One less F-14 to worry about.

01-27-12, 01:56 AM

Let us not forget the ridiculously over-drilled Prussian goose-stepping automaton of 1914 or the inept Jap, night blind, incapable of handling complex machinery and flying pathetic copies of Western aircraft in 1941.

Warplanes tend to be pampered and the fact that these have been flying without any manufacturer support for over 40-years should say something regarding core avionics and crew competence.

We mock them at our peril and underestimating a potential enemy has never been a good idea as the above examples show. They may well be paper-airplanes but it's a tremendously bad idea to treat that assumption as fact.

Jimbuna · 01-27-12, 08:13 AM

I'm suprised they've admitted publicly to losing one

TLAM Strike · 01-27-12, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbuna

I'm suprised they've admitted publicly to losing one

Possible that someone got it on their camera phone, and they had no choice. It happens a lot over there, the Iranians love their camera phones:

Jimbuna · 01-27-12, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike

Possible that someone got it on their camera phone, and they had no choice. It happens a lot over there, the Iranians love their camera phones:

That second link was very impressive

Bubblehead1980 · 01-27-12, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Randomizer

Let us not forget the ridiculously over-drilled Prussian goose-stepping automaton of 1914 or the inept Jap, night blind, incapable of handling complex machinery and flying pathetic copies of Western aircraft in 1941.

Warplanes tend to be pampered and the fact that these have been flying without any manufacturer support for over 40-years should say something regarding core avionics and crew competence.

We mock them at our peril and underestimating a potential enemy has never been a good idea as the above examples show. They may well be paper-airplanes but it's a tremendously bad idea to treat that assumption as fact.

Well said

CCIP · 01-27-12, 11:41 AM

Well, in my case the comments aren't meant to disparage Iran so much as scratch my head at how far they're willing to bend backwards to operate a complex, expensive system without support from the manufacturer and with improvised weapons. That sort of creativity makes good sense with cheap, simple (even if somewhat ridiculous) systems, of which their speedboats may well be an example, but taken on the scale of the F-14 which is obviously meant to oppose first-rate aircraft of their enemies (whether they be Israel, the Arabs, Pakistan, or the US), it just seems like a gigantic waste. It's a lot of work to keep up a system that will immediately fall in the face of its opponents (like the properly-supported, armed and modernized F-15s and F-16s that all of their obvious opponents have), and may well be keeping away resources and manpower from simpler, cheaper, and more probably efficient aircraft. It made sense when it was acquired to face Iraqi MiG-25s head to head, and beat on other less sophisticated Soviet-made aircraft, but it does not stack up against what it faces now. More than a paper tiger, to me it seems like a white elephant.

Stealhead · 01-27-12, 12:38 PM

I am not so concerned about the offensive ability of Iran but I think it would be very unwise to underestimate their defensive ability.The obvious fact that these little covert attacks have been occurring on their nuclear program should make it pretty clear that some nations with very capable air forces very capable strike abilities are preferring the covert route over a direct attack unless there is no other effective recourse.
It is not like the old Iraqi program that was easy to attack and got taken out by the IDAF back in the early 80's.The Iranian facilities are very well protected from air attack just in their construction even if a strike got through it can not be be granted that it will destroy the whole thing in one shot the you are screwed because they will simply spread it out all over the place you only get one good shot.Everyone with half a brain knows that Israel is hard core into preemptive destruction of a danger to itself if they have done nothing yet then it means that they consider current actions to be effective enough or things have not reached a point that makes them wish to take action. Personally I think the entire thing is saber rattling by all sides.Iran knows that it would be wiped off the map if it ever did use a weapon and more than likely if they even got close they know that the program would get destroyed.I think Iran does it to please the hard core regime supporting Iranians.Who cares what they have if they must kill their own people when they protest then their government is weak and will crumble from within sooner or later and the F-14s will see another change in government.

01-27-12, 08:13 AM	#2
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,979 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	I'm suprised they've admitted publicly to losing one __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

01-27-12, 11:41 AM	#6
CCIP Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Waterloo, Canada Posts: 8,700 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 2	Well, in my case the comments aren't meant to disparage Iran so much as scratch my head at how far they're willing to bend backwards to operate a complex, expensive system without support from the manufacturer and with improvised weapons. That sort of creativity makes good sense with cheap, simple (even if somewhat ridiculous) systems, of which their speedboats may well be an example, but taken on the scale of the F-14 which is obviously meant to oppose first-rate aircraft of their enemies (whether they be Israel, the Arabs, Pakistan, or the US), it just seems like a gigantic waste. It's a lot of work to keep up a system that will immediately fall in the face of its opponents (like the properly-supported, armed and modernized F-15s and F-16s that all of their obvious opponents have), and may well be keeping away resources and manpower from simpler, cheaper, and more probably efficient aircraft. It made sense when it was acquired to face Iraqi MiG-25s head to head, and beat on other less sophisticated Soviet-made aircraft, but it does not stack up against what it faces now. More than a paper tiger, to me it seems like a white elephant. __________________ There are only forty people in the world and five of them are hamburgers. -Don Van Vliet (aka Captain Beefheart)

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Switch to Linear Mode Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

01-27-12, 01:56 AM	#1
Randomizer Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Let us not forget the ridiculously over-drilled Prussian goose-stepping automaton of 1914 or the inept Jap, night blind, incapable of handling complex machinery and flying pathetic copies of Western aircraft in 1941. Warplanes tend to be pampered and the fact that these have been flying without any manufacturer support for over 40-years should say something regarding core avionics and crew competence. We mock them at our peril and underestimating a potential enemy has never been a good idea as the above examples show. They may well be paper-airplanes but it's a tremendously bad idea to treat that assumption as fact.

01-27-12, 12:38 PM	#7
Stealhead Navy Seal Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Kentucky Posts: 5,421 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	I am not so concerned about the offensive ability of Iran but I think it would be very unwise to underestimate their defensive ability.The obvious fact that these little covert attacks have been occurring on their nuclear program should make it pretty clear that some nations with very capable air forces very capable strike abilities are preferring the covert route over a direct attack unless there is no other effective recourse. It is not like the old Iraqi program that was easy to attack and got taken out by the IDAF back in the early 80's.The Iranian facilities are very well protected from air attack just in their construction even if a strike got through it can not be be granted that it will destroy the whole thing in one shot the you are screwed because they will simply spread it out all over the place you only get one good shot.Everyone with half a brain knows that Israel is hard core into preemptive destruction of a danger to itself if they have done nothing yet then it means that they consider current actions to be effective enough or things have not reached a point that makes them wish to take action. Personally I think the entire thing is saber rattling by all sides.Iran knows that it would be wiped off the map if it ever did use a weapon and more than likely if they even got close they know that the program would get destroyed.I think Iran does it to please the hard core regime supporting Iranians.Who cares what they have if they must kill their own people when they protest then their government is weak and will crumble from within sooner or later and the F-14s will see another change in government.