Gun Control thread (merged many)

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Webster

there is the big hole found in all pro anti gun arguments, criminals DO NOT FOLLOW LAWS so gun bans only disarm law abiding citizens and prevents them from being able to defend themselves and family and makes them easy prey for any criminal.

its so silly that people still think laws can change how criminals behave, criminals by definition do not follow or obey laws so laws mean nothing to them be it 1 or 1,000 laws saying they cant do something

This is true, although there are some things to take into question.
If one cannot trust the police to catch criminals then why do the police exist?
Furthermore, one does not know who will become a criminal until after they have performed their act. Now, say for example a man robs a bank with an assault rifle and kills a teller. Up until that day, the man was a perfectly upright citizen with a legal rifle, however...I don't know...perhaps he lost his job and couldn't afford to pay something, or he got himself into a tight corner that he saw that the only way out was to commit a felony and hope to reap its rewards. Now, a person is dead and only now can the police act and confiscate his weapon, when it's too late.
Now, if a ban or a tougher regulation had come into place before hand, then the man would either have to break the law to obtain the weapon, or use a different weapon, in the first instance there is the opportunity to detain the man before the crime is committed, in the latter, sadly, short of banning or regulating tougher ALL offensive weapons then there is not, however depending on the weapon it makes the job harder (after all, unless you're pretty good with a throwing knife, then a knife is not a ranged weapon and you have to get close to a person to use it which opens up a window of self-defence or indeed prevents the incident entirely [through the use of, for example, a stab proof window like they have on London buses]) than it does with a gun where depending on the weapon, all you have to do is point and click.

Now, obviously I have argued for and against a ban or tougher regulation on assault rifles and guns in general on several occasions on this forum, because I can see where people are coming from, and in many instances it's not so much the fact that it is a weapon being taken away as it is a right given by the amendment of the founding document of the American nation. When you tie this into the slippery slope started by the PATRIOT act then it's understandable why people are so on edge about the whole affair. Likewise, it's understandable that many people in America are very much tired of seeing dead school children on the evening news and they seek for the nearest and easiest object available to counter that.
What neither side seems to be able to come to terms with, in this clash over firearms, is that it is not the firearm that is the problem, it merely exacerbates the existing problem which is a polarised culture with a lack of mental health care and facilities.
There has become a very much 'them or us' sort of attitude generated by Americans over the past ten years, obviously this is a generalisation and I don't tar everyone with the same brush, but it's the impression that I'm sure that many outside America have got, and I'm sure that some inside it have as well. There's no middle ground, no common ground for people to agree on or appetite for compromise. The internet has not helped in this, radical ideas are much easier to spread now, it's a lot like when the printing press was first invented and you had a massive upsurge in groups like the Levellers, Diggers and the Quakers, because ideas were a lot easier to exchange and were no longer limited to one set of people telling you the same thing over and over. As such a more fractured society has emerged, just as it did back then. War and the conflict against the Muslim faith has also leant its part into the increasing radicalisation of our society, and it has all lead to nations of people who range between depression, naivety or anger.
So...what do you do?
Well, leaving the firearm issue aside, obviously a move towards greater tolerance is required, as well as better mental health awareness and services. When the Sandy Hook massacre took place, there was a good discussion on here about the deterioration of mental health care in America, and I think that this would be a more productive avenue to explore than simply taking assault weapons out of the equation, because as it has been shown before, that does not work.
There has already been an Assault Weapons Ban...it did not stop school shootings, it did not even lead to a decrease in them, in short it did nothing.

However, to the men and women in office pressing for one, it is a helpful popularity boost amongst their core voters who are calling for one because they are told by the media that is what will help, and because there is no middle ground in America, the extreme left will read and watch their media and believe what it tells them, and the extreme right will read and watch their media and believe what it tells them, and the problem shall remain at an impasse because both sides are fighting over the wrong issue.
In short, when both left and right are wrong, where do you go from there?

Please, American politics, find a middle ground...come back to it...