Interceptor Sub

[Travis Reed]

Originally Posted by Travis Reed

I did manage to get it added to the campaign files for TMO 1.9, however, as with the Shark I had to modify the ammunition file to grant the new torps from start of war and free (imagine the renown hit of having to restock 50 of those things at 500 a pop...). I also noted that when I upgraded to the Improved SD radar (at the very beginning of the war) there was nothing fitted in that slot on patrol. The radar was listed and such, but looking inside the conning tower, I did not see the radar mast or head where it was supposed to be. I also noted the Improved version seems to be from the Kraken's upgrade pack. I was not particularly interested in the Kraken, so I don't have it at present (but will be getting it solely to make the radar work properly).

The interceptor uses the Gato's upgrade packs, for the most part (at least for radar). The Improved SD radar I upgraded to at the beginning of the war was from the Kraken's upgrade packs (the info is listed in the UpgradePacks.upc file even without the associated addon installed). I removed the Kraken's upgrades, since I don't intend on using the Kraken, and the problem is resolved (although I had to trash that campaign...not too big an issue since I'd just started).

[Travis Reed]

After continued campaign testing, I've noted that my fear of running out of battery power with no effective means of recharging them is quite well founded and not to be ignored...since I've already done it on a few occasions...

It seems that since the batteries are set for high speed they will drain extremely rapidly at lower speeds. I don't find it useful attacking targets (especially convoys...) at high enough speeds to maintain the best battery efficiency. If I go too fast, I have far less time to plot a solution, and engage than If I'm traveling at a slower speed. I know the Torps are acoustic homing and while this helps, it's not the be all and end all. Most of what I encounter are slow moving targets. They move slow enough to not trigger the acoustic homing device on the torps, so I have to shoot 'em the same way as any non-homing torp, which requires a decent firing solution and attack angle.

I've changed the throttle settings to match the TMO 1.9 Tench, so I'm usually running at 1/3 or 2/3 (6-7 knots and 13-14 knots submerged, 3-4 knots and 9-10 knots surfaced) for data acquisition and solution plotting.

[EngineProperties]
AllStop=0.00
AheadSlow=0.16
AheadOneThird=0.33
AheadStandard=0.47
AheadFull=0.80
AheadFlank=1.00
BackSlow=-0.26
BackStandard=-0.40
BackFull=-0.53
BackEmergency=-0.66

I'm also noting, that even with a max RPM of 25, DDs and other escorts with passive sonar seem to be able to hear me (even at 1/3-2/3).Although the range at which they can do so seems to be severely limited. It may be that RPM isn't the only factor that determines how well they can hear you. Perhaps speed is also a factor.

I was also thinking it might be cool to adapt the gtaling guns from the Shark for AA work and use them in place of the .50 cal machine guns.

[ETR3(SS)]

The battery life times have been broken since the 1.4 patch. Curiously enough they worked fine for 1.3. Whenever you travel less than 7kts you encounter the battery bug. As for escorts still picking you up passively, it kinda makes sense. When you rig for silent running it secures damage control and torpedo loading in addition to setting speed to Ahead 1/3.

[Silverwolf]

Originally Posted by Travis Reed

After continued campaign testing, I've noted that my fear of running out of battery power with no effective means of recharging them is quite well founded and not to be ignored...since I've already done it on a few occasions...

It seems that since the batteries are set for high speed they will drain extremely rapidly at lower speeds. I don't find it useful attacking targets (especially convoys...) at high enough speeds to maintain the best battery efficiency. If I go too fast, I have far less time to plot a solution, and engage than If I'm traveling at a slower speed. I know the Torps are acoustic homing and while this helps, it's not the be all and end all. Most of what I encounter are slow moving targets. They move slow enough to not trigger the acoustic homing device on the torps, so I have to shoot 'em the same way as any non-homing torp, which requires a decent firing solution and attack angle.

I've changed the throttle settings to match the TMO 1.9 Tench, so I'm usually running at 1/3 or 2/3 (6-7 knots and 13-14 knots submerged, 3-4 knots and 9-10 knots surfaced) for data acquisition and solution plotting.

[EngineProperties]
AllStop=0.00
AheadSlow=0.16
AheadOneThird=0.33
AheadStandard=0.47
AheadFull=0.80
AheadFlank=1.00
BackSlow=-0.26
BackStandard=-0.40
BackFull=-0.53
BackEmergency=-0.66

I'm also noting, that even with a max RPM of 25, DDs and other escorts with passive sonar seem to be able to hear me (even at 1/3-2/3).Although the range at which they can do so seems to be severely limited. It may be that RPM isn't the only factor that determines how well they can hear you. Perhaps speed is also a factor.

I was also thinking it might be cool to adapt the gtaling guns from the Shark for AA work and use them in place of the .50 cal machine guns.

Originally Posted by Travis Reed

The interceptor uses the Gato's upgrade packs, for the most part (at least for radar). The Improved SD radar I upgraded to at the beginning of the war was from the Kraken's upgrade packs (the info is listed in the UpgradePacks.upc file even without the associated addon installed). I removed the Kraken's upgrades, since I don't intend on using the Kraken, and the problem is resolved (although I had to trash that campaign...not too big an issue since I'd just started).

I really wish that the recharge rates were able to be modified as an actual value, that would really limit this problem. ETR3(SS) makes a good point that securing for silent running can help in the DDs not detecting you. However I also think that with the game geared towards the subs being from WWII it's going to be very hard to make a sub run completely quiet.

From what I have messed with over the past couple of days I have come up with two alternatives for the battery recharge problem. One is to set the charge at a lower range so that you can recharge it while surfaced. However that will force you to run the sub on the surface for most of the patrol. With this being a nuclear sub batteries aren't really supposed to be an issue. So the other alternative would be to make the charge last for a ridiculously long time at 7 knots. So your looking at like 2 to 3 million miles per charge.

I've got the peroxide set at 4 million miles at 25 knots, the max speed is almost 40 so i figured 25 is a good cruising speed when traveling from one patrol area to the next.

Don't worry about the Kraken's upgrade packs being put on the sub. I realized that I forgot to actually rename them when I added the sections in. I've found a way to add new sensors and not mess up the ones already in game. So the next beta release will have the proper sensors and no overlapping from the other subs.

[Travis Reed]

Are you certain that SH4 can handle those obscenely long ranges?

I actually found a balance of sorts with the battery life. I set it to 1500NM at 40 and am able to recharge it on the surface, and still be able to cruise at 30+ submerged for quite a long distance before I even have to consider recharging.

Also, if this is supposed to be a nuclear powered boat, realize that most real world nuclear vessels are generally considered to be able to cruise at their maximum speed (I'm sure ETR3(SS) has more information here....how much of it he can tell us, however, is another matter entirely...). You might wish to take that into consideration.

[Silverwolf]

Originally Posted by Travis Reed

Are you certain that SH4 can handle those obscenely long ranges?

I actually found a balance of sorts with the battery life. I set it to 1500NM at 40 and am able to recharge it on the surface, and still be able to cruise at 30+ submerged for quite a long distance before I even have to consider recharging.

Also, if this is supposed to be a nuclear powered boat, realize that most real world nuclear vessels are generally considered to be able to cruise at their maximum speed (I'm sure ETR3(SS) has more information here....how much of it he can tell us, however, is another matter entirely...). You might wish to take that into consideration.

It can handle those ranges. I just took the sub, no other mods installed, from San Fransisco to just off the coast of Japan. I was underwater for as long as I could be until the CO2 was too much. Made 4 trips there and back on the peroxide and nothing went wrong. I had the sub at flank the entire time.

How long does it take to recharge the batteries with that range? I may consider using it if something goes wrong with the batteries when I up the range.

I know nuclear subs are supposed to be able to travel at their maximum speed. That's one of the reasons I'm making the ranges so long. It's so you can travel at flank and not have to worry about the batteries going dead. That and the fact that the new battery max speed is 10 knots it pretty much forces you to use the peroxide engine when going over long distances.

[Travis Reed]

Originally Posted by Silverwolf

It can handle those ranges. I just took the sub, no other mods installed, from San Fransisco to just off the coast of Japan. I was underwater for as long as I could be until the CO2 was too much. Made 4 trips there and back on the peroxide and nothing went wrong. I had the sub at flank the entire time.

How long does it take to recharge the batteries with that range? I may consider using it if something goes wrong with the batteries when I up the range.

I know nuclear subs are supposed to be able to travel at their maximum speed. That's one of the reasons I'm making the ranges so long. It's so you can travel at flank and not have to worry about the batteries going dead. That and the fact that the new battery max speed is 10 knots it pretty much forces you to use the peroxide engine when going over long distances.

Good to know SH4 doesn't croak with such values.

As for recharge time, I'd have to test it further. I'm not even certain if the numbers I've quoted you are going to be my final numbers. I ran them as part of a quick test to see if I could get some decent range and still be able to recharge. I drained the batteries to somewhere around 80-90% and then recharged them at 2/3 surfaced speed. With some time accel (I don't remember how much right now) I did note the battery charge going up. Once I can get better data (and possibly a better tweak), I'll let you know.

EDIT: I've managed to complete a better test and have found that it's not nearly as balanced as I'd like it to be. Left port, followed a course to a wide open space, all submerged at 40 knots. I surfaced only to deal with CO2. I exceeded the 1500NM I'd set and still had plenty of battery left. CO2 level was greater than 90/100 when I surfaced (surfacing at 40 knots is fun, BTW...). My battery level was only 77/100 when the diesels finally kicked in. Ran at 2/3 (using the telegraph settings I posted in an earlier post, which gives about 10 knots) and hit the timeaccel. More than 24 hours later, the battery level was only 88/100. I ended the test.

It seems that something I read elsewhere on these forums is true, to an extent. SH4 does not seem to use the range value for submerged endurance. At least, not in the way we expect it to. My batteries should have been dead or near dead after 1500NM. I also note, that at least the RPM value for the E_Propulsion isn't used. Instead it uses the RPM value from the surfaced portion of the propulsion (which may mean it also uses the surfaced range as well, though perhaps not the speed). Either way, I had far greater range than I'd set, and while I did manage to get it recharging, it was doing so too slowly to be of any real use. Further tweaking is in order. Note also, that the surfaced range was still set at 150k NM. You may wish to check to see whether it does use the RPM value for the Peroxide engine.

[Schwieger]

Did you put any damage models on this yet? Looks nice