There is something wrong in DG

feld · 08-08-09, 09:26 PM

alexsmith - can you tell me what your "gunnery damage" and "gunnery accuracy" sliders are set to?

Thxs
r/
feld

alexsmith · 08-09-09, 06:19 AM

I tried different setting and finally decided not to touch them at all: when accuracy set to high - computer hits every time and it's fatal; when to low - your ships doesn't hit at all while computer does

feld · 08-09-09, 08:01 AM

Thanks. Lemme play with the settings and run some tests of my own. I've got a (foolish, simplistic) theory that I'd like to test.

r/
feld

alexsmith · 08-09-09, 12:42 PM

Would you share it to us?

feld · 08-09-09, 03:36 PM

That's only fair...as long as everyone understands that this is just a hunch based on my twenty or so hours with the game thus far. I do NOT have enough information to submit a bug report and, frankly, I'm not at all convinced that there is a problem with the DG gunnery/ballistics model as some have claimed.

That said:
My idea was: "what if the gun accuracy settings only affected the player's shooting and did not affect AI's shooting?"

I got this hunch sometime during my tenth battle or so (playing as Japan) when I finally managed to corner VARIAG west of Chemulpo. The Russian ship SEEMED to shoot much better than the contemporary reports of their shooting would indicate for night gunnery at 3000-4000 meters.

I remembered your posts in which you seemed to be arguing that Russian ships were too vulnerable. When you said that you did trials with lots of different gun accuracy settings and it didn't seem to matter I realized that one common element in both of these situations *might* be that the human player (the Russians in your trials I think) kept getting creamed by the AI player (Japanese in your trials?).

I've since learned that I had the "gun accuracy" slider set way too high (100 vice the 20 that Bullethead recommended). So I've reset my "gun accuracy" and am keeping an eye on the performance with the revised values. That may be all that there is too it so I am not at this point saying at all that DG's gunnery model is messed up.

If my week or so of play still leaves me with questions, then I'll pursue using the scenario editor to do gunnery exercises at predetermined ranges.

v/r
feld

alexsmith · 08-09-09, 07:06 PM

I didn't actually say "Russians ships are more vulnarable" - the point was: ships behave MUCH better when managed by computer. Now you also feel that, don't you?

By the way: was Varyag able to make your ships suffer? I mean - armored cruisers like Asama. According my undestanding of changes in 1.5 6" guns COMPLETELY ineffective against armored targets. So Varyag's shooting you mentioned - did it do any damage to AC?

feld · 08-12-09, 06:30 PM

In that engagement-yes I felt that the computer ships were getting more hits at range than they should've. The Variag didn't really engage the Asama in that action much at all. A few rounds hit Asama only. Just some searchlight and secondary mount damage. The PC's got beaten up pretty badly by Variag's 6" though...

But I've got to tell you that, since I changed my gunnery accuracy numbers to 20 the performance has seemed much more realistic to me...and I'll keep an eye out for the 6" thing. The sources I'm reading are saying unkind things about many of the fuses in the shells in the RJW. Maybe that's it...

I'll keep you in the loop if I find anything.

08-08-09, 09:26 PM	#1
feld Loader Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 84 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 0	I'm going to regret asking but... alexsmith - can you tell me what your "gunnery damage" and "gunnery accuracy" sliders are set to? Thxs r/ feld

08-09-09, 08:01 AM	#3
feld Loader Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 84 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 0	I knew I was going to regret asking... Thanks. Lemme play with the settings and run some tests of my own. I've got a (foolish, simplistic) theory that I'd like to test. r/ feld

08-09-09, 06:19 AM	#2
alexsmith Loader Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 81 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I tried different setting and finally decided not to touch them at all: when accuracy set to high - computer hits every time and it's fatal; when to low - your ships doesn't hit at all while computer does

08-09-09, 12:42 PM	#4
alexsmith Loader Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 81 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Would you share it to us?

08-09-09, 03:36 PM	#5
feld Loader Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 84 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 0	That's only fair...as long as everyone understands that this is just a hunch based on my twenty or so hours with the game thus far. I do NOT have enough information to submit a bug report and, frankly, I'm not at all convinced that there is a problem with the DG gunnery/ballistics model as some have claimed. That said: My idea was: "what if the gun accuracy settings only affected the player's shooting and did not affect AI's shooting?" I got this hunch sometime during my tenth battle or so (playing as Japan) when I finally managed to corner VARIAG west of Chemulpo. The Russian ship SEEMED to shoot much better than the contemporary reports of their shooting would indicate for night gunnery at 3000-4000 meters. I remembered your posts in which you seemed to be arguing that Russian ships were too vulnerable. When you said that you did trials with lots of different gun accuracy settings and it didn't seem to matter I realized that one common element in both of these situations might be that the human player (the Russians in your trials I think) kept getting creamed by the AI player (Japanese in your trials?). I've since learned that I had the "gun accuracy" slider set way too high (100 vice the 20 that Bullethead recommended). So I've reset my "gun accuracy" and am keeping an eye on the performance with the revised values. That may be all that there is too it so I am not at this point saying at all that DG's gunnery model is messed up. If my week or so of play still leaves me with questions, then I'll pursue using the scenario editor to do gunnery exercises at predetermined ranges. v/r feld

08-09-09, 07:06 PM	#6
alexsmith Loader Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 81 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I didn't actually say "Russians ships are more vulnarable" - the point was: ships behave MUCH better when managed by computer. Now you also feel that, don't you? By the way: was Varyag able to make your ships suffer? I mean - armored cruisers like Asama. According my undestanding of changes in 1.5 6" guns COMPLETELY ineffective against armored targets. So Varyag's shooting you mentioned - did it do any damage to AC?

08-12-09, 06:30 PM	#7
feld Loader Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 84 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 0	In that engagement-yes I felt that the computer ships were getting more hits at range than they should've. The Variag didn't really engage the Asama in that action much at all. A few rounds hit Asama only. Just some searchlight and secondary mount damage. The PC's got beaten up pretty badly by Variag's 6" though... But I've got to tell you that, since I changed my gunnery accuracy numbers to 20 the performance has seemed much more realistic to me...and I'll keep an eye out for the 6" thing. The sources I'm reading are saying unkind things about many of the fuses in the shells in the RJW. Maybe that's it... I'll keep you in the loop if I find anything.