German Police Arrest man with "Hitlermobil"

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by Torvald Von Mansee

That's weird..I don't remember driving in Germany, getting arrested, etc!!!!!

One must stop, think, and remmember, that free speech is not written into constitutions to protect popular speech, which needs no such protection.

But the laws in question have nothing to do with free speech.

Three years in prison for violating speech regulation???!

No, up to three years in prison for violating the constitution.

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

But the laws in question have nothing to do with free speech.


No, up to three years in prison for violating the constitution.

Are you against this rights?

Are you against this rights?

What rights???????

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

What rights???????

Free speech...

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Wikipedia

Volksverhetzung

(German: "incitement of hatred by the people") is a concept in German criminal law that bans the incitement of hatred against a segment of the population. It often applies in, though it is not limited to, trials relating to Holocaust denial in Germany. The German penal code (Strafgesetzbuch) establishes that someone is guilty of Volksverhetzung if the person:[1]

in a manner that is capable of disturbing the public peace:

1. incites hatred against segments of the population or calls for violent or arbitrary measures against them; or
2. assaults the human dignity of others by insulting, maliciously maligning, or defaming segments of the population[]

There are also special provisions for holocaust denial (added in the 1990s) and speech justifying or glorifying the Nazi government 1933-1945 (recently added).
Although freedom of speech is mentioned by Article 5 of the Grundgesetz (Germany's constitution), said article basically protects any non-outlawed speech. Restrictions exist, e.g. against personal insults, use of symbols of unconstitutional organizations, or Volksverhetzung. It is a common misconception that Volksverhetzung includes any spreading of nazism, racist, or other discriminatory ideas. For any hate speech to be punishable as Volksverhetzung, the law requires that said speech be "qualified for disturbing public peace" either by inciting "hatred against parts of the populace" or calling for "acts of violence or despotism against them", or by attacking "the human dignity of others by reviling, maliciously making contemptible or slandering parts of the populace".
Volksverhetzung is a punishable offense under Section 130 of the Strafgesetzbuch (Germany's criminal code) and can lead to up to five years imprisonment. Volksverhetzung is punishable in Germany even if committed abroad and even if committed by non-German citizens, if the incitement of hatred takes effect on German territory—that is, the seditious sentiment was expressed in written or spoken German and disseminated in Germany (German criminal code's Principle of Ubiquity, Section 9 Paragraph 1 Alternatives 3 and 4 of the Strafgesetzbuch).[2]
Comparison to international laws

Further information: Hate speech




Similar laws exist around the world, for instance:

• In the UK, incitement to ethnic or racial hatred is a criminal offense under Sections 17-29 of the Public Order Act 1986.
• In Ireland, the corresponding law is the 'Prohibition of Incitement to Hatred Act'.
• A similar law exists in Sweden as "hets mot folkgrupp" ("agitation against a people"), second section 16th chapter 8§ of Criminal law.[3]
• The Finnish Criminal Law also includes a similar law, the crime being called "kiihottaminen kansanryhmää vastaan" in the Finnish version, "hets mot folkgrupp" in the Swedish version: 11th chapter ("On War Crimes and Crimes against Humanity"), 8§.

Originally Posted by Basic Law of the Federal Republic of Germany

Article 1 [Human dignity]

(1) Human dignity shall be inviolable. To respect and protect it shall be the duty of all state authority.
(2) The German people therefore acknowledge inviolable and inalienable human rights as the basis of every community, of peace and of justice in the world.
(3) The following basic rights shall bind the legislature, the executive, and the judiciary as directly applicable law


Article 5 [Freedom of expression]

(1) Every person shall have the right freely to express and disseminate his opinions in speech, writing, and pictures and to inform himself without hindrance from generally accessible sources. Freedom of the press and freedom of reporting by means of broadcasts and films shall be guaranteed. There shall be no censorship.
(2) These rights shall find their limits in the provisions of general laws, in provisions for the protection of young persons, and in the right to personal honor.
(3) Art and scholarship, research, and teaching shall be free. The freedom of teaching shall not release any person from allegiance to the constitution.


Article 18 [Forfeiture of basic rights]

Whoever abuses the freedom of expression, in particular the freedom of the press (paragraph (1) of Article 5), the freedom of teaching (paragraph (3) of Article 5), the freedom of assembly (Article 8), the freedom of association (Article 9), the privacy of correspondence, posts and telecommunications (Article 10), the rights of property (Article 14), or the right of asylum (Article 16a) in order to combat the free democratic basic order shall forfeit these basic rights. This forfeiture and its extent shall be declared by the Federal Constitutional Court.

Originally Posted by German Penal Code

Section 130 Agitation of the People

(1) Whoever, in a manner that is capable of disturbing the public peace:
1. incites hatred against segments of the population or calls for violent or arbitrary measures against them; or
2. assaults the human dignity of others by insulting, maliciously maligning, or defaming segments of the population,
shall be punished with imprisonment from three months to five years.
(2) Whoever:
1. with respect to writings (Section 11 subsection (3)), which incite hatred against segments of the population or a national, racial or religious group, or one characterized by its folk customs, which call for violent or arbitrary measures against them, or which assault the human dignity of others by insulting, maliciously maligning or defaming segments of the population or a previously indicated group:
a) disseminates them;
b) publicly displays, posts, presents, or otherwise makes them accessible;
c) offers, gives or makes accessible to a person under eighteen years; or
(d) produces, obtains, supplies, stocks, offers, announces, commends, undertakes to import or export them, in order to use them or copies obtained from them within the meaning of numbers a through c or facilitate such use by another; or
2. disseminates a presentation of the content indicated in number 1 by radio,
shall be punished with imprisonment for not more than three years or a fine.
(3) Whoever publicly or in a meeting approves of, denies or renders harmless an act committed under the rule of National Socialism of the type indicated in Section 220a subsection (1), in a manner capable of disturbing the public piece shall be punished with imprisonment for not more than five years or a fine.
(4) Subsection (2) shall also apply to writings (Section 11 subsection (3)) with content such as is indicated in subsection (3).
(5) In cases under subsection (2), also in conjunction with subsection (4), and in cases of subsection (3), Section 86 subsection (3), shall apply correspondingly.

...

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by Skybird

...

Note: you are good in Swedish!

Free speech...

Its nothing to do with free speech, the laws that cover such Nazi stuff are under the section dealing with things like treason.
The particular subsection which covers this if intent is shown is the protection of democracy bit.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Vendor

Note: you are good in Swedish!

Hm...? I do not speak a single word of Swedish!

Wrong, one word: Ikea.

Edit: and Stridsvagn. How could I forget that.

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Hm...? I do not speak a single word of Swedish!

Wrong, one word: Ikea.

Edit: and Stridsvagn. How could I forget that.

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Its nothing to do with free speech, the laws that cover such Nazi stuff are under the section dealing with things like treason.
The particular subsection which covers this if intent is shown is the protection of democracy bit.

[Safe-Keeper]

Let the poor guy go, he lives in a free country which allows him to to state his mind like everyone else.

Oh no, wait, he doesn't.

[Penguin]

I guess it's not fully clear for the English-speaking people, that the topic is not about this:



but about this:


2nd image is from this video:

(at 0:30, though the whole video is worth watching, even funny if you don't speak German)

I was wondering why the guy was driving on a platform (parrong) of a train station, till I found out it is about a guy who had a mobile phone with a ringtone with a speech from Adolf. This happens when you use google translate

Oh yes, and thanks to the US freedom of speech I am allowed to post an image which contains a swastika...

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by Safe-Keeper

Let the poor guy go, he lives in a free country which allows him to to state his mind like everyone else.

Oh no, wait, he doesn't.

I see the picture clear

[August]

I figure the Germans have the right to ban and restrict nazi images in their country without being accused of violating free speech rights.

The way I see it the nazis gave up their right to speak freely in modern society because of their actions. If it were up to me we'd go after every neo nazi group worldwide with tanks and infantry and finish the job we left off back in 1945.

The only good nazi is a dead nazi.