World War II-era navigation system shutting down

Platapus · 02-12-10, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cohaagen

I agree with the folks saying "cheerio" to LORAN. If you trust terrestrial nav above a system which floats entirely indifferent to just about every variable outside of the occasional position adjustment, more fool you. The commercial GPS systems are so good (despite statutory hobbling by the US military) that I really can't see how anyone could be nostalgic. In my own (limited) experience, I can't think of a single Peterhead, Broch, Irish Sea or Arbroath boat which doesn't use GPS as its primary navaid.

It's a bit like the passing of the sextant I think - nice to read about in a Hornblower novel, but an absolute arsehole to use from a pitching deck.

The point is that GPS can be knocked out or otherwise interfered with in times of war. If there is no back up nav aids, this puts operations at risk.

I don't think anyone is saying that GPS should not be a primary navaid, but some are saying that GPS should not be the exclusive navaid.

Cohaagen · 02-12-10, 04:33 PM

Right, so you're advocating the "survivability", a paranoid concept at best - this is presuming World War III, yeah? - of a terrestrial system over something floating in space? In that scenario (and it's the only credible or likely one) it's a question of which one outlasts the other by minutes or seconds.

The main problem with GPS is not damage from the - count them - three nations who possess the capability to disrupt them, but from the US military circumscribing civilian use in the event of a major conflict - as they have every right to do. I do know that there has supposedly been a civilian-developed LORAN follow-up in the works for the last two decades or so, but I haven't heard anything more on the matter. And as has been mentioned, it is a nightmare to deal with.

Fact remains (in the UK at least), anyone deemed competent enough to master a civil vessel is also bright enough to learn manual navigation. That is what keeps the 'droggies in business.

razark · 02-12-10, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cohaagen

Right, so you're advocating the "survivability", a paranoid concept at best - this is presuming World War III, yeah? - of a terrestrial system over something floating in space? In that scenario (and it's the only credible or likely one) it's a question of which one outlasts the other by minutes or seconds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kessler_syndrome

It's not just war, natural events could render satellites useless. Not saying it's likely, just good to have a backup, just in case.

Jimbuna · 02-13-10, 05:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Platapus

The point is that GPS can be knocked out or otherwise interfered with in times of war. If there is no back up nav aids, this puts operations at risk.

I don't think anyone is saying that GPS should not be a primary navaid, but some are saying that GPS should not be the exclusive navaid.

Quite....a total dependancy on one system can only lead to problems in the future.

02-12-10, 04:33 PM	#2
Cohaagen Frogman Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: UK Posts: 296 Downloads: 43 Uploads: 0	Right, so you're advocating the "survivability", a paranoid concept at best - this is presuming World War III, yeah? - of a terrestrial system over something floating in space? In that scenario (and it's the only credible or likely one) it's a question of which one outlasts the other by minutes or seconds. The main problem with GPS is not damage from the - count them - three nations who possess the capability to disrupt them, but from the US military circumscribing civilian use in the event of a major conflict - as they have every right to do. I do know that there has supposedly been a civilian-developed LORAN follow-up in the works for the last two decades or so, but I haven't heard anything more on the matter. And as has been mentioned, it is a nightmare to deal with. Fact remains (in the UK at least), anyone deemed competent enough to master a civil vessel is also bright enough to learn manual navigation. That is what keeps the 'droggies in business.