merchants slow down

[kstanb]

Hi, I found this strange AI behaviour, hope someone can help me figure out if it is as designed. I am playing with RFB 1.52

When I found lone merchants, they are usually cruising at 8 to 10 knots, somehow, when I approach them, I can see their speed dropping drastically to 3 or 4 knots

My guess is that it is either a bug or maybe they found me, and tried to escape by zig-zaging/ changing course constantly, but being slow ships, that is the best speed they can make

thanks a lot!

[Kloef]

I like posts were people answer their own questions,keep them coming!:rotfl:

[kstanb]

I am trying to guess the answer...

if they slow down because they zig-zag (which I am not 100% sure since I play with no map update), then that strategy is not working for them...

by doing 3 knots constantly, I can easily close submerged to less than 1000 yards and guarantee a kill with a couple of torps

[SteveUK]

I'm playing RFB/RSRRDC myself and haven't had this. Do have some merchants that will start to change course or increase speed but never one that has reduced.

is it a visual slow down or calculated?

[SteamWake]

Well dont let them know your there :rotfl:

What may be percieved as a speed change may actually be a course change.

[kstanb]

Real slow down, confirmed by the fact that I catch them really fast by going underwater at 8knots
also, before shooting, I always do a final 2.58 min bearing/ range calculation at dead stop.

So, this is a a bug, I guess I will re-install

Edit: Do you think this might be a time compression issue? I read in another post there was an issue by going more than 8x
problem is, it can be very boring to shadow a ship at very long ranges without some way of TC to get closer

[SteveUK]

It could possibly be mods conflicting as well?

Do you have many installed?

[kstanb]

I have RFB/RSRRDC + their patches
AFAIK installed in the proper order


Tonight, I will test merchant behaviour with CapScurvy's manual targeting training mission (the one vs a tanker) with automatic updates on and full camera view.
I will surface the boat, shoot a couple of rounds (all misses, just to get its attention) and then go periscope depth and track its behaviour.

It should change course, zig-zag and increase speed

[kstanb]

I think I found the problem, I had Operation Monsun also included.
I tested it without Monsun and merchants start to run away OK

so, Monsun and RSRDC might not be compatible


Just in case someone want to repeat the test with both Monsun and RSRDC:

I) Mission: CapScurvy's manual targeting training mission, with automatic map update and camera

Mods enabled:
RFB_v1.52
RSRDC_RFBV15_V421
RSRDC_V421_Patch2
OpsMonsun_V705
OMv705_v710

-tanker at 11 knots, course 155, submerged (everything as per the training mission)

- surfaced the boat and 5 seconds later I started to see shells coming in my direction, so obviously the tanker detected me, crash dived and got into periscope depth

- then I measured bearing and speed at dead stop:
1st) course 245 ; 4 knots
2nd) course 285 ; 5 knots
3rd) course 205 ; 2 knots
It kept changing course, but I never see it coming back to anything over 5 knots


II) Mission: CapScurvy's manual targeting training mission, with automatic map update and camera

Mods enabled:
RFB_v1.52
RSRDC_RFBV15_V421
RSRDC_V421_Patch2

-tanker at 11 knots, course 155, submerged (everything as per the training mission)

- surfaced the boat and he didn't detect me. Fire shells at ~5 to 6 thousand yards,

- reduced distance to aprox 3K yards, kept shooting near misses, but avoided direct hits; still no reaction

- somewhere between 3K and 2K, I decided to hit it. At the first impact, I noticed a sudden change in course. so I stopped firing

- then I measured bearing and speed at dead stop:
1st) course 295 ; 9 knots
2nd) course 290 ; 9 knots
I stopped since it was obvious that it was trying to evade me at a good speed.

I am kind of disapointed by the low detection ability of the tanker, maybe that is a mission setting for a training mission? it should be able to detect me or the incoming shells at mid range. I will try to repeat it in a normal campaign

[lurker_hlb3]

Originally Posted by kstanb

I think I found the problem, I had Operation Monsun also included.
I tested it without Monsun and merchants start to run away OK

so, Monsun and RSRDC might not be compatible


Just in case someone want to repeat the test with both Monsun and RSRDC:

I) Mission: CapScurvy's manual targeting training mission, with automatic map update and camera

Mods enabled:
RFB_v1.52
RSRDC_RFBV15_V421
RSRDC_V421_Patch2
OpsMonsun_V705
OMv705_v710

-tanker at 11 knots, course 155, submerged (everything as per the training mission)

- surfaced the boat and 5 seconds later I started to see shells coming in my direction, so obviously the tanker detected me, crash dived and got into periscope depth

- then I measured bearing and speed at dead stop:
1st) course 245 ; 4 knots
2nd) course 285 ; 5 knots
3rd) course 205 ; 2 knots
It kept changing course, but I never see it coming back to anything over 5 knots


II) Mission: CapScurvy's manual targeting training mission, with automatic map update and camera

Mods enabled:
RFB_v1.52
RSRDC_RFBV15_V421
RSRDC_V421_Patch2

-tanker at 11 knots, course 155, submerged (everything as per the training mission)

- surfaced the boat and he didn't detect me. Fire shells at ~5 to 6 thousand yards,

- reduced distance to aprox 3K yards, kept shooting near misses, but avoided direct hits; still no reaction

- somewhere between 3K and 2K, I decided to hit it. At the first impact, I noticed a sudden change in course. so I stopped firing

- then I measured bearing and speed at dead stop:
1st) course 295 ; 9 knots
2nd) course 290 ; 9 knots
I stopped since it was obvious that it was trying to evade me at a good speed.

I am kind of disapointed by the low detection ability of the tanker, maybe that is a mission setting for a training mission? it should be able to detect me or the incoming shells at mid range. I will try to repeat it in a normal campaign

This is a very nice and detailed report. If you had noted this entry in the readme of OMv705 to v710:

Added “Ship’s Acceleration Physics” for Escorts / Merchants only (OM v710)

That would explain the changes in ships speed.




Whoever if you had downloaded OMv705 to v711 you would have noted in the readme:

Changes to the “Ship’s Acceleration Physics” for Escorts / Merchants only (OM v711)

I made changes to the “Ship’s Acceleration Physics” that I was not happy about.

[kstanb]

thanks a lot, I didn't notice there was a new version of OM, I just very recently installed version _710 (no more than 2 weeks ago)

I am downloading right now; I really loved the aggressive behaviour of the tanker, shooting me even before I had time to man the deck gun...

[kstanb]

and by the way, Just a quick thank you note to Lurker and the OM team...

I am just amazed about the massive scope of the mod. I am really new to SHIV and thought it was just a small improvement for the German add on