Nazi symbols and "immersion": boundaries?

[Rockin Robbins]

My only personal negative position in the use of Nazi flags, SS ensignia, or possibly other specific Nazi-related items I might not be thinking of is in items used as personal identification, signature banners, language, such as "Sieg Heil" being used as the traditional opening to someone's posts, etc.

As far as the swastika having benign applications, that is just a straw man because the Nazi flag has definite colors, proportions, thickness of line, etc, which render it an unmistakable and unique symbol of Nazi thuggery. Nobody would mistake the pre-WWII Thunderbirds' swastika for a Nazi symbol, or any of the other swastikas put forward as establishing the harmlessness of the Nazi flag.

That swastika or Nazi flag, when used as part of a ship or submarine, flying from a flagpole in port as part of the game says nothing of the personal identification of the person playing the game. It is part of the environment within which he plays and is historically justified so far as my opinion is concerned. The German nation has other views on that, but even they nuance their position. However you take a position, there will be uncomfortable but permitted usages which will always be in question.

However, when you affect a signature picture, or an icon, or a name on the board, which incorporates Nazi symbolism, you are saying something about yourself and your opinion of those symbols. Showing yourself as a smiling officer, decorated by the Fuhrer, pretty wife in uniform under a flowing Nazi flag with manly Latin slogans is glorifying yourself in the reflected "glory" of the Reich. That says things to people that you might not want to say. I say, and Ducimus said, and the German people say, and U-Boat veterans say that use of Nazi symbolism is over the line. Why? Because Nazi ideology is being used as personal identification, implying that you personally endorse that horse squeeze.

As far as characterizing certain emblems as male bovine excrement, that was a quote from Ducimus and does not imply that I have that opinion. I personally don't have a problem with historically accurate uniforms, medals, flags or insignia within the game. I have a problem when people personally tie themselves to those symbols in a way that implies agreement with those values. The signatures I called attention to do just that, just as someone with the handle "JewKiller" would. NOBODY would consent to that, but the flag in the signature says the same thing.

Many have perverted my position to pretend I am saying things I am not. I realize it is not done honestly, but just to provoke heat. My position is born of the opinions of the survivors of the war who actually ran the U-Boats, of the citizens of the country responsible for 100 million deaths. They agree with me. Actually it is I who agree with them.

If you were to be in the same room with a U-Boat sailor and spouted nonsense about how the Nazi flag is just a piece of cloth that is harmless and you think it is cool to use it as your personally identifying signature picture on the Internet, you would not be in the same room for long. You might not be in the same WORLD for long. You would never forget what he said and did next, I promise.

When I say U-Boat veterans savagely deny any heroism on their part during the war, I am vastly understating their position and their passion.

@razark: Where the hell did all these ants come from????