Radar Issues

[mcarlsonus]

Well, if you actually got a SPIKE, that's all it's traditionally done in SH3 or 4. I simply don't recollect ever having heard anyone announce, "Radar Contact," and now that I'm thinking about it, I'm not even sure how it shows up in the, "Log"

[kylania]

I tend to let my Hull Integrity find ships for me...

[commandosolo2009]

Originally Posted by kylania

I tend to let my Hull Integrity find ships for me...

I'm pissing myself outta laughter, good one Chief..

[LukeFF]

Just about everything I've read on the FuMO29 states it had a range of 7500 meters and a coverage of only 20 degrees.

[Mraah]

Originally Posted by LukeFF

Just about everything I've read on the FuMO29 states it had a range of 7500 meters and a coverage of only 20 degrees.

Hiya LukeFF,

You're right! +/-10 . I was all off on that one. I didn't realize the antenna was divided into two groups (port/starboard) with 10 degrees each. This makes more sense and along the lines of the 30 and 61 where there coverage was ~15 degrees, albeit rotating.

The range all points to 7500 too, but the source that I read about the coverage (+/-10) also stated the range to be around 14.5km ... most likely under ideal condition or theorectical range, but 7500 being the effective or proven range when out in the field. We all know energy doesn't magically stop at a specific range ... Which reminds me, the SpecialAbility for the radio operator to increase the range is believable, in my book. A good operator can distinguish between ground clutter and actually targets. With the extra range I've detected headon steamers around 9500 m.

I can only plead that the RFB team keeps this ability !

Thanks,

Rob

[karamazovnew]

FUMO? FUMOFFU!!!!



For those who don't know:

[LukeFF]

Originally Posted by Mraah

The range all points to 7500 too, but the source that I read about the coverage (+/-10) also stated the range to be around 14.5km ... most likely under ideal condition or theorectical range, but 7500 being the effective or proven range when out in the field. We all know energy doesn't magically stop at a specific range ... Which reminds me, the SpecialAbility for the radio operator to increase the range is believable, in my book. A good operator can distinguish between ground clutter and actually targets. With the extra range I've detected headon steamers around 9500 m.

I can only plead that the RFB team keeps this ability !

Yep, we're going to keep that. The other thing that makes that special ability realistic is that, at least for the first generation radar sets, the max range of a given radar set depended in large part on the quality of the vacuum tubes. As such, radar operators were known to try to get better quality radar vacuum tubes while their boat was refitting in port.

[bigboywooly]

Originally Posted by mcarlsonus

Well, if you actually got a SPIKE, that's all it's traditionally done in SH3 or 4. I simply don't recollect ever having heard anyone announce, "Radar Contact," and now that I'm thinking about it, I'm not even sure how it shows up in the, "Log"

In SH3 they called out radar contact
Didnt notice in SH4 as didnt play it enough

[mcarlsonus]

Originally Posted by kylania

I tend to let my Hull Integrity find ships for me...

Odd! That works for ME too!

[ddrgn]

German radar wasn't any good until 7500 meters anyways, realistically speaking.

It was a night time and fog sensor really and most of the time the crew was afraid to use it as they feared being detected.

Remember what years we are in too.

More sophisticated radar came much later.

http://uboat.net/technical/radar.htm

Our boats only have the FUMO30 and 61, 65. 65 was useful to maybe 10 km against surface vessels (realistically). The devs set the 30 at 10km and the 65/61 at 15km, which inst realistic. That being said, I too find the radars sensitivity to be really bad too even with the devs given values. It can be and should be tweaked some.

[Mraah]

Originally Posted by ddrgn

Our boats only have the FUMO30 and 61, 65. 65 was useful to maybe 10 km against surface vessels (realistically). The devs set the 30 at 10km and the 65/61 at 15km, which inst realistic. That being said, I too find the radars sensitivity to be really bad too even with the devs given values. It can be and should be tweaked some.

Don't forget the fuMOGEMA29 .... 7.5 km.

The only change (tweak) I'm going to do is for the 29 ... The devs have the arc set for only 40 degrees (two bearing entries of 340-360 and 0-20) with a sweep period of 5.

My changes (fuMOGEMA29) -
SweepPeriod = 0
BearingMin = 330
BearingMax = 030

With regards to the SweepPeriod, I feel bad using 0 (continuous wave) but even using a pulse set at 2000 cycles/sec would be 0.0005. I don't know if all the dipoles transmitted at once or whether each one did seperately, in the latter case it would have a SweepPeriod of 0.003. Either case it would be closer to 0 than 1.

As far as the ranges go for the 30 and 65/61 ... remember, those ranges aren't absolute, it's the Surface that limits it's range. The game values used at max range (square meters) are :

Fumo 29 ... 40
Fumo 30 ... 40
Fumo 61/65 ... 20

The 29/30 used a wavelength of 82 cm, the 61/65 was reduced to 56 cm. The lower the wavelength the better it is at detecting surface vessels. The power output also effected range but I don't know how many Watts they used for the different types. A good example was the experiment done in the 30's .... at 0.3W the detection range for a large steamer was 4000m (13.5 cm) and 2000m (48 cm).

Anyway, hope that explains it.

The final change for radar that I would do is change the depth at which it turns off. In heavy seas it cuts off around 7m depth ... I understood it to have problems during bad weather but I don't want it to cut off. Changing the MinSensorHeight to 0 would help but that would affect detection range. ... I don't remember if the radar cutoff switch was tied to the sub's surface depth ... perhaps the "Decks Awash" mod would help.

Rob

[ddrgn]

Originally Posted by Mraah

Don't forget the fuMOGEMA29 .... 7.5 km.

The only change (tweak) I'm going to do is for the 29 ... The devs have the arc set for only 40 degrees (two bearing entries of 340-360 and 0-20) with a sweep period of 5.

My changes (fuMOGEMA29) -
SweepPeriod = 0
BearingMin = 330
BearingMax = 030

With regards to the SweepPeriod, I feel bad using 0 (continuous wave) but even using a pulse set at 2000 cycles/sec would be 0.0005. I don't know if all the dipoles transmitted at once or whether each one did seperately, in the latter case it would have a SweepPeriod of 0.003. Either case it would be closer to 0 than 1.

As far as the ranges go for the 30 and 65/61 ... remember, those ranges aren't absolute, it's the Surface that limits it's range. The game values used at max range (square meters) are :

Fumo 29 ... 40
Fumo 30 ... 40
Fumo 61/65 ... 20

The 29/30 used a wavelength of 82 cm, the 61/65 was reduced to 56 cm. The lower the wavelength the better it is at detecting surface vessels. The power output also effected range but I don't know how many Watts they used for the different types. A good example was the experiment done in the 30's .... at 0.3W the detection range for a large steamer was 4000m (13.5 cm) and 2000m (48 cm).

Anyway, hope that explains it.

The final change for radar that I would do is change the depth at which it turns off. In heavy seas it cuts off around 7m depth ... I understood it to have problems during bad weather but I don't want it to cut off. Changing the MinSensorHeight to 0 would help but that would affect detection range. ... I don't remember if the radar cutoff switch was tied to the sub's surface depth ... perhaps the "Decks Awash" mod would help.

Rob

Excellent information thanks for posting!

[Ducimus]

The only change (tweak) I'm going to do is for the 29 ... The devs have the arc set for only 40 degrees (two bearing entries of 340-360 and 0-20) with a sweep period of 5.

Technically speaking, i think the devs have it about right. That first radar was a real POS, and extremely limited. The germans had bring the boat about in a complete circle to do a radar sweep.