How do you describe your self politically?

CaptainHaplo · 12-02-09, 10:44 PM

I know what your getting at. But ultimately I can be nothing but an "independant constitutionalist". As such - its not about "right or left", its about the merits of each issue, and what the constitution and common sense say about it.

For example - I have a personal opinion about homosexuality and gay marriage. While I have called people who are gay "friend", and meant it - I do not agree with the idea of gay marriage. However, what is more important is not my personal opinion - but rather the reality that no federal government has the legal authority to authorize or restrict gay marriage to its citizenry, without specific constitutional actions occuring. Specifically, because the Constitution does NOT empower the federal government to put its nose in the marriage business, it becomes a "States Rights" issue. As such, each State has (or at least is supposed to have) the authority to make its own laws about what it will or will not recognize among its own citizenry. Only if 33 of the 50 states by public referendum agree to ammend the federal constitution does the federal government really have the right to lay down a "blanket" policy. So regardless of what I or a federal politician things, its only up to the states. That stand doesn't put me on the "right" side of the issue, or on the "left". My personal opinion would be "to the right", but I could not in good conscience promote federal action based upon it. The stance also doesn't put me in "the center".

I like being outside the conventional political box - and judging by the ever increasing numbers of voters who are registering (or often changing their affiliations to) independant, alot of other folks like being outside the box too!

Bout time if ya ask me. Too many politicians looking in the box and trying to figure out what portion of its contents will vote for em just based on the letter beside their name.

JU_88 · 12-02-09, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

I know what your getting at. But ultimately I can be nothing but an "independant constitutionalist". As such - its not about "right or left", its about the merits of each issue, and what the constitution and common sense say about it.

For example - I have a personal opinion about homosexuality and gay marriage. While I have called people who are gay "friend", and meant it - I do not agree with the idea of gay marriage. However, what is more important is not my personal opinion - but rather the reality that no federal government has the legal authority to authorize or restrict gay marriage to its citizenry, without specific constitutional actions occuring. Specifically, because the Constitution does NOT empower the federal government to put its nose in the marriage business, it becomes a "States Rights" issue. As such, each State has (or at least is supposed to have) the authority to make its own laws about what it will or will not recognize among its own citizenry. Only if 33 of the 50 states by public referendum agree to ammend the federal constitution does the federal government really have the right to lay down a "blanket" policy. So regardless of what I or a federal politician things, its only up to the states. That stand doesn't put me on the "right" side of the issue, or on the "left". My personal opinion would be "to the right", but I could not in good conscience promote federal action based upon it. The stance also doesn't put me in "the center".

I like being outside the conventional political box - and judging by the ever increasing numbers of voters who are registering (or often changing their affiliations to) independant, alot of other folks like being outside the box too!

Bout time if ya ask me. Too many politicians looking in the box and trying to figure out what portion of its contents will vote for em just based on the letter beside their name.

For me personally:

Abortion:
Its the woman body, her life and her business (and nobody elses tbh)
plus I dont think anyone can remember what it was like when they were a 3 month old feotous.

Gay marriage:
Again - none of my business, if homosexuals marry or not, it has zero impact on me.
but I see no reason to deny them the same freedoms as hetrosexuals.

(Sorry Christianity & Islam)

Gun Laws,
i live in the UK so its not really applicable, but I would not want thme legalized over here as the people who tend to actually want guns - tend to be the same people who have no intention of using them for the great of good. And plus we already have enough problems with Knife crime.

I guess its down to what ever you believe. applogies if my views offended anyone.

August · 12-02-09, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JU_88

as the people who tend to actually want guns - tend to be the same people who have no intention of using them for the great of good.

I'm not offended but I'd sure be interested to hear your reasoning for this...

Edit: though it'd be better if it were in a more applicable thread!

Onkel Neal · 12-02-09, 11:23 PM

I put Center-Right. The main thing that keeps me from being far right is I believe some regulatory oversight in critical markets is needed.

CaptainHaplo · 12-02-09, 11:34 PM

JU 88 - I was not offended. Your entitled to your view.

On abortion - what if that is YOUR child - a son or daughter yet unborn, that a woman carries. Yes - its in her body, but its also part of YOU. Funny, its her choice alone, but the moment that child takes its first breath - it becomes YOUR responsibility primarily. 9 months < 18 years. See any "inequality" there? Thats a personal view, but my stance still stands in regards to the US - it should be a states rights issue.

Regarding guns, I have to ask - what makes you feel that legalized firearms represent a danger to the average citizenry? I view it this way - if someone is WILLING to go through the necessary steps to legally own a firearm - ie take any required safety courses, register the weapon, etc - they have shown a level of responsibility much higher than those who would get a firearm ILLEGALLY. Or as is often said in my area of the US - if you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have them. And as you noted regarding knife violence - what happens if you have a knife and are attacked by a outlaw with a firearm? Do you have any reasonable chance of self-defense or self-preservation? But again - your entitled to your view. I do need to make clear - in the US the right to own firearms is one that IS protected by our constitution - and thus is NOT a states rights question, but a already established right upon which the government has limited authority to control.

Méo · 12-03-09, 02:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

I'm not offended but I'd sure be interested to hear your reasoning for this...

I don't want to answer back for JU_88 but here's my point of view:

IMHO, lot of Americans (and the government too) seems to make the promotion of guns/weapons as way to resolve many social problems (even for ''personal security''), the result is inevitably a more violent society.

I consider myself lucky to live in my peaceful part of North America, there are no mass shootings or terrorist threat here.

Sailor Steve · 12-03-09, 03:56 AM

I used to place myself on the right, but every time I take one of those silly tests I come out either square in the middle or just the tiniest bit to the left.

So I voted CENTER. I always place myself on the side of individual liberty, so I end up on the right of some issues and the left of others.

I'm more than glad to discuss any and all issues, but this was a poll about where you place yourself, not every single reason why. If we're going to start arguing the issues all over again, I vote for creating new threads. Otherwise this is going to bog down real fast.

antikristuseke · 12-03-09, 04:29 AM

Depends on the issue, life is not black and white.

Schroeder · 12-03-09, 06:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

Depends on the issue, life is not black and white.

Agreed. Depending on the question I go from sometimes far left to far right. So centre would probably be my answer though I usually circle around it without hitting it (most of the time

).

JU_88 · 12-03-09, 06:20 AM

I wasnt refering to gun owners in the U.S.A, i was refering a hypothetical legilsation of guns here (If it happened) the first people to go out to try to obtain a fire arm would be the criminals and gang members.
....Followed by eveyone else, who would only be do it in order to defend themselves from 'those people' and feel safe.

In my view a good person is someone who really doesnt what to put a bullet in the head of a person who never did them any harm.
A bad person does - or doesnt care.
Back ground checks and training are NOT suffiecent to stop the wrong people from getting a gun. they will just get someone lese to buy it for them - or steal one.
In the UK, guns are outlawed and 99% of criminals do NOT have guns, and I am happy with it staying that way. Gun crime in the Uk has risen in the past few years, but its still uncommon.

As for abortion, I have been in a relationship where my partner had one.
(along time ago)
I am certainly not proud of it, nor do I feel indifference.
But - it was the right thing to do at the time, as we could not have provided a good or stable life for it.
That is very personal and I really dont wish talk about it any further.
Regardless I do not apply the same rights to an unborn feutus as I do to new born baby.
The Man does not go though Physical truma of Birth, so what he wants has to take second place
and thats just too bad.

Like I said, my views are just that, mine. They are what is right by me, but it doesnt mean i expect them to be right by everyone.
So other than the above, i dont wish to discuss or justify them any further.
- sorry.

View Poll Results: POLL
Left (I'm American)	7	18.92%
Center Left (I'm American)	2	5.41%
Center (I'm American)	3	8.11%
Center Right (I'm American)	7	18.92%
Right (I'm American)	3	8.11%
Left (I'm NOT American)	4	10.81%
Center Left (I'm NOT American)	2	5.41%
Center (I'm NOT American)	8	21.62%
Center Right (I'm NOT American)	1	2.70%
Right (I'm NOT American)	0	0%
Voters: 37. You may not vote on this poll

12-02-09, 10:44 PM	#1
CaptainHaplo Silent Hunter Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 4,404 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 0	I know what your getting at. But ultimately I can be nothing but an "independant constitutionalist". As such - its not about "right or left", its about the merits of each issue, and what the constitution and common sense say about it. For example - I have a personal opinion about homosexuality and gay marriage. While I have called people who are gay "friend", and meant it - I do not agree with the idea of gay marriage. However, what is more important is not my personal opinion - but rather the reality that no federal government has the legal authority to authorize or restrict gay marriage to its citizenry, without specific constitutional actions occuring. Specifically, because the Constitution does NOT empower the federal government to put its nose in the marriage business, it becomes a "States Rights" issue. As such, each State has (or at least is supposed to have) the authority to make its own laws about what it will or will not recognize among its own citizenry. Only if 33 of the 50 states by public referendum agree to ammend the federal constitution does the federal government really have the right to lay down a "blanket" policy. So regardless of what I or a federal politician things, its only up to the states. That stand doesn't put me on the "right" side of the issue, or on the "left". My personal opinion would be "to the right", but I could not in good conscience promote federal action based upon it. The stance also doesn't put me in "the center". I like being outside the conventional political box - and judging by the ever increasing numbers of voters who are registering (or often changing their affiliations to) independant, alot of other folks like being outside the box too! Bout time if ya ask me. Too many politicians looking in the box and trying to figure out what portion of its contents will vote for em just based on the letter beside their name. __________________ Good Hunting! Captain Haplo

12-02-09, 11:23 PM	#4
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,385 Downloads: 541 Uploads: 224	I put Center-Right. The main thing that keeps me from being far right is I believe some regulatory oversight in critical markets is needed. __________________ SUBSIM - 26 Years on the Web

12-02-09, 11:34 PM	#5
CaptainHaplo Silent Hunter Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 4,404 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 0	JU 88 - I was not offended. Your entitled to your view. On abortion - what if that is YOUR child - a son or daughter yet unborn, that a woman carries. Yes - its in her body, but its also part of YOU. Funny, its her choice alone, but the moment that child takes its first breath - it becomes YOUR responsibility primarily. 9 months < 18 years. See any "inequality" there? Thats a personal view, but my stance still stands in regards to the US - it should be a states rights issue. Regarding guns, I have to ask - what makes you feel that legalized firearms represent a danger to the average citizenry? I view it this way - if someone is WILLING to go through the necessary steps to legally own a firearm - ie take any required safety courses, register the weapon, etc - they have shown a level of responsibility much higher than those who would get a firearm ILLEGALLY. Or as is often said in my area of the US - if you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have them. And as you noted regarding knife violence - what happens if you have a knife and are attacked by a outlaw with a firearm? Do you have any reasonable chance of self-defense or self-preservation? But again - your entitled to your view. I do need to make clear - in the US the right to own firearms is one that IS protected by our constitution - and thus is NOT a states rights question, but a already established right upon which the government has limited authority to control. __________________ Good Hunting! Captain Haplo

12-03-09, 03:56 AM	#7
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	I used to place myself on the right, but every time I take one of those silly tests I come out either square in the middle or just the tiniest bit to the left. So I voted CENTER. I always place myself on the side of individual liberty, so I end up on the right of some issues and the left of others. I'm more than glad to discuss any and all issues, but this was a poll about where you place yourself, not every single reason why. If we're going to start arguing the issues all over again, I vote for creating new threads. Otherwise this is going to bog down real fast. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

12-03-09, 04:29 AM	#8
antikristuseke Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Estland Posts: 4,330 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Depends on the issue, life is not black and white.

12-03-09, 06:20 AM	#10
JU_88 Silent Hunter Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: UK Posts: 3,813 Downloads: 11 Uploads: 0	I wasnt refering to gun owners in the U.S.A, i was refering a hypothetical legilsation of guns here (If it happened) the first people to go out to try to obtain a fire arm would be the criminals and gang members. ....Followed by eveyone else, who would only be do it in order to defend themselves from 'those people' and feel safe. In my view a good person is someone who really doesnt what to put a bullet in the head of a person who never did them any harm. A bad person does - or doesnt care. Back ground checks and training are NOT suffiecent to stop the wrong people from getting a gun. they will just get someone lese to buy it for them - or steal one. In the UK, guns are outlawed and 99% of criminals do NOT have guns, and I am happy with it staying that way. Gun crime in the Uk has risen in the past few years, but its still uncommon. As for abortion, I have been in a relationship where my partner had one. (along time ago) I am certainly not proud of it, nor do I feel indifference. But - it was the right thing to do at the time, as we could not have provided a good or stable life for it. That is very personal and I really dont wish talk about it any further. Regardless I do not apply the same rights to an unborn feutus as I do to new born baby. The Man does not go though Physical truma of Birth, so what he wants has to take second place and thats just too bad. Like I said, my views are just that, mine. They are what is right by me, but it doesnt mean i expect them to be right by everyone. So other than the above, i dont wish to discuss or justify them any further. - sorry.