Subsim Narwhal Contest - Mod is now available, see post #662 - Page 5

Hitman · 06-25-09, 08:26 AM

So, here are my suggestions

First of all, you seem to have two models, one for Argonaut and one for Narwhal/Nautilus, which is a great thing.

This model here reflects much better the Argonaut, but the deck gun platform should beat the same level as the deck, and then extending downwards over the hull (As it extends right now):

What I would see as improvement is 1) Lower the deck gun platform to match the deck level, 2) smoothen the areas marked in red, and 3) eliminate the bounce of the saddle tanks marked in yellow. The V-Boats had a hull shaped much closer to a ship than to a conventional submarine, because the saddle tanks did not protude.

Now, this second model is perfect for the Narwhal:

Again I would smoothen the area marked in red and also eliminate the saddle tank or at least smooth it a lot.

The raised deck gun platform marked in green is good, but it would llok even better if it had the holes in 3D (I suppose you were planning to do them as 2D in the texture).

One more thing: Since you seem to be going to retexture the whole new model, you could contact Foofighters for permission to use his Narwhal skin, which was created for the pseudo-Narwhal done by Ducimus, but would fit well in the new model if retextured. That skin was really gorgeous!

I will also make a set of historic single missions for the Narwhal/Argonaut to be added to the download pack!

AVGWarhawk · 06-25-09, 08:37 AM

Hitman · 06-25-09, 08:39 AM

Here is a more detailed view of what I'm talking about: The Argonaut had the protusions in the hull for the deck gun platforms fore and aft of the conning tower, but at the same level as the deck:

The Narwhal/Nautilus had the same protuberances (may be a bit smoother) but also a raised platform that placed the deck gun not at the deck level, but raised over it.

You should therefore use the Argonaut as base, with the wide deck gun platform at the heigth of the deck, and then put a platform over it to get the Narwhal. You could have the models for the same effort by simply making the Argonaut from the earlier stage of the Narwhal.

Hitman · 06-25-09, 08:49 AM

Two more good drawings:

Here you can see the for that the gun platform protusions have in the Argonaut:

Here you can see how the saddle tanks are barely noticeable in the hull, and the raised deck gun platform in the Narwhal. This picture also provides a good idea of how the cut section of the boat looks like, and of the additional external torpedo tube:

AVGWarhawk · 06-25-09, 09:12 AM

Hitman is correct, the hull is more surface ship like:

AVGWarhawk · 06-25-09, 09:30 AM

Here is a good shot of the bulges in the hull that accomodate the gun platforms.

AVGWarhawk · 06-25-09, 09:35 AM

double post

Sledgehammer427 · 06-25-09, 09:52 AM

heh, blame Keltos's screen program, theres only ONE model.

AVG. That Blue picture, of the nautilus, although diminitive in size and resolution, has....CROSS SECTIONS! something we badly needed.

Hitman, thank you for the critique.
It is easy enough for me to delete the Gun Deck of the narwhal we have and work out a simple argonaut (by simple, I mean, simpler than the narwhal

) I am having a few problems figuring out the gun deck.
Let me explain:
in all the refrence pictures you guys have shown us, you can see on the Narwhal that in between the guns, the hull slopes inward, but doesnt do that in any other places, and its hard to get it to do that in my 3d program. I am trying, believe me, Ive wanted a full-size Narwhal in SH4 since i found out there wasnt one.
Heck, every time i saw someone else come and go with it, I said to myself
"you know, im probably going to have to do this myself eventually"

But anywho, I'll continue to mess around with it through the day.

AVGWarhawk · 06-25-09, 10:12 AM

AVGWarhawk · 06-25-09, 10:13 AM

Quote:

AVG. That Blue picture, of the nautilus, although diminitive in size and resolution, has....CROSS SECTIONS! something we badly needed.

All I could find on the blueprints. Still looking!

keltos01 · 06-25-09, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitman

Now THAT's a Narwhal

Oh man, I have waited so long to see this in SH4 ... and now I will have the full summer holidays to play V-Boat careers

EDIT:

Forgot to add: As you can see, this unit received an aditional external torpedo tube at each side, which are visible right below the deck, and way above the normal 2 ones. (Can also be seen in the pic in my signature)

AFAIK those tubes are not reloadable -only at base-. When surfaced it seems also that the torpedoes will "fall" to teh sea as if shot from an S-Boat.

exactly like the Class T submarine I made a while back, although without the ugly snout !

we'll first get it working with the normal tubes, then maybe make one with those 2 additionnal tubes working.

keltos

keltos01 · 06-25-09, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sledgehammer427

That may be what's needed, we'll let you know.

agreed !

we already have broken the Narwhal Curse !!!

keltos

keltos01 · 06-25-09, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitman

So, here are my suggestions

First of all, you seem to have two models, one for Argonaut and one for Narwhal/Nautilus, which is a great thing.

This model here reflects much better the Argonaut, but the deck gun platform should beat the same level as the deck, and then extending downwards over the hull (As it extends right now):

What I would see as improvement is 1) Lower the deck gun platform to match the deck level, 2) smoothen the areas marked in red, and 3) eliminate the bounce of the saddle tanks marked in yellow. The V-Boats had a hull shaped much closer to a ship than to a conventional submarine, because the saddle tanks did not protude.

Now, this second model is perfect for the Narwhal:

Again I would smoothen the area marked in red and also eliminate the saddle tank or at least smooth it a lot.

The raised deck gun platform marked in green is good, but it would llok even better if it had the holes in 3D (I suppose you were planning to do them as 2D in the texture).

One more thing: Since you seem to be going to retexture the whole new model, you could contact Foofighters for permission to use his Narwhal skin, which was created for the pseudo-Narwhal done by Ducimus, but would fit well in the new model if retextured. That skin was really gorgeous!

I will also make a set of historic single missions for the Narwhal/Argonaut to be added to the download pack!

Gun deck lowered.

I'll work on the hull next but we really need crosssections of the boat !

can you post pictures of the 2 classes cause I'm getting mixed up here ! so there's one with six fore tubes (including those 2 non reloadable) and low gun platform and one with high guns platform and no additionnal tubes ?

btw I read here : http://www.history.navy.mil/danfs/n1/narwhal-ii.htm that most of her cruises were supply runs a bit like the IJN subs !

keltos

keltos01 · 06-25-09, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Hitman is correct, the hull is more surface ship like:

do you have a high resolution scan of this blueprint ? I see the cross sections in the lower left corner !!

keltos

keltos01 · 06-25-09, 11:22 AM

I modified the hull a bit, it this better ?

keltos

06-25-09, 08:26 AM	#61
Hitman Pacific Aces Dev Team Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 6,109 Downloads: 109 Uploads: 2	So, here are my suggestions First of all, you seem to have two models, one for Argonaut and one for Narwhal/Nautilus, which is a great thing. This model here reflects much better the Argonaut, but the deck gun platform should beat the same level as the deck, and then extending downwards over the hull (As it extends right now): What I would see as improvement is 1) Lower the deck gun platform to match the deck level, 2) smoothen the areas marked in red, and 3) eliminate the bounce of the saddle tanks marked in yellow. The V-Boats had a hull shaped much closer to a ship than to a conventional submarine, because the saddle tanks did not protude. Now, this second model is perfect for the Narwhal: Again I would smoothen the area marked in red and also eliminate the saddle tank or at least smooth it a lot. The raised deck gun platform marked in green is good, but it would llok even better if it had the holes in 3D (I suppose you were planning to do them as 2D in the texture). One more thing: Since you seem to be going to retexture the whole new model, you could contact Foofighters for permission to use his Narwhal skin, which was created for the pseudo-Narwhal done by Ducimus, but would fit well in the new model if retextured. That skin was really gorgeous! I will also make a set of historic single missions for the Narwhal/Argonaut to be added to the download pack! __________________ One day I will return to sea ...

06-25-09, 08:37 AM	#62
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,284 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	__________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

06-25-09, 08:39 AM	#63
Hitman Pacific Aces Dev Team Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 6,109 Downloads: 109 Uploads: 2	Here is a more detailed view of what I'm talking about: The Argonaut had the protusions in the hull for the deck gun platforms fore and aft of the conning tower, but at the same level as the deck: The Narwhal/Nautilus had the same protuberances (may be a bit smoother) but also a raised platform that placed the deck gun not at the deck level, but raised over it. You should therefore use the Argonaut as base, with the wide deck gun platform at the heigth of the deck, and then put a platform over it to get the Narwhal. You could have the models for the same effort by simply making the Argonaut from the earlier stage of the Narwhal. __________________ One day I will return to sea ...

06-25-09, 08:49 AM	#64
Hitman Pacific Aces Dev Team Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 6,109 Downloads: 109 Uploads: 2	Two more good drawings: Here you can see the for that the gun platform protusions have in the Argonaut: Here you can see how the saddle tanks are barely noticeable in the hull, and the raised deck gun platform in the Narwhal. This picture also provides a good idea of how the cut section of the boat looks like, and of the additional external torpedo tube: __________________ One day I will return to sea ...

06-25-09, 09:12 AM	#65
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,284 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	Hitman is correct, the hull is more surface ship like: __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

06-25-09, 09:30 AM	#66
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,284 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	Here is a good shot of the bulges in the hull that accomodate the gun platforms. __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

06-25-09, 09:35 AM	#67
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,284 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	double post __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

06-25-09, 09:52 AM	#68
Sledgehammer427 PacWagon Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Drinking coffee and staring at trees in Massachusetts Posts: 2,908 Downloads: 287 Uploads: 0	heh, blame Keltos's screen program, theres only ONE model. AVG. That Blue picture, of the nautilus, although diminitive in size and resolution, has....CROSS SECTIONS! something we badly needed. Hitman, thank you for the critique. It is easy enough for me to delete the Gun Deck of the narwhal we have and work out a simple argonaut (by simple, I mean, simpler than the narwhal ) I am having a few problems figuring out the gun deck. Let me explain: in all the refrence pictures you guys have shown us, you can see on the Narwhal that in between the guns, the hull slopes inward, but doesnt do that in any other places, and its hard to get it to do that in my 3d program. I am trying, believe me, Ive wanted a full-size Narwhal in SH4 since i found out there wasnt one. Heck, every time i saw someone else come and go with it, I said to myself "you know, im probably going to have to do this myself eventually" But anywho, I'll continue to mess around with it through the day. __________________ Cold Waters Voice Crew - Fire Control Officer Cmdr O. Myers - C/O USS Nautilus (SS-168) 114,000 tons sunk - 4 Spec Ops completed V-boat Nutcase - Need supplies? Japanese garrison on a small island in the way? Just give us a call! D4C!

06-25-09, 10:12 AM	#69
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,284 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	__________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

06-25-09, 11:22 AM	#75
keltos01 Silent Hunter Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Milan Italy Posts: 4,999 Downloads: 114 Uploads: 18	hull I modified the hull a bit, it this better ? keltos __________________ "Honorable Builder of Sinking Ships" Last edited by keltos01; 06-25-09 at 11:43 AM.