S-18 class Bug solved?

Rockin Robbins · 08-29-09, 08:23 AM

I wonder.... If a real submarine were damaged by gunfire, could they repair holes in the hull and submerge normally? If engines were hit by 5" shells from a destroyer, is there any chance that engine would ever work again, or would it need replacement?

I'd say the devs got it right on the S-18 and the OTHER subs are all bugged.

Just the same, great detective work and find. Keep up the good work!

By the way, Ducimus has performed some similar work in the developement of Trigger Maru Overhauled 1.7 and 1.8 beta. You might look into that. He's emphasized unhooking parent and child relationships to make systems more repairable. Since I don't do it myself you'd have to talk to him over at Submarine Sim Central to swap actual useful information and techniques.

I'm just a small time modder and cheerleader, not a pro.

Edit: fixed the link!

GerritJ9 · 08-29-09, 08:55 AM

I saw exactly the behaviour Mithrandir describes last night on an S-18 class, coincidentally- engines repaired (both diesels and electric motors), yet no propulsion at all and sank like a stone when diving to use the electrics.
While hull damage may well make diving impossible until repaired, it should be possible to motor away on the surface if the machinery is intact/repaired.
Whether engines actually could be repaired or not would depend on damage level- IRL, "Damaged" could mean replacing a cylinder head, liner, piston or bearing shells for instance. "Destroyed" could mean a broken crankshaft, piece blown from the cylinder block casting or some other terminal and irreparable damage.
Getting back to base might well prove impossible eventually if you are stuck in the middle of hostile territory and can't submerge though........ but at least you could try!
And yes, I'd very much like to test this fix!

pythos · 08-29-09, 11:33 AM

This is possibly a little off topic, but still deals with damaged subs acting more damaged than they appear.

It was my understanding that german subs could stay afloat, with one compartment flooded, and American boats two. But in SH4 if one compartment is flooded you sink like a stone.

Case in point. I got shelled and got my stern bulkhead destroyed, that resulted in this compartment flooding. I would think in real life that compartment would get closed off by watertight doors, and the boat would make way as best as it could to refuge, if not base.

In my case only the stern torpedo room was flooded no other. (The destroyer disappeared into the fog from whence it came and did not come back). I was dieseling along on the surface at flank, and effected repairs. Then my boat went down....bow first.

But the damage was in the stern.

I need to do more research about the compartment flooding, but if anyone knows can you provide answers?

Highbury · 08-29-09, 11:47 PM

As my sig shows, I use the S-18s in pretty much all my Pacific careers

I love the little thing. I'd be interested in looking at your fix.

If I may be so bold as to make a request, since you are poking around in S-18 files anyways... can you maybe try to figure out why it is the only sub in the game (or at least of all the ones I have tried, including modded U-Boats) that the radio does not cut out when submerged? It plays loud and clear no matter how deep.

Thanks!

ETR3(SS) · 08-30-09, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

Submarine Sim Central

Your link seems a little...off

Quote:

Forbidden

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keltos01 · 08-30-09, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ETR3(SS)

Your link seems a little...off

here :

http://forum.kickinbak.com/viewforum...6957bb29d8c759

keltos

Mithrandir · 08-31-09, 07:46 AM

Hallo all,
I discovered another thing on the S-18.
It is the only sub in which the tag "is diesel-electric" in "subname.sim" is set to false. This is the reason why it recharges so slowly the batteries. Changed to true the recharge is much faster.

I would like to put the fix, JSGME-ready, on subsim forum for download, any suggestion on how to do this?

Bye,
Mith

ETR3(SS) · 08-31-09, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithrandir

Hallo all,
I discovered another thing on the S-18.
It is the only sub in which the tag "is diesel-electric" in "subname.sim" is set to false. This is the reason why it recharges so slowly the batteries. Changed to true the recharge is much faster.

I would like to put the fix, JSGME-ready, on subsim forum for download, any suggestion on how to do this?

Bye,
Mith

There's two ways to do this. 1. You can give the file to someone with file uploading privileges for them to upload to the site or 2. you can go to the Downloads page and there is a link on the left side to "become one of the modmen" which is sending Neal a PM requesting upload ability.

Rockin Robbins · 08-31-09, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ETR3(SS)

Your link seems a little...off

Now THAT's what I call "off!" Let's see if we can change that. Let's try Submarine Sim Cental. Testing...testing.....

It works!

Rockin Robbins · 08-31-09, 05:53 PM

I was just trying to answer a question about FOTRS and was using my camouflaged S-18 to answer it. What a blast it is! I laid havoc to a convoy slowed down by night. Just about drained my batteries completely and emptied every torpedo in the boat. I LOVE the Sugar Boats. AVG Warhawk got me hooked for good!

pythos · 08-31-09, 06:23 PM

The reason the S-18 did not have Diesel electric enabled is because IT IS NOT A DIESEL ELECTRIC sub. It has the same charging and propulsion system as the German U-boats, hence one engine provides charging amps, while the other propels the sub.

The S-18, and S-42 classes had VERY long charging times.

Source of info, Us submarines 1918-1945. Friedman.

Mithrandir · 09-03-09, 12:58 AM

Ok, so I will leave "itsdieselelectric" to false!

Bye,
Mith

08-29-09, 08:23 AM	#1
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,900 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	I wonder.... If a real submarine were damaged by gunfire, could they repair holes in the hull and submerge normally? If engines were hit by 5" shells from a destroyer, is there any chance that engine would ever work again, or would it need replacement? I'd say the devs got it right on the S-18 and the OTHER subs are all bugged. Just the same, great detective work and find. Keep up the good work! By the way, Ducimus has performed some similar work in the developement of Trigger Maru Overhauled 1.7 and 1.8 beta. You might look into that. He's emphasized unhooking parent and child relationships to make systems more repairable. Since I don't do it myself you'd have to talk to him over at Submarine Sim Central to swap actual useful information and techniques. I'm just a small time modder and cheerleader, not a pro. Edit: fixed the link! __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS Last edited by Rockin Robbins; 08-31-09 at 12:00 PM.

08-29-09, 08:55 AM	#2
GerritJ9 Sonar Guy Join Date: May 2007 Location: Netherlands Posts: 389 Downloads: 47 Uploads: 6	I saw exactly the behaviour Mithrandir describes last night on an S-18 class, coincidentally- engines repaired (both diesels and electric motors), yet no propulsion at all and sank like a stone when diving to use the electrics. While hull damage may well make diving impossible until repaired, it should be possible to motor away on the surface if the machinery is intact/repaired. Whether engines actually could be repaired or not would depend on damage level- IRL, "Damaged" could mean replacing a cylinder head, liner, piston or bearing shells for instance. "Destroyed" could mean a broken crankshaft, piece blown from the cylinder block casting or some other terminal and irreparable damage. Getting back to base might well prove impossible eventually if you are stuck in the middle of hostile territory and can't submerge though........ but at least you could try! And yes, I'd very much like to test this fix! __________________ Quamvis Patiens Acris My SH3/SH4 mods: http://www.gamefront.com/files/user/GerritJ9

08-31-09, 05:53 PM	#10
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,900 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	I was just trying to answer a question about FOTRS and was using my camouflaged S-18 to answer it. What a blast it is! I laid havoc to a convoy slowed down by night. Just about drained my batteries completely and emptied every torpedo in the boat. I LOVE the Sugar Boats. AVG Warhawk got me hooked for good! __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS

08-29-09, 11:33 AM	#3
pythos Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere over there Posts: 834 Downloads: 46 Uploads: 0	This is possibly a little off topic, but still deals with damaged subs acting more damaged than they appear. It was my understanding that german subs could stay afloat, with one compartment flooded, and American boats two. But in SH4 if one compartment is flooded you sink like a stone. Case in point. I got shelled and got my stern bulkhead destroyed, that resulted in this compartment flooding. I would think in real life that compartment would get closed off by watertight doors, and the boat would make way as best as it could to refuge, if not base. In my case only the stern torpedo room was flooded no other. (The destroyer disappeared into the fog from whence it came and did not come back). I was dieseling along on the surface at flank, and effected repairs. Then my boat went down....bow first. But the damage was in the stern. I need to do more research about the compartment flooding, but if anyone knows can you provide answers?

08-29-09, 11:47 PM	#4
Highbury The Old Man Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: 51.557, -0.102 Posts: 1,311 Downloads: 177 Uploads: 0	As my sig shows, I use the S-18s in pretty much all my Pacific careers I love the little thing. I'd be interested in looking at your fix. If I may be so bold as to make a request, since you are poking around in S-18 files anyways... can you maybe try to figure out why it is the only sub in the game (or at least of all the ones I have tried, including modded U-Boats) that the radio does not cut out when submerged? It plays loud and clear no matter how deep. Thanks!

08-31-09, 07:46 AM	#7
Mithrandir Bosun Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Roma, Italia Posts: 64 Downloads: 199 Uploads: 0	Hallo all, I discovered another thing on the S-18. It is the only sub in which the tag "is diesel-electric" in "subname.sim" is set to false. This is the reason why it recharges so slowly the batteries. Changed to true the recharge is much faster. I would like to put the fix, JSGME-ready, on subsim forum for download, any suggestion on how to do this? Bye, Mith

08-31-09, 06:23 PM	#11
pythos Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere over there Posts: 834 Downloads: 46 Uploads: 0	The reason the S-18 did not have Diesel electric enabled is because IT IS NOT A DIESEL ELECTRIC sub. It has the same charging and propulsion system as the German U-boats, hence one engine provides charging amps, while the other propels the sub. The S-18, and S-42 classes had VERY long charging times. Source of info, Us submarines 1918-1945. Friedman.

09-03-09, 12:58 AM	#12
Mithrandir Bosun Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Roma, Italia Posts: 64 Downloads: 199 Uploads: 0	Ok, so I will leave "itsdieselelectric" to false! Bye, Mith