a story of patriotism...

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

Boneheads (read: Neonazis) are pretty strong in numbers even in the Netherlands, let alone places further east. Would have looked pretty strange if only one cop had tried to do it and then gotten surrounded by several neonazis from the crowd.

To raise one's own national flag, in one's own country is neo-nazi?!

Are you for real?

[Task Force]

I think that is abit overboard for a old man... Seriously, one guy escorting him out would be good enough...

Is it just me, or have I heard of alot of mosque being built over there...

T-shirts!
A good way to show the flag, is on T-shirts.
I personaly dislike to wear a hat, but that also works well.

The ultimate is face painting.

Hope your dad is doing well now.

Originally Posted by Snestorm

T-shirts!
A good way to show the flag, is on T-shirts.
I personaly dislike to wear a hat, but that also works well.

The ultimate is face painting.

Hope your dad is doing well now.

But my face is already painted! I am a Juggalo after all.

Originally Posted by Snestorm

To raise one's own national flag, in one's own country is neo-nazi?!

Are you for real?

Read what Highbury and Dan D above wrote. So to answer your question, yes I am for real. My question is, are you for real or are you just play acting on the Internets?

DarkFish,

I think your dad should stop breaking the law. Jail/prison isn't a nice place for someone his age.

Also, to wave a flag isn't patriotism. If it was then every chump in a football match should be called one. With the obvious difference to your dad that they are doing it legally.

[DarkFish]

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

I think your dad should stop breaking the law.

Originally Posted by DarkFish

well that's the problem, it isn't illegal.

And *I* think maybe you should read the thread before you post?

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

Also, to wave a flag isn't patriotism. If it was then every chump in a football match should be called one.

yes, that too is an act of patriotism. But since there are no mosques involved in a football match nobody gives a damn. But the moment somebody shouts the word "muslim" everybody puts down his flags in fear of being called a nazi.
The few who don't - well, look at my dad...

Originally Posted by DarkFish

And *I* think maybe you should read the thread before you post?

To disturb a council meeting is against the law where I come from, it's also very bad manners which should be clear to anyone with any kind of upbringing.

yes, that too is an act of patriotism. But since there are no mosques involved in a football match nobody gives a damn. But the moment somebody shouts the word "muslim" everybody puts down his flags in fear of being called a nazi.
The few who don't - well, look at my dad...

Yea exactly like the US and coalition forces in Iraq and Afghanistan who are killing and torturing, oh that's right, muslims.

[Stealth Hunter]

It seems odd to me that there's nothing in the news about this. Really- I mean there's nothing on Google's news search feature. Nothing at all...

http://news.google.com/news/search?a...erlands+muslim

If this really did happen, someone would be outraged by it. And by someone, I mean some sort of political/idealist group. Because this kind of stuff is always big news, let alone a big motivator for their agendas- and I won't pass speculation on what they may be.

So why haven't we seen anything on it yet?

[DarkFish]

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

To disturb a council meeting is against the law where I come from, it's also very bad manners which should be clear to anyone with any kind of upbringing.

where I come from it's called disturbance when you start shouting and such. Visitors hold up banners all the time, no problem. You can raise any flag you want, nobody cares. Maybe these things are "very bad manners" where you come from, but here it's nothing special.
Problem is, once you raise the Dutch flag when discussing a mosque, everyone jumps up and calls you a racist (look at yourself, it's exactly what you are doing)

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

Yea exactly like the US and coalition forces in Iraq and Afghanistan who are killing and torturing, oh that's right, muslims.

what the heck does Iraq have to do with this? Nobody mentioned anything about Iraq, if you want to discuss Iraq why don't you go here for example

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

It seems odd to me that there's nothing in the news about this. Really- I mean there's nothing on Google's news search feature. Nothing at all...

heh. The Dutch press are too afraid to publish things like this cause they know that they'll be called racists themselves the minute they start defending my dad. Things like this have happened before, the press knows they shouldn't publish such things by now. Racismophobia goes far here
The only place where I could find anything on this is on right-extremist sites, who've got nothing to lose since they're racists already.
And these sites use it only as a means of propaganda for their cause
anyway, here's an article on one of those sites (in Dutch):
http://www.hetvrijevolk.com/index.php?pagina=10499
google translation (mind you, it's in the usual google-translate-english):
http://translate.google.com/translat...99&sl=nl&tl=en

Originally Posted by DarkFish

where I come from it's called disturbance when you start shouting and such. Visitors hold up banners all the time, no problem. You can raise any flag you want, nobody cares. Maybe these things are "very bad manners" where you come from, but here it's nothing special.

Nothing special? What a strange country you live in. But then again the Netherlands is pretty, you know, out there. I know, I've been there.

what the heck does Iraq have to do with this? Nobody mentioned anything about Iraq, if you want to discuss Iraq why don't you go here for example

You said that people somehow give muslims some special status. I think they don't even have similar human rights considering how their deaths in Iraq and Afghanistan haven't led to any kind of condemnation in the west. They've had the equivalent of a 9/11 of deaths each month for years and years and the west is completely silent about it.

[DarkFish]

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

Nothing special? What a strange country you live in.

strange country? maybe. But at least here it is still allowed for people to speak up for your beliefs.

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

But then again the Netherlands is pretty, you know, out there. I know, I've been there.

No, I don't know. Feel free to say what you want to say about the Netherlands, It's not like I'll smack you if I don't like what I hear

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

You said that people somehow give muslims some special status.

Oh? did I? Can you point me to any post in this thread where I said such thing? You're not a good listener, are you?

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

I think they don't even have similar human rights considering how their deaths in Iraq and Afghanistan haven't led to any kind of condemnation in the west. They've had the equivalent of a 9/11 of deaths each month for years and years and the west is completely silent about it.

listen, I'm as much against what's happening in Iraq and Afghanistan as you are. But this is not the thread to discuss that. Iraq/Afghanistan and here have nothing to do with each other.

He was in the wrong, simple as that.
He wasn't arrested for exercising his right to protest, neither was he arrested for waving his flag.
He was arrested because he chose to sit in the public section of a meeting but choosing to not follow the rules that come with that choice. In fact as he was arrested for not following the rules after he had been warned that he was breaking the rules it means he was actively seeking the outcome that he got which Darkside finds so outrageous.

So the claim of.....

What in the devils name will become of this country if we can't even raise our national flag anymore?!

....is complete rubbish.

Now compare this with the US, rarely do I see any pic without the US flag showing up someplace.

Try waving a flag in a public gallery of a political meeting in the US where there are bans on unauthorised demonstrations in chamber.
Try doing it after you have been told to stop.

Today my dad was fined with €100.
I don't know yet if he will pay it or take legal actions.

Legal actions for what?
He broke the law.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

He was in the wrong, simple as that.
He wasn't arrested for exercising his right to protest, neither was he arrested for waving his flag.
He was arrested because he chose to sit in the public section of a meeting but choosing to not follow the rules that come with that choice. In fact as he was arrested for not following the rules after he had been warned that he was breaking the rules it means he was actively seeking the outcome that he got which Darkside finds so outrageous.

So the claim of.........is complete rubbish.


Try waving a flag in a public gallery of a political meeting in the US where there are bans on unauthorised demonstrations in chamber.
Try doing it after you have been told to stop.


Legal actions for what?
He broke the law.

True on all of the above. But, kicking his arse (8 police)? Come on man, was resisting the removal from the building? I suspect not.

But, kicking his arse (8 police)? Come on man, was resisting the removal from the building? I suspect not.

Well we only have the OP to go on and thats already been demonstrated as rather light on actual accurate factual content. But lets work on it.

Well its claimed in the OP that he was waving a stick and disrupting a meeting. How many police would you consider appropriate considering of course that Darkfish said a large number had gone to protest?
Resisting removal? He would have been told to shut up or leave , since he did neither voluntarily what were the chances of him just leaving when the police asked?
Now if he had been protesting in a country not quite as relaxed as the Netherlands then perhaps Darkfish might have been treating us to a video of his dad getting tazered or gassed or just beaten with a nightstick.

[DarkFish]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Well we only have the OP to go on and thats already been demonstrated as rather light on actual accurate factual content.

I admit my first post was not really heavy on factual content, but I did write down some more facts, and also gave a link to an article on a Dutch site. You may have missed it?
In case you have, here it is: original version (Dutch)
google translation
warning: the above site is "semi-racist" (not just yet neo-nazi but definitely right-wing) so the article is also written as such. It's all I could find on the subject however.

If you want any more facts, don't hesitate to ask

Originally Posted by Tribesman

He was arrested because he chose to sit in the public section of a meeting but choosing to not follow the rules that come with that choice. In fact as he was arrested for not following the rules after he had been warned that he was breaking the rules it means he was actively seeking the outcome that he got which Darkside finds so outrageous.

Not true.
Fact is, he wasn't breaking any rules at all. It's allowed to sit in the public section of the meeting holding up banners and flags and such. Both by law and by custom.
To quote from the above article: "On a previous debate the room was densely filled with banners" He simply wasn't doing anything against the law.

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Legal actions for what?
He broke the law.

He did not. As you can read from the above, actually the ones who broke the law were the muncipal officials and the police. The town hall is a public building where you can demonstrate all you want, as long as you don't start any trouble (shouting, fighting etc.). He didn't do any of those so he shouldn't have been asked to leave.