Problems with water surface animation graphics

Armistead · 02-16-10, 08:23 PM

Make sure your resolutions and hz are the same for the monitor and in the game..

jugger · 02-17-10, 02:44 AM

Thanks for your answers.

I have managed to put up video on Youtube of this:

Quality is not the best but it clearly shows you what is going on, "driving on a jelly".

- I tried disabling mods, then deleted those two save-folders, enabled Trigger Maru but no difference

- Refresh rate is same in game setting and in windows settings (60Hz)

- I tried the setting suggested in that other forum thread with NHancer, no notable difference. But I will play some more with those settings if I could make something out from them

jugger · 02-17-10, 03:14 AM

This is bit strange, I am not sure if changing settings from Nvidia panel OR from NHancer has any effect to graphics at all. Right now I'm running SH4 in windowed mode so I can change the settings at same time as I see the graphics, but not seeing any notable effects. Also tried to close and restart SH4 after changing settings but no notable effect. Same goes for SH3 too.

From NHancer I'm editing global settings since that should be the surest way to affect the game graphics. For AA I use "Override any application setting", also have tried that "enhance" setting.

My NVidia driver version is 196.21

jugger · 02-17-10, 03:39 AM

One more thing, when boat is halted and if I pan camera with mouse left or right, there is not that strange effect. However if I pan it up/down, then the effect jumps in. Now if I have vsync disabled, I also get strange "line" which can be seen in sky graphics, but when I enable it, that line disapperars but the water effect doesn't. So I guess that vsync is working as supposed and I don't know if this problem has anything to do with vsync, but it definetely relates to camera movement when panning up/down. Now is that vertical or horizontal, I can't remember. I thing my head is gonna explode in a moment...

Lognoreng · 02-17-10, 07:21 AM

I am using the profile way of applying Nhancer settings. Maybe as a last resort you could try to roll back the nvidia driver to an older version. Many of the new drivers is clearly not compatible with certain slighty older games. I cannot use anything newer than the driver i use, or empire total war doesnt work for instance. Also set att the AA/AF options in the NVIDIA panel to "application setting" or i think they will override Nhancer's settings. That's all i can think of

jugger · 02-17-10, 07:42 AM

Lognoreng, could you tell which driver version you are using with your NVIDIA card? I might try to find that particular driver.

First I had a driver maybe about one year old, then I updated it but no change.

Link to the video that shows the problem:

Nisgeis · 02-17-10, 01:53 PM

It's a stock bug. It's because the normal map (the fine detail) for the waves isn't matched up to the wave geometry, so the fine details slides accross the coarse detail if the camera is moving. Going sideways is fine, forwards/backwards (up down if the camera is moving) isn't. I don't know of any fix. If you haven't noticed this - for God's sake don't look for it, because once you've seen it, you can't un-notice it!

AVGWarhawk · 02-17-10, 02:14 PM

I remember that darn flashing being a nasty bug. Greaty reduced by some mods. The shakey water like we have here, yes I get it. But not all the time. Toying with TC helps if I recall. I had thought the camera moving reduced or increased this happening. You are right though, forget about it or you will focus all your time attempting to fix it or playing only to sit there looking at this water shake!

SH4 is a great game. The mods make it so much better. What SH4 could have been if the developers had 6 more months with it!

jugger · 02-17-10, 02:58 PM

i hear ya, no point of paying any extra attention to it if there isn't any way to fix it. I didn't actually notice it at first, but after I did that's all I've been thinking about when playing the game. But not anymore, I hope. I will play around a bit with time compression and see if it has any effect.

Thanks for everybody helping me out with this, now gotta go and sink some ships. Or trying to learn to do so

AVGWarhawk · 02-17-10, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jugger

Thanks for your answers.

I have managed to put up video on Youtube of this:

Quality is not the best but it clearly shows you what is going on, "driving on a jelly".

- I tried disabling mods, then deleted those two save-folders, enabled Trigger Maru but no difference

- Refresh rate is same in game setting and in windows settings (60Hz)

- I tried the setting suggested in that other forum thread with NHancer, no notable difference. But I will play some more with those settings if I could make something out from them

I watched the video. To be sure my rig renders the water the same way...sometimes. Not all the time. I run a 9800. What does the water look like without your card having to handle all the vessels, aircraft and islands in that training school? My thinking is you card is having a time of it with animating the vessels, plane, clouds and water. The game is very graphic intensive. However, it would seem eveyone experiences this strange water every now and then. Sometimes I come out of high TC and my water is going the other direction. See, the water moves, not the sub. It gives the illusion that you, the sub, is making headway. See what your water looks like in the open ocean.

jugger · 02-17-10, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

I watched the video. To be sure my rig renders the water the same way...sometimes. Not all the time. I run a 9800. What does the water look like without your card having to handle all the vessels, aircraft and islands in that training school? My thinking is you card is having a time of it with animating the vessels, plane, clouds and water. The game is very graphic intensive. However, it would seem eveyone experiences this strange water every now and then. Sometimes I come out of high TC and my water is going the other direction. See, the water moves, not the sub. It gives the illusion that you, the sub, is making headway. See what your water looks like in the open ocean.

I took my sub to the outer seas and lowered some detail. I'm getting 60+ fps now but this "jelly"-effect just remains the same. I actually rolled down my Nvidia drivers down to 173 or something, so they are pretty old. Anyhow now the NVIDIA panel settings seems to affect the games and SH3 looks much smoother with AA and AF added. However, as I suspected, it doesn't affect to this jelly-effect. Not positively, not negatively. Also the framerate doesn't seem to have any impact on this effect.

Well, the game is still definitely playable. I think I continue using Trigger Maru(or Environmental only) since it makes the effect harder to notice, thanks to the more detailed water effects.

vickers03 · 02-17-10, 11:55 AM

ATI cards are generally much more compatible
with older games than NVidia.
my ATI5850 has the well known infamous jelly water too, but only when moving the camera.

02-17-10, 01:53 PM	#7
Nisgeis Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 2,909 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 11	It's a stock bug. It's because the normal map (the fine detail) for the waves isn't matched up to the wave geometry, so the fine details slides accross the coarse detail if the camera is moving. Going sideways is fine, forwards/backwards (up down if the camera is moving) isn't. I don't know of any fix. If you haven't noticed this - for God's sake don't look for it, because once you've seen it, you can't un-notice it! __________________ -------------------------------- This space left intentionally blank.

02-17-10, 02:14 PM	#8
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,293 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	I remember that darn flashing being a nasty bug. Greaty reduced by some mods. The shakey water like we have here, yes I get it. But not all the time. Toying with TC helps if I recall. I had thought the camera moving reduced or increased this happening. You are right though, forget about it or you will focus all your time attempting to fix it or playing only to sit there looking at this water shake! SH4 is a great game. The mods make it so much better. What SH4 could have been if the developers had 6 more months with it! __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

02-16-10, 08:23 PM	#1
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Make sure your resolutions and hz are the same for the monitor and in the game..

02-17-10, 02:44 AM	#2
jugger Watch Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 23 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	Thanks for your answers. I have managed to put up video on Youtube of this: Quality is not the best but it clearly shows you what is going on, "driving on a jelly". - I tried disabling mods, then deleted those two save-folders, enabled Trigger Maru but no difference - Refresh rate is same in game setting and in windows settings (60Hz) - I tried the setting suggested in that other forum thread with NHancer, no notable difference. But I will play some more with those settings if I could make something out from them

02-17-10, 03:14 AM	#3
jugger Watch Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 23 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	This is bit strange, I am not sure if changing settings from Nvidia panel OR from NHancer has any effect to graphics at all. Right now I'm running SH4 in windowed mode so I can change the settings at same time as I see the graphics, but not seeing any notable effects. Also tried to close and restart SH4 after changing settings but no notable effect. Same goes for SH3 too. From NHancer I'm editing global settings since that should be the surest way to affect the game graphics. For AA I use "Override any application setting", also have tried that "enhance" setting. My NVidia driver version is 196.21

02-17-10, 03:39 AM	#4
jugger Watch Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 23 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	One more thing, when boat is halted and if I pan camera with mouse left or right, there is not that strange effect. However if I pan it up/down, then the effect jumps in. Now if I have vsync disabled, I also get strange "line" which can be seen in sky graphics, but when I enable it, that line disapperars but the water effect doesn't. So I guess that vsync is working as supposed and I don't know if this problem has anything to do with vsync, but it definetely relates to camera movement when panning up/down. Now is that vertical or horizontal, I can't remember. I thing my head is gonna explode in a moment...

02-17-10, 07:21 AM	#5
Lognoreng A-ganger Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 75 Downloads: 20 Uploads: 0	I am using the profile way of applying Nhancer settings. Maybe as a last resort you could try to roll back the nvidia driver to an older version. Many of the new drivers is clearly not compatible with certain slighty older games. I cannot use anything newer than the driver i use, or empire total war doesnt work for instance. Also set att the AA/AF options in the NVIDIA panel to "application setting" or i think they will override Nhancer's settings. That's all i can think of

02-17-10, 07:42 AM	#6
jugger Watch Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 23 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	Lognoreng, could you tell which driver version you are using with your NVIDIA card? I might try to find that particular driver. First I had a driver maybe about one year old, then I updated it but no change. Link to the video that shows the problem:

02-17-10, 02:58 PM	#9
jugger Watch Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 23 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	i hear ya, no point of paying any extra attention to it if there isn't any way to fix it. I didn't actually notice it at first, but after I did that's all I've been thinking about when playing the game. But not anymore, I hope. I will play around a bit with time compression and see if it has any effect. Thanks for everybody helping me out with this, now gotta go and sink some ships. Or trying to learn to do so

02-17-10, 11:55 AM	#12
vickers03 Pooped from posting Join Date: May 2007 Location: germany Posts: 999 Downloads: 712 Uploads: 37	ATI cards are generally much more compatible with older games than NVidia. my ATI5850 has the well known infamous jelly water too, but only when moving the camera.