This story got me thinking about life after death

[kiwi_2005]

God is real, Jesus Christ is real. Better for a man to believe than one that don't only to die and find out He is real, but if believers are wrong then die what punishment will they face? .

The good ole big bang theory proves their is a God. The big bang theory is more an illusion than believing that there is a God. Well ya see it all happened with a Bang! And the universe was created out of nothing? God is a Mathematician he put up the riddle of the universe so he can sit back and chuckle to himself when the scientist scratches his head trying to figure out something that only God knows the answer. Yet the straight forward answer to the riddle is in the bible on the first page! In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Created man equal, created woman for man, and man for woman as in Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve.

Yeah its very hard for non believers to believe that their is someone far more intelligent/powerful than any man / woman could imagine. And theres no shame in that its not their fault they find it difficult to believe. What a man doesn't believe he will usually knock down. Like i have just done with the big bang theory

No offense intended.

[Skybird]

And more unproven hear-say.

The one ting I learned, slowly, is that trying to rationally discuss with believers about the object of their belief, is absolutely useless, pointless, fruitless, because every rational argument, ever logical conclusion, even every solid undeniable evidence in the end gets rejected by saying: "Well, but I believe it all is different. That's my belief. evidence, logic, a process of falsification or varification does not interest me, because I know that what I believe is the truth anyway. and I know it is true because my holy book tells me that it is true."

This is strange becaseu everybody understanding the basic methdology of science knows that serious science never makes absolute statements about "truths", but only developes hypothesis, theories, at best: paradigms of mostly limited ruabiliuty, on the absis of what has been observed and put tgether in empirical evidence. Nevertheless it gets often accused of stating something as if it is engraved in stone. I admit soemtimes academics give the appearance as if they are doing right this, but that is no good habit in science, for science only says: "this is our best possible current conclusion on the absis of ehat we have been able to find out so far." - On the other hand, religion is all about unchecked, unverifiable, dogmatic statements whose original authors cannot be asked anymore, issued in absolute terms that claim eternal truth and validity as if this claim would be the most natural thing. Religion and science could not be more different, the absurdity of the religious attack on science over accusation to practice what religion with great fanatism practicses itself, is most absurd.

[Morts]

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

Yet the straight forward answer to the riddle is in the bible on the first page! In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Created man equal, created woman for man, and man for woman as in Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve.

oh god
i really hope this post is a joke

[August]

"There can be only one" ooops wrong movie, erm uh...


"Death is but the beginning"

[onelifecrisis]

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

God is real, Jesus Christ is real. Better for a man to believe than one that don't only to die and find out He is real, but if believers are wrong then die what punishment will they face? .

I prophecise that when people die, anyone who didn't give me £100 GBP will go to hell for eternity.

Now, I don't know about you, but I reckon that £100 is a small price to pay just to be sure. You know, just in case I'm right. So when you've thought about it and decided you agree, PM me and I'll let you know the account number.

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by onelifecrisis

I prophecise that when people die, anyone who didn't give me £100 GBP will go to hell for eternity.

Now, I don't know about you, but I reckon that £100 is a small price to pay just to be sure. You know, just in case I'm right. So when you've thought about it and decided you agree, PM me and I'll let you know the account number.

Not until you put this scheme in a book! If it is not in a book, it don't count.

[frau kaleun]

I once met someone online who fervently believed that only a select few would survive the end of the world (as we know it) and be granted some kind of superlative existence (what this amounted to I was never quite clear on) by an omnipotent superhuman power.

Of course in this case the "superhuman power" was held by the survivors of Atlantis (or their descendants, again, never quite got clarification on that) and being one of the "select few" involved being included on some "list" that was being kept somewhere. And if you weren't on it, well, when the long-gone Atlanteans returned and the world ended, you were SOL.

While I had no problem with her believing that this would all go down as she claimed, and taking some comfort in believing that she was on the list and therefore safe from whatever horrors awaited those who weren't, I drew the line at being expected to take her word for it and "get [my] act together" or else be counted among the damned.

Whether I will retain or regain some kind of individual existence or consciousness or "soul" after this body ceases to function is something over which I have no control and can claim no certitude by any standard that is, to me, acceptable. Whatever happens or doesn't will be a function of how the universe works, and my belief or lack thereof with regard to any theory about how it functions will have absolutely no effect on what actually takes place.

However, from what I can tell based on personal experience and study, the spiritual traditions that do posit some kind of individual existence after the one I'm now enmeshed in all seem to agree that my "status" in the presumed afterlife or next life will hinge on how I conduct myself in this one.

So, from a purely practical perspective, it seems pretty obvious to me that my primary concern should be with how I'm living this life, which is something I actually do have some control over - whether or not the choices I make here and now have "afterlife" ramifications is irrelevant. If they do, so be it. If they don't, then I still did the best I could with the life I had.

[AngusJS]

Originally Posted by onelifecrisis

I prophecise that when people die, anyone who didn't give me £100 GBP will go to hell for eternity.

Do you accept Paypal?

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

God is real, Jesus Christ is real. Better for a man to believe than one that don't only to die and find out He is real, but if believers are wrong then die what punishment will they face? .

Sure glad you know you've devoted yourself to the right god. Otherwise, what punishment will you face?

Well ya see it all happened with a Bang! And the universe was created out of nothing?

As opposed to god, which you will say has always existed. If that's the case, why can't the universe have always existed?

But that's not what the Big Bang theory says, anyway.

Yet the straight forward answer to the riddle is in the bible on the first page!

Where you'll find two contradictory answers, which is hardly straightforward, and which doesn't inspire confidence in the veracity of either one.

Regarding an afterlife: If it's the Christian one with a heaven and a hell, what will your existence for the rest of eternity be like if you know that some people you loved in this life are now suffering endlessly (as infinite punishment for their finite "crimes")? Wouldn't that be a rather imperfect heaven?

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

God is real, Jesus Christ is real. Better for a man to believe than one that don't only to die and find out He is real, but if believers are wrong then die what punishment will they face? .

And how do you "know" this? I used to be a devout believer. The reason that I no longer am is the simple acknowledgement that the things I thought I "knew" were actually things I only believed. I see no evidence at all.

The Big Bang is theory, but it's theory based on observation, as are all scientific theories. Saying that it's sillier to believe the Big Bang than it is to believe in God is, to me, pretty much useless. At least people who talk about the Big Bang can show the evidence that leads them to think that way.

As for being better off believing and being wrong than disbelieving and being wrong, I used to feel that way as well. But the other problem is, believing what? What if the Jews are right? What if the Hindus are right? What if the Mormons are right? What if (perish the thought) the Muslims are right? there is no way of knowing the answer to that, just as there is no way of "knowing" there's a God at all.

I'm not a believer, but neither am I a disbeliever. I simply don't know, and I can't argue further than that. But I haven't met anyone else yet who can prove he actually knows something.

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

And how do you "know" this? I used to be a devout believer. The reason that I no longer am is the simple acknowledgement that the things I thought I "knew" were actually things I only believed. I see no evidence at all.

The Big Bang is theory, but it's theory based on observation, as are all scientific theories. Saying that it's sillier to believe the Big Bang than it is to believe in God is, to me, pretty much useless. At least people who talk about the Big Bang can show the evidence that leads them to think that way.

As for being better off believing and being wrong than disbelieving and being wrong, I used to feel that way as well. But the other problem is, believing what? What if the Jews are right? What if the Hindus are right? What if the Mormons are right? What if (perish the thought) the Muslims are right? there is no way of knowing the answer to that, just as there is no way of "knowing" there's a God at all.

I'm not a believer, but neither am I a disbeliever. I simply don't know, and I can't argue further than that. But I haven't met anyone else yet who can prove he actually knows something.

I'm not sure I can agree with evolutionist/big bang types either. Kent Hovind has pretty much discredited them in my opinion. He brings up many good points - especially about how inaccurate carbon dating is.

I'm sticking with God and my faith that men and women didn't evolve from monkeys! I have to believe in an afterlife because it's too depressing to not do so. I mean really, who wants to die and just see nothing, hear nothing, be nothing? I guess you really wouldn't be able to say it's bad or good to be like that since you'd really be nothing at all. You just wouldn't exist anymore.

But while I'm here and able to think scary thoughts about things like this - it just depresses the hell out of me so I usually don't. Just have to have faith that there's going to be more after life ends. Plus, it's always nice to think about being reunited with lost family and friends.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by thorn69

I'm not sure I can agree with evolutionist/big bang types either. Kent Hovind has pretty much discredited them in my opinion. He brings up many good points - especially about how inaccurate carbon dating is.

I don't get involved with the arguments one way or the other. Any good scientist knows that today's pet theory may be tomorrow's joke. That said, I've never seen a conflict between the Bible and evolution, only with the people who insist that Bishop Ussher's timeline has to be taken literally. People who "prove" evolution wrong accept the 'Young Earth' idea without question, even though it has no scientific basis at all. Evolution scientists look a the facts and try to form a theory that best fits them. Intelligent Design believers start with an account they hold sacred and only accept facts that fit. Evolution may or may not be wrong, but I see no reason to put my faith in science that only looks at some of the evidence.

I'm sticking with God and my faith that men and women didn't evolve from monkeys! I have to believe in an afterlife because it's too depressing to not do so. I mean really, who wants to die and just see nothing, hear nothing, be nothing? I guess you really wouldn't be able to say it's bad or good to be like that since you'd really be nothing at all. You just wouldn't exist anymore.

I don't fault you for that a bit. It's good to believe in something, and sometimes I wish I still did. My problem is that no matter how much I may want to, I see no evidence that would lead an impartial observer to conclude that there's a god, much less an after life. I'm not an atheist, as that would require me to actively believe there was no God, and I don't know that either.

But while I'm here and able to think scary thoughts about things like this - it just depresses the hell out of me so I usually don't. Just have to have faith that there's going to be more after life ends. Plus, it's always nice to think about being reunited with lost family and friends.

I would love to have discussions with the great men of history, and see what they think now. Unfortunately I also believe that if the Christians are right, and putting your faith in Jesus is the only salvation, then two of the men I admire most - Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin - are quite likely burning in hell as we speak.

That's what depresses me.

[krashkart]

Life after death? I will be perfectly honest... I am more terrified of people than I am of an empty nothingness after I die. I don't think there will be an empty nothingness, but if there is an afterlife I hope that I am strong enough to stick around and stand watch over the weak. I owe my angels that much.

[onelifecrisis]

This is a bit OT, but anyway, my idea of heaven is: being God. Not in terms of having any power, or the ability to do anything in (or to) the world, but rather just being able to understand it and everything in it, including my former self! It would be awesome if after I died I became all-seeing (omniscient?) and understood everything.

@Steve
It's a bit of a bummer when that knowledge/belief sledgehammer hits you in the face, eh?

[TarJak]

I fail to see why if I did not exist before I was born, why I would continue to exist after death. I am more than comfortable with the notion that there is nothing after death as, (unless you subscribe to reincarnation), there was nothing before birth.

Looking at the world and universe around me the fact that entropy can be physically proven is enough evidence for me to believe that my existence is subject to the law of entropy. Creation does not guarantee long or even endless existence, in fact endless existance would be abhorrent to me in the same way a Groundhog Day scenario would be.

As to heaven, I believe i am already there, I have a great life, great wife, great children and the ability to experience life's richness. In fact I think the traditionally held christian concept of heaven would also be abhorrent as the thing that makes life so interesting and worth living is the risks you must take in living it. Without that risk is existence worthwhile? Not in my opinion.

Does God exist? Yes. In as much as there is a belief that actually forms that existence. Is there a physical being that is god? Well that is yet to be proven.

[Castout]

Originally Posted by onelifecrisis

This is a bit OT, but anyway, my idea of heaven is: being God. Not in terms of having any power, or the ability to do anything in (or to) the world, but rather just being able to understand it and everything in it, including my former self! It would be awesome if after I died I became all-seeing (omniscient?) and understood everything.

Being God well there's only one God at least that's how I have known it

but picture a being with perfectly built body shape (clothed at least clothed while roaming the earth), able to be anywhere anytime in an instant, able to stop people from moving literally and stop them from speaking seemingly at will without much effort from the distance, able to know the future of each men, able to know the thoughts and hearts of people and holds the greatest power(authority) that any man could ever felt and known(greater than every head of state, king and tyrant that's ever lived and the power of men is actually more like an influence but not about this being it was the highest authority, IMMENSE RAW ABSOLUTE POWER and who passed(skipped) on death(how very lucky)

The only thing he could not do is going against God because he's become the true servant of God but which is more like a king himself than a servant and since God is holy(and kind and merciful and powerful though strict and un-predictable) that's not actually a bad thing and considering what becomes of him and the life that he's enjoying NOTHING absolutely NOTHING would and could BUY or made people worth or deserving to be given that kind of existence. I would consider him the luckiest %^$#@$! in the entire existence.

Why couldn't that being that he has become of understand the lot of things that we ordinary people couldn't? I don't know what goes on in that man mind but what was clear that he knew my mind and heart and I knew he knew everything about me.
And if he knew everything about me the nobody(and an 8th grade kid then) from some third world why wouldn't he know other more interesting things?! He could very well do!