Dutch vessel prior to this incident, and it was definately dutch as I used the external camera to take a look. I did sink a couple of British ships a couple days before this happened though I'm sure that won't be relevant to this.

I'm on my way back to home port anyway now, so maybe when I set out on my next patrol the map will have been updated properly. I hope I haven't got some problem with my installation as I am in the middle of a career that's going pretty well for me, that is, I'm not dead yet and have sunk some ships finally! Here's hoping...

Hang on, going back to what you said Frau Kaleun, the Flaggen denotes the Dutch as (AL) from 10/05/40- 31/12/45. Presumably then, according to this, there is every reason for them to start shooting at me? I assumed that it was the map that was incorrect?

sergei · 08-03-10, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flaxpants

I am in the middle of a career that's going pretty well for me, that is, I'm not dead yet

Sometimes that's the best you can hope for.
As the war progresses I consider any patrol where I'm still alive to be a successful one

frau kaleun · 08-03-10, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flaxpants

Hang on, going back to what you said Frau Kaleun, the Flaggen denotes the Dutch as (AL) from 10/05/40- 31/12/45. Presumably then, according to this, there is every reason for them to start shooting at me? I assumed that it was the map that was incorrect?

May 10 1940 was the beginning of the German invasion of the Netherlands, at which point they would have been "Allied" because they were at war with Germany. But they surrendered to German occupation and control later that month, so (aside from the Dutch resistance) I don't see how they could have been considered an Allied power until after they were liberated from German occupation much later in the war.

But IIRC there was a Dutch govt in exile in Britain in the interim, and maybe there was a "free Dutch" navy/merchant component to Allied shipping during that time period. Those ships would not be neutral or friendly after May 10 1940 and would remain enemies 'til the end of the war, although I don't know offhand if the game reflects this possibility.

Still seems odd to me, though, that you would be attacked by a Dutch vessel patrolling a Dutch harbor that should have been under German control for over a month.

Jimbuna · 08-03-10, 08:31 AM

It all sound double Dutch to me

08-02-10, 10:48 PM	#4
Flaxpants Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Koh Samui, Thailand Posts: 1,196 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	I definately did not attack any Dutch vessel prior to this incident, and it was definately dutch as I used the external camera to take a look. I did sink a couple of British ships a couple days before this happened though I'm sure that won't be relevant to this. I'm on my way back to home port anyway now, so maybe when I set out on my next patrol the map will have been updated properly. I hope I haven't got some problem with my installation as I am in the middle of a career that's going pretty well for me, that is, I'm not dead yet and have sunk some ships finally! Here's hoping... Hang on, going back to what you said Frau Kaleun, the Flaggen denotes the Dutch as (AL) from 10/05/40- 31/12/45. Presumably then, according to this, there is every reason for them to start shooting at me? I assumed that it was the map that was incorrect? Last edited by Flaxpants; 08-03-10 at 12:36 AM.

08-03-10, 08:31 AM	#7
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,525 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	It all sound double Dutch to me __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

08-02-10, 12:38 AM	#1
Flaxpants Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Koh Samui, Thailand Posts: 1,196 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	Just a quick question re the foreign port colour status on the map. I'm currently playng a campaign and the date is 18th June 1940, my patrol started on the 1st June 1940. I needed to resupply and the nearest 'blue' port to my position on the nav map was in the Netherlands, though after checking the Flaggen and the GWX 'Enemies of Germany' list, Germany was at war with NL from 10th May 1940. I decided to check how the game was treating this and so proceeded to my chosen port, only to come under heavy fire from a dutch patrol vessel, fortunately I managed to dive and sneak away succesfully. My nav map currently shows all Dutch, Belgian, Danish, Norwegian and French ports as being 'friendlies', but according to the Flaggen etc, these are all my enemies at this point time. I post this with a certain sense of dread that I may be missing something obvious, if so apologies in advance! Can anyone enlighten me?

08-02-10, 05:13 PM	#2
CherryHarbey Engineer Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Derby, UK Posts: 200 Downloads: 86 Uploads: 0	maybe the German army has captured that particular port hence blue but the Dutch haven't surrendered yet so forces like your destroyer are still fighting the war. can't say I've checked the dates but it seems to fit.

08-02-10, 09:38 PM	#3
frau kaleun Rear Admiral Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Skyri--oh who are we kidding, I'm probably at Lowe's. Again. Posts: 12,706 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	The sources I checked say that the Dutch capitulated on May 15 1940, except for a small force in Zeeland which continued to resist until the 17th. After that it would appear that the capitulation of the Netherlands was complete and all ports would have been under the control of German occupying forces and therefore friendly as your map indicated. Seems odd that you'd take fire from a Dutch vessel in the vicinity of a German-occupied Dutch harbor almost a month later. Unless - did you perchance attack any Dutch vessels within 24 hours of approaching the Dutch port? Attacking a non-enemy ship will cause its nation of origin to consider you, personally, to be an enemy combatant for the following 24 hours of game time - regardless of that nation's stance toward the Axis powers overall.