Obama supports "Ground Zero Mosque" (of course he does)

no one opposes muslums from building a mosque, there are hundreds of them that were built all over new york but to those who support building this mosque at ground zero, IMO then you have to also support a nazi monument at the concentration camps celebrating the killing of the jews and you must support a monument being built at pearl harbor celebrating the attack on our base there since they would symbolise the exact same purpose for being built, to cellebrate a victory over your enemy. and you can deny it all you want but this mosque is being built at this site for the sole reason to become a monument to the terrorists victory over america at that site, the Imam said it himself that he chose that site specifically because it would overlook the site of 9/11

and as for the private money being used to build the mosque, they have no money as of this moment, the Imam has only $18,000 which probably isnt enough to even cover the building permits but it has been reported that the US goverment will give them several million dollars to help build it through a goverment grant program. the remaining money will almost certainly come from terrorist orginazations since the modderate muslum groups have denied to fund it saying it is in bad taste to build there.

do those who speak about this as a religeous tollerance issue really doubt that this building will not be a muslum extremists tourist attraction to come see the site of the great victory over the great satin America. "come to pray to Ala at the very site where our brothers martered themselves for our cause" will be the banner they will hang over the door.

if you cant see this then you should go bring your family on a vacation to Iran and see if your "tollerance" will keep you out of jail or from being beheaded just for being an American. see what the muslum extremists really think about your warm and fuzzy tollerance as they laugh at you.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Webster

no one opposes muslums from building a mosque, there are hundreds of them that were built all over new york but to those who support building this mosque at ground zero, IMO then you have to also support a nazi monument at the concentration camps celebrating the killing of the jews and you must support a monument being built at pearl harbor celebrating the attack on our base there since they would symbolise the exact same purpose for being built, to cellebrate a victory over your enemy. and you can deny it all you want but this mosque is being built at this site for the sole reason to become a monument to the terrorists victory over america at that site, the Imam said it himself that he chose that site specifically because it would overlook the site of 9/11

and as for the private money being used to build the mosque, they have no money as of this moment, the Imam has only $18,000 which probably isnt enough to even cover the building permits but it has been reported that the US goverment will give them several million dollars to help build it through a goverment grant program. the remaining money will almost certainly come from terrorist orginazations since the modderate muslum groups have denied to fund it saying it is in bad taste to build there.

do those who speak about this as a religeous tollerance issue really doubt that this building will not be a muslum extremists tourist attraction to come see the site of the great victory over the great satin America. "come to pray to Ala at the very site where our brothers martered themselves for our cause" will be the banner they will hang over the door.

if you cant see this then you should go bring your family on a vacation to Iran and see if your "tollerance" will keep you out of jail or from being beheaded just for being an American. see what the muslum extremists really think about your warm and fuzzy tollerance as they laugh at you.

Oh come on Webster...it is a community center.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Webster

you must support a monument being built at pearl harbor celebrating the attack on our base there since they would symbolise the exact same purpose for being built, to cellebrate a victory over your enemy.

Already answered that one, and you're way off base.

and you can deny it all you want but this mosque is being built at this site for the sole reason to become a monument to the terrorists victory over america at that site, the Imam said it himself that he chose that site specifically because it would overlook the site of 9/11

Has anyone here actually tried to deny that? You're barking up the wrong tree.

and as for the private money being used to build the mosque, they have no money as of this moment, the Imam has only $18,000 which probably isnt enough to even cover the building permits but it has been reported that the US goverment will give them several million dollars to help build it through a goverment grant program. the remaining money will almost certainly come from terrorist orginazations since the modderate muslum groups have denied to fund it saying it is in bad taste to build there.

If the grant program is legitimate then they have to give it to whoever applies. That's the law. That the other money will "almost certainly" come from a terrorist organization is reprehensible. The problem is that we don't issue permits based on where money "might" come from, or even where it does come from.

do those who speak about this as a religeous tollerance issue really doubt that this building will not be a muslum extremists tourist attraction to come see the site of the great victory over the great satin America. "come to pray to Ala at the very site where our brothers martered themselves for our cause" will be the banner they will hang over the door.

if you cant see this then you should go bring your family on a vacation to Iran and see if your "tollerance" will keep you out of jail or from being beheaded just for being an American. see what the muslum extremists really think about your warm and fuzzy tollerance as they laugh at you.

And that's what I meant when I said you're barking up the wrong tree. Has one person here claimed it was about religious tolerance? Not that I've read. What it's about is whether the New York zoning commission has the legal right to issue the permit. Should they have? Not my call, or yours.

But since you raised the question of tolerance, what do you suggest we do? Drive all muslims from our shores? Act the way they do? Throw out what made America in the first place?

We react to acts that hurt us, not to beliefs that might. We have to prevent attempts on our freedoms, and be vigilant, but do you suggest that include denying religious freedom to those who disagree with us? If they turn violent, fight them. Otherwise you destroy the very thing you're trying to protect.

I oppose this mosque as much as any of you, simply because I agree the motivations of the people who want to build it are evil. But the law provides equality, no matter how we dislike it. Find a legal reason to deny it? Sure. And if that happens I'll support it. But for now the law has said they can build it, and for now that's what we have to live with.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Aramike

No where in the Constitution does it allow anyone to build/improve anything anywhere. Your assertion that it does either demontrates gross ignorance or gross misrepresentation.

Tenth Amendment. State and local laws are guaranteed precedence and protection against interference by the Federal Government. Hate them or not, these people have exactly the same right to build where they want that you or I do, as long as they don't break any law.

Perhaps is it that your politics are based upon nothing more than Bush-hating?)

Are your politics based upon nothing more than Obama-hating?

[JU_88]

He backs it possibly because....

1) Its not a Mosque?
2) Its not on ground zero?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...nd-zero-mosque

*Ducks for cover*

-----------------

Things seem awfully heated in America right now; so heated you could probably toast a marshmallow by jabbing it on a stick and holding it toward the Atlantic. Millions are hopping mad over the news that a bunch of triumphalist Muslim extremists are about to build a "victory mosque" slap bang in the middle of Ground Zero.

The planned "ultra-mosque" will be a staggering 5,600ft tall – more than five times higher than the tallest building on Earth – and will be capped with an immense dome of highly-polished solid gold, carefully positioned to bounce sunlight directly toward the pavement, where it will blind pedestrians and fry small dogs. The main structure will be delimited by 600 minarets, each shaped like an upraised middle finger, and housing a powerful amplifier: when synchronised, their combined sonic might will be capable of relaying the muezzin's call to prayer at such deafening volume, it will be clearly audible in the Afghan mountains, where thousands of terrorists are poised to celebrate by running around with scarves over their faces, firing AK-47s into the sky and yelling whatever the foreign word for "victory" is.

I'm exaggerating. But I'm only exaggerating a tad more than some of the professional exaggerators who initially raised objections to the "Ground Zero mosque". They keep calling it the "Ground Zero mosque", incidentally, because it's a catchy title that paints a powerful image – specifically, the image of a mosque at Ground Zero.
When I heard about it – in passing, in a soundbite – I figured it was a US example of the sort of inanely confrontational fantasy scheme Anjem Choudary might issue a press release about if he fancied winding up the tabloids for the 900th time this year. I was wrong. The "Ground Zero mosque" is a genuine proposal, but it's slightly less provocative than its critics' nickname makes it sound. For one thing, it's not at Ground Zero. Also, it isn't a mosque.

Wait, it gets duller. It's not being built by extremists either. Cordoba House, as it's known, is a proposed Islamic cultural centre, which, in addition to a prayer room, will include a basketball court, restaurant, and swimming pool. Its aim is to improve inter-faith relations. It'll probably also have comfy chairs and people who smile at you when you walk in, the monsters.

To get to the Cordoba Centre from Ground Zero, you'd have to walk in the opposite direction for two blocks, before turning a corner and walking a bit more. The journey should take roughly two minutes, or possibly slightly longer if you're heading an angry mob who can't hear your directions over the sound of their own enraged bellowing.
Perhaps spatial reality functions differently on the other side of the Atlantic, but here in London, something that is "two minutes' walk and round a corner" from something else isn't actually "in" the same place at all. I once had a poo in a pub about two minutes' walk from Buckingham Palace. I was not subsequently arrested and charged with crapping directly onto the Queen's pillow. That's how "distance" works in Britain. It's also how distance works in America, of course, but some people are currently pretending it doesn't, for daft political ends.
New York being a densely populated city, there are lots of other buildings and businesses within two blocks of Ground Zero, including a McDonald's and a Burger King, neither of which has yet been accused of serving milkshakes and fries on hallowed ground. Regardless, for the opponents of Cordoba House, two blocks is too close, period. Frustratingly, they haven't produced a map pinpointing precisely how close is OK.

That's literally all I'd ask them in an interview. I'd stand there pointing at a map of the city. Would it be offensive here? What about here? Or how about way over there? And when they finally picked a suitable spot, I'd ask them to draw it on the map, sketching out roughly how big it should be, and how many windows it's allowed to have. Then I'd hand them a colour swatch and ask them to decide on a colour for the lobby carpet. And the conversation would continue in this vein until everyone in the room was in tears. Myself included.
That hasn't happened. Instead, 70% of Americans are opposed to the "Ground Zero mosque", doubtless in many cases because they've been led to believe it literally is a mosque at Ground Zero. And if not . . . well, it must be something significant. Otherwise why would all these pundits be so angry about it? And why would anyone in the media listen to them with a straight face?

According to a recent poll, one in five Americans believes Barack Obama is a Muslim, even though he isn't. A quarter of those who believe he's a Muslim also claimed he talks about his faith too much. Americans aren't dumb. Clearly these particular Americans have either gone insane or been seriously misled. Where are they getting their information?
Sixty per cent said they learned it from the media. Which means it's time for the media to give up.

Seriously, broadcasters, journalists: just give up now. Because either you're making things worse, or no one's paying attention anyway. May as well knock back a few Jagermeisters, unplug the autocue, and just sit there dumbly repeating whichever reality-warping meme the far right wants to go viral this week. What's that? Obama is Gargamel and he's killing all the Smurfs? Sod it. Whatever. Roll titles.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by JU_88

He backs it possibly because....

1) Its not a Mosque?
2) Its not on ground zero?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...nd-zero-mosque

*Ducks for cover*

No. Freedom of religion. The wisdom of building this "community center" at this spot he will not comment on.

[JU_88]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

No. Freedom of religion. The wisdom of building this "community center" at this spot he will not comment on.

Sure but its either on ground zero or its not. (read the full artical)
If you think about it, there was already a mosque inside the WTC building prior to the destruction of the complex at the hands of Islamic fundmentalists.
Just for arguments sake - if 9/11 had been carried out by extremist Christians does that mean no Church would be allowed to be built nearby?

Probabaly not, Im sure a people would seperate those responsible from the majority of Christians - who are good people.
Likewise there is more than one flavour of Muslim...

But its your country - so whatever man.

I cant help but feel that all this resentment towards Islam....
-Is EXACTLY what the 9/11 organsiers wanted.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

What scum.

Fascinating. He never once said he supported the mosque itself. As Safe-Keeper pointed out, the only thing he supported was the Constitution.

So upholding the Constitution makes him scum? Fascinating.

[nikimcbee]

Let's test his love for the Constitution Time to build a large synagouge, and large Christian Church (pick your denomination) all next to each other. We can celabrate all faiths.

...with a Texas BBQ across the street for post service dinner.

[Bubblehead1980]

This is not about the constitution.This is about stopping a mosque which will be led by a radical Imam from being built close to Ground Zero.This is about stopping a gigantic "**** YOU" from being built near "Ground Zero" Liberals so obessessed with "tolerance" of an intolerant religion are just ignorant of what this mosque actually is.Pretty much what is going on here.Muslims know they can't win be traditional methods, they are using our "tolerance" against us and it is just disgusting.I promise you our founding fathers would have found this unacceptable.Funny Obama pushes an unconstitutional health care law yet invokes the constitution in the video.Scum, nothing more.

Say what you want about GW Bush but he loved America and would not support this crap as President. I was not a big fan, he let things get so bad America lost it's damn mind for a bit and elected Obama.Kind of like getting super drunk, letting your standards go down and sleeping with a fat girl one night, then waking up and saying never evvver again.Pretty much what happened to America in 2008.Bush was the cruel bitch ex girlfriend who caused the driniking which led to the chubby chase that one night Live and Learn.

Again I'm not shocked given Obama's muslim heritage.No I do not believe he is a practicing muslim but his backround certainly skews his view of whats right for the US.Of course he thinks there is something wrong with America anyway(other than the massive debt he continues to run up).

Second topic on this subject and the arguements against replacing the existing mosque with a new mosque are an even bigger pile of excrement than in the last topic.
Well done Bubblehead

[Ishmael]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

This is not about the constitution.This is about stopping a mosque which will be led by a radical Imam from being built close to Ground Zero.This is about stopping a gigantic "**** YOU" from being built near "Ground Zero" Liberals so obessessed with "tolerance" of an intolerant religion are just ignorant of what this mosque actually is.Pretty much what is going on here.Muslims know they can't win be traditional methods, they are using our "tolerance" against us and it is just disgusting.I promise you our founding fathers would have found this unacceptable.Funny Obama pushes an unconstitutional health care law yet invokes the constitution in the video.Scum, nothing more.

Say what you want about GW Bush but he loved America and would not support this crap as President. I was not a big fan, he let things get so bad America lost it's damn mind for a bit and elected Obama.Kind of like getting super drunk, letting your standards go down and sleeping with a fat girl one night, then waking up and saying never evvver again.Pretty much what happened to America in 2008.Bush was the cruel bitch ex girlfriend who caused the driniking which led to the chubby chase that one night Live and Learn.

Again I'm not shocked given Obama's muslim heritage.No I do not believe he is a practicing muslim but his backround certainly skews his view of whats right for the US.Of course he thinks there is something wrong with America anyway(other than the massive debt he continues to run up).

So the solution is obvious. Let them build the mosque, then send in armies of Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons in to plaster the place with copies of "The Watchtower" and the Book of Moroni. Annoy the Muslims into tolerance. Hell, maybe we can get Fred Phelps and his church to show up.

as Aramis once said, "But of course. What do you think Religious wars are ALL ABOUT?"

[nikimcbee]

Originally Posted by Ishmael

So the solution is obvious. Let them build the mosque, then send in armies of Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons in to plaster the place with copies of "The Watchtower" and the Book of Moroni. Annoy the Muslims into tolerance. Hell, maybe we can get Fred Phelps and his church to show up.

Ha, my thoughts exactly. My mom and I argued about this this morning. I just can't escape this subject. The thing that makes me laugh the most at this whole subject is the left's (since they are in charge of everything) new found love of protecting religious rights.

So when christmas time rolls around we can put a big nativity scene there right? The ACLU will have no issues, right?

Do they have the right to: Yes
Should they: No

I wonder if there are any muslims that are against this?

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

This is not about the constitution.This is about stopping a mosque which will be led by a radical Imam from being built close to Ground Zero.

No, this is about you being willing to throw out what America stands for because someone's religion offends you. You can't accuse Liberals of ignoring the Constitution and then whine when they uphold it.

This is about stopping a gigantic "**** YOU" from being built near "Ground Zero" Liberals so obessessed with "tolerance" of an intolerant religion are just ignorant of what this mosque actually is.Pretty much what is going on here.

1. You need to read the rules of the forum concerning swearing and 'fake swearing'.

2. I agree about the "tolerance" problem. Problem is, the law is the law, and unless it applies equally to everyone we are no longer Americans. You can't destroy the village in order to save it.

Muslims know they can't win be traditional methods, they are using our "tolerance" against us and it is just disgusting.

I agree, but you want to become them, and that's even worse.

I promise you our founding fathers would have found this unacceptable.Funny Obama pushes an unconstitutional health care law yet invokes the constitution in the video.Scum, nothing more.

And yet again you pretend to know what the Founders would think. Can you supply anything they wrote that would back up your claim?

And yet again you use the term "scum" to describe someone who believes differently than you. I asked you before to give actual evidence as opposed to childish diatribe, and you haven't yet. You seem to be the one who would destroy what America stands for in order to save it. That doesn't work.

[Bilge_Rat]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Say what you want about GW Bush but he loved America and would not support this crap as President.

President's Greeting for Ramadan - November 5, 2002



I send greetings to Muslims in the United States and around the world as you observe the holy month of Ramadan.

Islam is a peace-loving faith that is practiced by more than one billion people, including millions of American Muslims. These proud citizens contribute to the diversity that makes our country strong, and the United States is grateful for the friendship and support of many Muslim Nations that are vital partners in the global coalition to fight against terrorism.

The Qur'an teaches that Ramadan is a time for fasting, prayer, worship, and contemplation. Muslims observe this month by renewing their dedication to caring for those in need, doing good deeds, and strengthening family and community ties. These actions reflect many of the values that Muslims share with people of other faiths across our Nation and around the world, including courage, compassion, and service.

America remains committed to freedom, justice, and opportunity for all people. During this season of reverence and examination, we continue to work together for a future of peace, tolerance, and understanding.

Laura joins me in sending our best wishes for a blessed time. May you be well during Ramadan and throughout the coming year.


GEORGE W. BUSH

...whatever...