Crits/Comments about US Navy

[Sailor Steve]

You know, I just skimmed his post. Thanks AVG for quoting the whole thing so I read it again, and thanks USLC for showing it the way it is.

AVG is right, Chad, The Marine is the man to talk to.

[Kapitan]

Originally Posted by Chad

As of lately, my girlfriend/fiance left me about a month before we were supposed to get married, which completely flipped my life upside down. My grades dropped in school, and my work performance didn't exactly hold up to par. But I did get a raise last week which was nice.

But that's not why I'm writing now, I still seem to be in a rut. Here I am, about to turn 20 on the 29th this month, and I feel my life is going nowhere.

I don't have the same output on life like i did before. Before the break up I could play SH3, work on my little indie game, and watch Das Boot 20x a month. Now I can barely even get on the computer without feeling like a low-down, piece of **** sloth that has no life.

When I'm not at school or work, I'm home alone, and that's probably the worst thing for me. The quiet just makes me feel lonely and depressed. I have friends yes, but due to their schedules usually conflicting with mine it usually takes some planning and time to get together, and it's not altogether that often.

Basically I've decided to make some changes in my life, and this afternoon I called a Navy Recruiter to come out and sit down with me and my family and talk about joining. This is where I'd like your guys opinions, what do you think about a college student with a part-time job at Wal-Mart in Electronics still living at home with his parents joining the navy?

I'm not altogether out of shape, I used to play football in high school but lost a lot of my muscle mass and weight, and couldn't run a mile under 10 minutes anymore. But I'm still "in shape" if you get what I'm saying. I could start running again, and get back in shape before boot camp, or whatever the navy has. So the physical part wouldn't be that difficult. Also I'm good at making friends, so in training I could make and meet friends, and since we'd be together almost all the time I wouldn't feel lonely.

I'm a good fast learner, and have always loved the military, from the civil war onwards, and I think that this would be a good direction to head my life into. The more i think about it the more excited I get, but I know a lot of you were in the navy before, and want to know what you think.

Thanks for your help,
Chad

Been there Still there not out of it yet.

I get around the lonelyness by working i think i should have worked a bit harder to win over the navy to get in faster but we all make mistakes find something you like do it for a while.

If you go looking for a new girl dont bother she wont come girls are like busses turn up in your life unexpectedly.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

You know, I just skimmed his post. Thanks AVG for quoting the whole thing so I read it again, and thanks USLC for showing it the way it is.

AVG is right, Chad, The Marine is the man to talk to.

Yep, if you want my .02 cents worth. Maybe even a phone call to each other. Just post the numbers on email or PM. Wide open on the forums, everyone will call you....collect

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

That was a little harsh. He didn't say he wanted to join JUST because he was looking for firends.
Why are you assuming that Mr. Chad is looking to join the military because he pines for his fiancee' or is only turning to it in desperation?

He is looking at the military as an option because he feels like his life is going nowhere and is looking for some direction. He already said he has always loved the military. Skybird, you make it sound like he is inherently wrong for considering it, given his current state.

It was meant to be a bit harsh, and I'll stick to every single word of it: for several reasons that owe their existence to what he said about himself, and the fact that joining the military never should be an easy decision. Direction you can find in many other jobs as well, and if serving is what he wants, there are firefighters, policemen, medics, ambulance drivers, SAR rescue flyers... Being soldier is different to any of these, so he better is sure about his motives and has no illusions about what he is getting into. Soldiers - warriors! - kill and get killed, in this all branches of the armed forces are the same, call it what you want, this is what it comes down to. And this is what you should be clear about and have no illusions or stupid self-deceptions about. Nobody should get persuaded or confirmed to join the military. He should come to that all by himself. Only once he is into it and finds it is what he was looking for, you support him in that role, as a friend. Confirming or persuading him in advance is almost criminal negligence.

[UnderseaLcpl]

Originally Posted by Skybird

It was meant to be a bit harsh, and I'll stick to every single word of it: for several reasons that owe their existence to what he said about himself, and the fact that joining the military never should be an easy decision. Direction you can find in many other jobs as well, and if serving is what he wants, there are firefighters, policemen, medics, ambulance drivers, SAR rescue flyers... Being soldier is different to any of these, so he better is sure about his motives and has no illusions about what he is getting into. Soldiers - warriors! - kill and get killed, in this all branches of the armed forces are the same, call it what you want, this is what it comes down to. And this is what you should be clear about and have no illusions or stupid self-deceptions about. Nobody should get persuaded or confirmed to join the military. He should come to that all by himself. Only once he is into it and finds it is what he was looking for, you support him in that role, as a friend. Confirming or persuading him in advance is almost criminal negligence.

As much as I like skybird I am not even going to get in to this. This is Chad's personal issue. If he would like to contact me via pm I will describe in full detail the horrors of war and the likleyhood he will see them based on his choice of occupational specialty.

I am just trying to help him make a decision. As you said, skybird, the choice is his. I have related my experiences to him so he can judge whether or not it is right for him.

The reason I found your post a bit abrasive was because it sounded like an attack on his personal character. To me, it sounded like you were saying he had no friends and that his reasons for joining were wrong.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree there but I can assure you that, should Chad decide to ask me for advice, I will not omit any details concerning what he will encounter in his service, be it in a non-combat or combat arm of our forces

Firstly, saying that joining the military will result in one's premature death, even eventually, is nonsense. Most of the military never even sees combat. Once again I am happy to offer advice if Chad chooses to look at a combat occupational specialty.

I will not post details concerning combat specialties here. And I am sure that other members have even more horrific stories than mine. If Chad is interested I will tell him of my experiences.

Overall, your post seemed to indicate that he was intersted in the military because of personal failures. That is simply not true. From what I gather, our friend is simply looking for some direction and has considered the military, I will offer him all the advice I can on that option.

[Airmail]

Im the same ages as you mate, the trick is not to focus your life on having girlfriends. Went through a period when I was 18/19 (I actually somehow ended up in the Foreign Legions basic training before I ran off...having wondered around much of Europe by myself which incidently made me stronger and happier with being alone and far less reliant on other people) very much like youself. I have found the way out of it is to find a subject I really enjoy which for me is Orthodontistry/Craniofacial issues and become an expert at it. I want to become the damn best at what I do so when I'm older I can have a nice old house in the country. Somewhere in the Cotswolds or anywhere as pretty. I want to be able to send my childeren to a great school and watch them grow up. I want to do well so that I can bag a wife thats on the same level as me. Whats more is I want to make a difference.

Quit thinking about the women, get an education. Go to college. Quit giving a damn what other people think about you and go out of your way to be the best. Work first, falling in love second.

From my travelling about I've found that it's far easier to make friends when you hit the road and go to some place new than it is to make them in an area you've lived in for a while. If you get the balls to just get up and leave you soon find new friends. You have to find jobs on the way and places to stay, this forces you to meet people. Then your invited out to go for drinks in the evenings. Get some balls. I've been to places you havn't been to yet, depression which I can only describe as utter and total blackness. Getting hospitalized for anxiety attacks. You might want to guess why I want my career to be in Orthdontistry..

In the Navy you'll just have to pick up soap and mop floors. Join the Paratroopers if you want more adrenalin and skirts.

[Airmail]

Oh and If you love the sea did you know you can get posts onboard merchant ships, cruise ships or even yeah thats right Tall Ships/Luxury Yaughts without any qualifications and you can even get qualifications from doing them.

Would mean your not tied to a military contract

You don't always need direction in your life, be patient! I had no direction and went rambling round Europe, and North Africa. I set off with next to no money working along the way, going where ever the hell I felt like. I learnt more about myself and funnily enough came back after what was labelled a "cop out" by my parents with more direction than ever. The whole experience changed me, the memories of the people and events that happend along the way will always stay with me.

"Not all those who wander are lost" Tolkien

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

Man, I have to be 30 to know how dumb I am? I didn't think I could get any dumber. That's depressing

It gets worse! :rotfl:

-S

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Most of what you need to consider has been said, so I'll just calm your mind on one thing: Don't worry about whether you're in shape or not. Boot camp will take care of that.

@ Subman1: You are so absolutely right on the "know-it-all" thing. Awhile back on these very boards I repeated the old phrase "The more I learn, the less I know." Somebody came back with "That makes no sense." The only reply I could think of was "That's because you're young and still know everything.":rotfl:

I hear ya! The older I get, the more I realize that I don't know squat! I mean I'm good in some areas, namely electronics for instance, but ya know someone is always got a leg up on me in some form or fasion there and the older I get, I realize that someone will 'always' have a leg up on me in some form or fasion in any field I happen to be in, regardless if people think I am the person that knows it all or not!

I chock it up to life. You may be the best shot, but someone out there can out do you!

-S

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

As much as I like skybird I am not even going to get in to this.

Why the reply, then?

The reason I found your post a bit abrasive was because it sounded like an attack on his personal character. To me, it sounded like you were saying he had no friends and that his reasons for joining were wrong.

No. He indicated that he is still young, that his fiance has left him, that he feels confused or irritated of seeing not where his life is going to, and that he finds it hard to bear being alone at home. and this is what I am basing on in my reply. I should add that as a former meditation teacher for several years, and a former psychologist, I have been adressed by questions like this quite often, and see him also from a perspective of these former experiences, therefore. I mention therapeutical cruelty - and I meant it like that, exactly.

I also wonder that people get public about such private things and make it known to anonymous masses of foreign people they know nothing about. this again is no attack on him, but it influences my impression of the situation and age he is in.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree there but I can assure you that, should Chad decide to ask me for advice, I will not omit any details concerning what he will encounter in his service, be it in a non-combat or combat arm of our forces

You must assure me nothing, since we have no quarrel with each other. Chad is free to do whatever he wants, and if he asks it is only fair to give him the answers he asks for. He does not need neither me nor you to tell hiom that he is free to do what he wants - he only needs to take that freedom, and must not allow anybody trying to persuade him into something. I wanted him to become aware of that, if he isn't. And I just want to make him aware of some things that I already have mentioned now, that self-recognition is not possible without accepting to bear one's own presence and be alone a while, that seeking people can be a trick to avoid hurting questions and doubts, and that becoming so public about details of his life possibly already is part of his answer he seeks. and this I say as a former psychologist. For me his posting and questions were not only techncially about the navy. If that would have been all, he would not have needed to post half of his biography.

Firstly, saying that joining the military will result in one's premature death, even eventually, is nonsense. Most of the military never even sees combat. Once again I am happy to offer advice if Chad chooses to look at a combat occupational specialty.

I think I made it clear what I think about this. I am no enemy of a military, I even vote in favour of having a strong mlitary (which makes me many enemies here in Germany). I just can'T stand it to present it like a job option like any other, and hiding it from people that as a soldier you have to consider that eventually you will find yourself in a situation were you are expected to kill and cause harm - or suffer the one or the other yourself. You call that nonsens - and I call it irresponsible that you call it nonsens. even a technician never touching a wepak nat the front - assists in killing getting done, and destructio0n. And he can become a taregt for the enemy as well. Being soldier is no adventure holiday, and its purpose is not to sing songs by the cmpafire and have a good time in the jungle. It is about preparing to kill and destroy, and eventually carry that out in reality. That's what the military is there for. Call it peacekeeoping, or limited operation, or surgical strike - it is killing and destroying, and getting killed and hurt, preparing for it, and planning for it. Monks, philantropists, idealists and friends of mankind should have no illusions about that.

Overall, your post seemed to indicate that he was intersted in the military because of personal failures. That is simply not true. From what I gather, our friend is simply looking for some direction and has considered the military, I will offer him all the advice I can on that option.

And I offered him a perspective that goes beyond the military, and referred him back to himself. I did not even indicate that I consider him to have failed in something, having a handicap, or being a loser, in no way I did - but if he is as young as he indicated (talking of schoolnotes somewhere), and while having indicated that the thing with his girl was something very serious, and that he does not feel comfortable to be left alone to himself and wants "action filling the silence" (I'll cut it short, yes) : then I would conclude that he really needs time and opportunity to become clear about some basic questions about himself, and that stories about battles and combat cruelties are not what he needs to get himself on track. nor is there any need to leave him in the belief that the military is the only option he has to find the answers to his confusion - a confusion that many people face during the late teenage years and early 20s.

And now i would encourage to leave Chad alone with the feedback he got. If you still think you have anything to sort out with me, do it per PM, please. I think that is only fair towards Chad. He can - and should! - make his own decisions, and if he wants to ask me or you anything, he certainly knows how to do that. As far as I am concerned, we could leave it to that.

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Yep, if you want my .02 cents worth. Maybe even a phone call to each other. Just post the numbers on email or PM. Wide open on the forums, everyone will call you....collect

What's your number again?

-S

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Airmail

Oh and If you love the sea did you know you can get posts onboard merchant ships, cruise ships or even yeah thats right Tall Ships/Luxury Yaughts without any qualifications and you can even get qualifications from doing them.

Would mean your not tied to a military contract

You don't always need direction in your life, be patient! I had no direction and went rambling round Europe, and North Africa. I set off with next to no money working along the way, going where ever the hell I felt like. I learnt more about myself and funnily enough came back after what was labelled a "cop out" by my parents with more direction than ever. The whole expierence changed me, the memories of the people and events that heppend along the way will always stay with me.

"Not all those who wander are lost" Tolkien

If you want to build a ship
don't herd people together to collect wood
and don't assign them tasks and work,
but rather teach them to long for the
endless immensity of the sea.

Antoine de Saint-Exupery

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by Skybird

It was meant to be a bit harsh, and I'll stick to every single word of it: for several reasons that owe their existence to what he said about himself, and the fact that joining the military never should be an easy decision. Direction you can find in many other jobs as well, and if serving is what he wants, there are firefighters, policemen, medics, ambulance drivers, SAR rescue flyers... Being soldier is different to any of these, so he better is sure about his motives and has no illusions about what he is getting into. Soldiers - warriors! - kill and get killed, in this all branches of the armed forces are the same, call it what you want, this is what it comes down to. And this is what you should be clear about and have no illusions or stupid self-deceptions about. Nobody should get persuaded or confirmed to join the military. He should come to that all by himself. Only once he is into it and finds it is what he was looking for, you support him in that role, as a friend. Confirming or persuading him in advance is almost criminal negligence.

In a perfect world, you would not need the military. A little clue though - this is not the perfect world, nor will ever be.

What this will give him is it will make a man out of him, from self worth to respect. Something maybe you should look at too.

-S

[baggygreen]

So Chad have you taken up the offer to chat to USLC??

Venatore madethe same offer to me when i was in the midst of enlistment. Never got round to speaking directly to him, but the PMs and a couple of the links he provided were instrumental in me finally signing on the dotted line. I still owe him for the help he gave me, hope i can pay it back one day.

As far as career choice etc, look at it this way. If deep down you want it, and if you dont feel like you'll regret it, go for it. I had to enlist as a reservist for now because im planning a wedding myself and that'd be a bit tough to do from Timor, but I know I'll not regret that. I chose Army over airforce and navy because I knew i couldnt do the time away from home.

As far as women go, my high school sweetheart cheated on me with 3 of my mates, and then a few other blokes. I caught her out, and that was that. It wasn't pleasant, but i eventually got around to realising that I wasnt the problem, it was her, and i was better off. took a while, but i got there. Stayed single for a while, then like Kapitan said, out of the blue, like a bus (or a train in sydney!) one turned up (a friend of mine for several years) and now we're engaged. In that time between, i didn't really look for anyone, no flings or anything like that, io spent the time doing what I wanted to do.

All the best mate

[Airmail]

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

In a perfect world, you would not need the military. A little clue though - this is not the perfect world, nor will ever be.

What this will give him is it will make a man out of him, from self worth to respect. Something maybe you should look at too.

-S

If he can get the balls and imagination he can make a man out of himself without needing the military. I think he should try other routes first unless he's totally sure he wants to join up. He could even try volountry helping clear up disasters. His problem seems to be a confidence one. He doesn't think he can make new friends without structure, thats how I interpreted his posts based on my own past expierences. (I had friends but like his they were busy, heading off in their own directions and leaving me in the dust) Learned helplessnes. He can get it back if he gets out there and forces himself into new situations.