TMA: auto or do-it-yourself ?

Nexus7 · 07-11-05, 05:59 AM

Yeah i know, i might look like the "polls freak" but hey... i consider this an excellent and quick method to yeld statistics witch should help focusing for developments & maybe patches too... and since i care about subs only please respond sub related.

So here the pool:

sonar732 · 07-11-05, 06:39 AM

I'm still not that good with TMA..hence why I sit on sonar with headphones on..."sonar sup...transient bearing 325...classify as....singing???" :rotfl:

Kapitan · 07-11-05, 06:46 AM

cant work TMA so let some other mug do it for me

Bellman · 07-11-05, 07:01 AM

Good question.

As you know you could'nt rely on auto TMA in SC so my modus was struggle to acquire Manual TMA
skills in SP and use refined Auto TMA in MP. IMO the balance of helpful but not 'god-like' auto TMA was perfect.

In DW Auto TMA is just too good as SA pitch for the 'gamers' (?) I still try to use manual in SP.
Often there is just too much to do so you switch it on for a 'prop'.

I cannot yet access MP. but hope there will be others there who will compete sub v sub on Manual.

I guess the problem is that now we have lost the 'ideal' half-way house postion.

UglyMowgli · 07-11-05, 07:30 AM

All the interrest in SC and DW is the manual handling of station (except for active intercept!).

For the TMA, you can do faster and more precise firing solution in manual than IA.

And manual TMA is not difficult to learn, in 30 min you can learn how to do it and you get real pleasure when you make a TMA with an error less than 500 yards, I recognise I had a good teacher (Oko to name it!).

Nexus7 · 07-11-05, 07:43 AM

I play DW MP modus only. Whyle i found the aTMA in SC quite accurate, the aTMA in DW takes to long to update solutions to me.

While in SC the manual TMA was a struggle with the contacts pop-down list, making it a self-torture in case of many contacts, this bug has now been fixed (there are others new

)

But apart the aspect of the precision of the solution, there is a much more important (IMO) aspect.

With all already set on manual, I personally consider the realism of the dive dramatically raised again (by at least a factor 3 or 4) when I use manual TMA.

This is the only way i found to study my contact's attitude (in MP): it allows me to follow and eventually understand opponent's maneuvers, and on the long term, even predict his future maneuvers

... so to say sneak into opponent's mind

Also, it is only with mTMA that i come to use ALL the instrumentation aboard, because I am now working with the data "in the hands" and i know what i need much better

Yah... I like that a lot

Syxx_Killer · 07-11-05, 08:11 AM

I could do manual TMA, but I haven't done it in a while so I am VERY rusty. It was kind of fun to do. It would probably be good to do the training mission again in Sub Command. Is there a way to import a mission from SC to DW without installing SC?

Bellman · 07-11-05, 08:18 AM

It has been said that Manual TMA is an art which is easy to .learn. but hard to completely master.

Yep - Nexus7 you are right about that B awful SC process of trying to select a contact at the bottom of the list.

Through my rose-tinted spectacles looking at the past wonders of SC I had forgotten the shere frustration
of the way those contacts slipped away as you tried to select them.

I thought it was just me. :rotfl:

Another thing, as someone relatively new to DW, am I imagining it or does more info. now persist, compared with SC,
after one has washed-out at speed ?

Ula Jolly · 07-11-05, 09:21 AM

In the rare cases that I need to do anything but fire and run, and use DEMON, I manually refine the TMA. 97% of the time, it's automatic.

SquidB · 07-11-05, 09:56 AM

Manual all the way...makes life difficult but then if it were so easy would we be playing this sim at all?

MaHuJa · 07-11-05, 01:13 PM

There's an option lacking.

4) I would use manual but for bugs etc.

(and I include the ESP autotma in that, too)

Fandango · 07-11-05, 01:14 PM

It really depends on what's out there...some missions are VERY busy with ship traffic and really a bit too demandy...

Better to focus on other stations and give the TMA to the crew...that's what they's paid for, right?...

ShadowWulf · 07-11-05, 01:27 PM

I would like to one day refine TMA manualy. Yet I have tried learning TMA and have a basic idea of how it works yet i never get accurate TMA solutions and am far beter off letting the computer work it with its 80% or so accuracy. Also gives more time for watching sonar, preping firing solutions, etc.

Wim Libaers · 07-11-05, 02:49 PM

Manual. I won't claim to be very good at it, but my solutions are usually adequate to get a torpedo in range of a target (and it often happens to be the intended target).

The only problem I have is when TSHTF and everyone suddenly starts to move and shoot wildly in all directions for some reason (surely completely unrelated to a barrage of TASMs or ADCAPs in the recent past), there is a lot of stuff to do and sometimes I forget to keep something updated, only to have a Sovremenny zip right past me at flank speed (no, it was not an attack run, he didn't even detect me, I think he merely panicked and coincidentally came close). For situations like these (when there are large errors on the solutions), I think it would be useful to have an option making the map revert to bearing lines for contacts.

On the FFG, I use auto TMA, of course. That ruler is too frustrating to work with.

Molon Labe · 07-11-05, 05:59 PM

Since the auto TMA cheats, not using it puts you at a severe disadvantage. I try to find manual TMA matches when I can, but they're pretty rare.

View Poll Results: Playing the subs, how do you hanlde the TMA?
I let it on auto	27	60.00%
I start out with auto and manually refine when needed	10	22.22%
I play full manual modus	8	17.78%
Voters: 45. You may not vote on this poll

07-11-05, 05:59 AM	#1
Nexus7 Commander Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Switzerland Posts: 469 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	TMA: auto or do-it-yourself ? Yeah i know, i might look like the "polls freak" but hey... i consider this an excellent and quick method to yeld statistics witch should help focusing for developments & maybe patches too... and since i care about subs only please respond sub related. So here the pool:

07-11-05, 06:46 AM	#3
Kapitan Sub Test Pilot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK + Canada Posts: 7,130 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 7	cant work TMA so let some other mug do it for me __________________ DONT FORGET if you like a post to nominate it by using the blue diamond Find out about Museum Ships here: https://www.museumships.us/ Flickr for all my pictures: https://www.flickr.com/photos/131313936@N03/ Navy general board articles: https://www.navygeneralboard.com/author/aegis/

07-11-05, 07:30 AM	#5
UglyMowgli Grey Wolf Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 784 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	All the interrest in SC and DW is the manual handling of station (except for active intercept!). For the TMA, you can do faster and more precise firing solution in manual than IA. And manual TMA is not difficult to learn, in 30 min you can learn how to do it and you get real pleasure when you make a TMA with an error less than 500 yards, I recognise I had a good teacher (Oko to name it!). __________________ Modern Naval Warfare Community Manager

07-11-05, 09:21 AM	#9
Ula Jolly Samurai Navy Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Norway Posts: 567 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	In the rare cases that I need to do anything but fire and run, and use DEMON, I manually refine the TMA. 97% of the time, it's automatic. __________________ I shall punish yee, landlubber! C'mere for spankings and popsicles!

07-11-05, 06:39 AM	#2
sonar732 The Old Man Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Central MO Posts: 1,562 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	I'm still not that good with TMA..hence why I sit on sonar with headphones on..."sonar sup...transient bearing 325...classify as....singing???" :rotfl:

07-11-05, 07:01 AM	#4
Bellman Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,945 Downloads: 220 Uploads: 0	Good question. As you know you could'nt rely on auto TMA in SC so my modus was struggle to acquire Manual TMA skills in SP and use refined Auto TMA in MP. IMO the balance of helpful but not 'god-like' auto TMA was perfect. In DW Auto TMA is just too good as SA pitch for the 'gamers' (?) I still try to use manual in SP. Often there is just too much to do so you switch it on for a 'prop'. I cannot yet access MP. but hope there will be others there who will compete sub v sub on Manual. I guess the problem is that now we have lost the 'ideal' half-way house postion.

07-11-05, 07:43 AM	#6
Nexus7 Commander Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Switzerland Posts: 469 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	I play DW MP modus only. Whyle i found the aTMA in SC quite accurate, the aTMA in DW takes to long to update solutions to me. While in SC the manual TMA was a struggle with the contacts pop-down list, making it a self-torture in case of many contacts, this bug has now been fixed (there are others new ) But apart the aspect of the precision of the solution, there is a much more important (IMO) aspect. With all already set on manual, I personally consider the realism of the dive dramatically raised again (by at least a factor 3 or 4) when I use manual TMA. This is the only way i found to study my contact's attitude (in MP): it allows me to follow and eventually understand opponent's maneuvers, and on the long term, even predict his future maneuvers ... so to say sneak into opponent's mind Also, it is only with mTMA that i come to use ALL the instrumentation aboard, because I am now working with the data "in the hands" and i know what i need much better Yah... I like that a lot

07-11-05, 08:11 AM	#7
Syxx_Killer Admiral Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 2,387 Downloads: 21 Uploads: 0	I could do manual TMA, but I haven't done it in a while so I am VERY rusty. It was kind of fun to do. It would probably be good to do the training mission again in Sub Command. Is there a way to import a mission from SC to DW without installing SC?

07-11-05, 08:18 AM	#8
Bellman Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,945 Downloads: 220 Uploads: 0	It has been said that Manual TMA is an art which is easy to .learn. but hard to completely master. Yep - Nexus7 you are right about that B awful SC process of trying to select a contact at the bottom of the list. Through my rose-tinted spectacles looking at the past wonders of SC I had forgotten the shere frustration of the way those contacts slipped away as you tried to select them. I thought it was just me. :rotfl: Another thing, as someone relatively new to DW, am I imagining it or does more info. now persist, compared with SC, after one has washed-out at speed ?

07-11-05, 09:56 AM	#10
SquidB Officer Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Lytham UK Posts: 244 Downloads: 169 Uploads: 0	Manual all the way...makes life difficult but then if it were so easy would we be playing this sim at all?

07-11-05, 01:13 PM	#11
MaHuJa Sonar Guy Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: 59.96156N 11.02255E Posts: 385 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	There's an option lacking. 4) I would use manual but for bugs etc. (and I include the ESP autotma in that, too)

07-11-05, 01:14 PM	#12
Fandango Officer Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Trieste, Italy Posts: 236 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	It really depends on what's out there...some missions are VERY busy with ship traffic and really a bit too demandy... Better to focus on other stations and give the TMA to the crew...that's what they's paid for, right?... __________________ The true worth of a man is to be measured by the objects he pursues. - Marcus Aurelius

07-11-05, 01:27 PM	#13
ShadowWulf Seaman Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: USA Posts: 36 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I would like to one day refine TMA manualy. Yet I have tried learning TMA and have a basic idea of how it works yet i never get accurate TMA solutions and am far beter off letting the computer work it with its 80% or so accuracy. Also gives more time for watching sonar, preping firing solutions, etc. __________________ Old SeaDogs Fight Forever

07-11-05, 02:49 PM	#14
Wim Libaers Samurai Navy Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Flanders Posts: 569 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	Manual. I won't claim to be very good at it, but my solutions are usually adequate to get a torpedo in range of a target (and it often happens to be the intended target). The only problem I have is when TSHTF and everyone suddenly starts to move and shoot wildly in all directions for some reason (surely completely unrelated to a barrage of TASMs or ADCAPs in the recent past), there is a lot of stuff to do and sometimes I forget to keep something updated, only to have a Sovremenny zip right past me at flank speed (no, it was not an attack run, he didn't even detect me, I think he merely panicked and coincidentally came close). For situations like these (when there are large errors on the solutions), I think it would be useful to have an option making the map revert to bearing lines for contacts. On the FFG, I use auto TMA, of course. That ruler is too frustrating to work with.

07-11-05, 05:59 PM	#15
Molon Labe Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Along the Watchtower Posts: 3,810 Downloads: 27 Uploads: 5	Since the auto TMA cheats, not using it puts you at a severe disadvantage. I try to find manual TMA matches when I can, but they're pretty rare.