I seriously don't get it.........

[August]

Originally Posted by Damo1977

But the average person would have benefited more living under the Soviet rule than before the revolution with Czar Nicholas. SO they would have been quite happy living under the soviet rule due to them only knowing what life was like living under Czar Nichloas.

This is exactly what i was getting at in my post.

We tend to judge the past by our reality, not the reality of those times. To the average person of the times the Soviets certainly looked like an improvement over the Czars and so to were the nazis considered an improvement, at least at first, over the Kaisers and Landgraves of German past.

Were it not for WW2 Hitler might well be considered no worse than Stalin.

[CCIP]

Originally Posted by August

This is exactly what i was getting at in my post.

We tend to judge the past by our reality, not the reality of those times. To the average person of the times the Soviets certainly looked like an improvement over the Czars and so to were the nazis considered an improvement, at least at first, over the Kaisers and Landgraves of German past.

...and you could also consider the feelings of many Russian people about Russia today. Not to Stalin's times; but the comparison of life for MOST older Russians (and I mean the 'silent majority' here) between the USSR in the 60's-70's and in Russia today is by and far not a comparison in modern "democratic" Russia's favour :hmm:

[August]

I could agree with that.

[Damo1977]

Originally Posted by Type941

yyeees maaastaa.. :rotfl:

:hmm: Interesting, very interesting...... :hmm: wonder what else you do for your master? Considering it sounds like your both into acts of violence, I don't want to know.:rotfl:

[Happy Times]

Nice that somebody benefitted from the USSR,we didnt.And our hands are clean.The dictatorship USSR was the agressor,democratic Finland the victim,period.Cant prove otherwise because its the truth and they should give back what they stole http://www.prokarelia.net/en/?x=main The truth is that as a state the USSR was as evil as they come.We have free education and health care in Finland without communism.What else was good about USSR?

[joea]

Originally Posted by Happy Times

Nice that somebody benefitted from the USSR,we didnt.And our hands are clean.The dictatorship USSR was the agressor,democratic Finland the victim,period.Cant prove otherwise because its the truth and they should give back what they stole http://www.prokarelia.net/en/?x=main The truth is that as a state the USSR was as evil as they come.We have free education and health care in Finland without communism.What else was good about USSR?

Well people in many Latin American countries could say the same about the USA...North African about France, African about the UK, big powers tend to be more alike than we think.

[Happy Times]

There is little comparison here to the colonazation of those continents. A democratic,independent,European country was invaded by a criminal dictatorship.The League of Nations condemmed the attack and expelled the USSR.The US and UK left us on our own because they needed the alliance with USSR.So you maybe right about that they are all bad. :hmm:

[sergbuto]

Originally Posted by Happy Times

And our hands are clean.

And who did hide Lenin from Russian police in 1917? There would not be USSR otherwise.

[Happy Times]

Originally Posted by sergbuto

And who did hide Lenin from Russian police in 1917? There would not be USSR otherwise.

Finnish COMMUNISTS that wanted Finland to be part of USSR.Later they rebelled against the legal goverment and were driven to russia.Had to say even you were joking,everybody doesnt know our history.

[sergbuto]

I guess what Type941 was trying to say that one has to distinguish between USSR before mid-fifties and USSR in 60-90ies. During first period it was ruled by Georgean and after that by Ukranians. I wonder where Russians come in? Certainly as gun meat during first period.

[Skybird]

The bigger a country is, the more it supresses and exploits countries the more the smaller they are. If that big country thinks of itself as "democratic", it does so indirectly, well-camouflaged behind wordtraps like "free economy", "freedom", "democracy". The more such a big country does not be "democratic", the more it reaches these very same effects by supressing and exploiting the others by military force. Point is: both have blood on their hands. In case of democracies that not so much kill with their own hands but let the killing done or taken place, this is just not so obvious than in case of a dictatorship that does the killing itself directly. From the statistics: in the 20th century the number of deaths caused by genocide (as understood inthe UN convention from december 1948) allowed and caused by tailored conditions by the demcocratic countries and designed to maximize their own economical advantages, equals if not exceeds the number of deaths of both world wars and all tyrannic regimes and all direct politcial terror there ever were during that century.

Should make one think. I only laugh about the "moral superiority " of our Western political motives. We created our own small island of the happy. We raised that island on the bodies of hundreds of millions.
Sorry for interrupting the party.

http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/welcome.html

Rummel, Rudolf (see link above): Statistics of Democide. Genocide and Mass Murder since 1900. New Brunswick London Münster 1998

Kuper, Leo: Genocide. It's political use in the twentieth century. New Haven (Yale University Press) 1981

Fein, Helen: Genocide: a sociological perspective. London 1993

Böhme, Hartmut: Gewalt im 20. Jahrhundert. Demozide in der Sicht von Erinnerungsliteratur, Statistik und qualitativer Sozialanalyse. In: "figurationen 0" (1999)

[sergbuto]

Originally Posted by Happy Times

Finnish COMMUNISTS that wanted Finland to be part of USSR.Later they rebelled against the legal goverment and were driven to russia.Had to say even you were joking,everybody doesnt know our history.

Yes, Lenin was half-Jew (if I remember correctly), hiden at the time by Finnish communists, and later brought to the "throne" along with Stalin (Georgian) with help of Latvian troopers. Where do Russians come in? Certainly as 10 million dead during civil war.

[The Avon Lady]

Originally Posted by sergbuto

Yes, Lenin was half-Jew (if I remember correctly)

I believe this is incorrect.

[Kapitan]

lennin was acctualy russian orthadox (christian)

[Type941]

so. 4 pages. Do you still 'not get it' or something's more clear for you Damo?