Kursk, the game based on a 2000 Russian submarine disaster, will be out this year

[Cybermat47]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

Sorry but this game is of poor taste and shouldn't have been released atleast under the name what so ever.

This is just blatantly disrespectful to the people who died on Kursk and also for their families, some of whom are more that aware this game is out there and for them to have the thoughts that someone is having enjoyment out of their loss and suffering is to me just totally unacceptable

To be fair, you can say the same thing about the Silent Hunter games, where you actively kill merchant sailors.

[Kapitan]

Originally Posted by Cybermat47

To be fair, you can say the same thing about the Silent Hunter games, where you actively kill merchant sailors.

Not quite the same in one sense yes you could however the Silent hunter games were set in a war time scenario and as harsh as this sounds the people who lived it have passed on and enough time has passed for it to be acceptable

Kursk was a peace time accident more over recent and living memory where the families of their loved ones are still very alive and well and the feelings are very raw and upsetting.

The Silent hunter games also have a big element of fiction while boat numbers may be correct and types of ships correct the reality is the Silent hunter series is not based upon any one submarine story like this one is.

[Vivid1963]

Personally as one with naval connections I find the "Game" In bad taste, given that the Tragedy was so recent and the loss or ARA San Juan even more so. I wonder if such a game would be made based on the USS Thresher or USS Scorpion - I think not.
Wartime losses are one thing, all submariners know that Wartime service gives a very low chance of survival.
Games set in either world war are historical, with many fictional elements and done in due respect to those who served, In Silent Hunter III, the U Boat commander Eric Topp was a Technical Adviser - would he have done that if he considered it an Insult to his lost comrades, I doubt it.
I leave you with a final thought on Kursk - what do you think the Widows, families and friends think of such a "game", as well as the Russian people - I know what I would think.
Subsim, please do not consider giving "games" like this serious reviews, they are in very poor taste, and not worthy of serious comment.

[Kapitan]

Originally Posted by Vivid1963

Personally as one with naval connections I find the "Game" In bad taste, given that the Tragedy was so recent and the loss or ARA San Juan even more so. I wonder if such a game would be made based on the USS Thresher or USS Scorpion - I think not.
Wartime losses are one thing, all submariners know that Wartime service gives a very low chance of survival.
Games set in either world war are historical, with many fictional elements and done in due respect to those who served, In Silent Hunter III, the U Boat commander Eric Topp was a Technical Adviser - would he have done that if he considered it an Insult to his lost comrades, I doubt it.
I leave you with a final thought on Kursk - what do you think the Widows, families and friends think of such a "game", as well as the Russian people - I know what I would think.
Subsim, please do not consider giving "games" like this serious reviews, they are in very poor taste, and not worthy of serious comment.

DSCN2727 by B S, on Flickr

These are the graves of some of the Kursk's crew (others were buried in home town or not found), Having stood there seeing the faces of the men on the grave stones i can tell you it is one sobering sight, i have been to Laboe and the war time submarine losses in U boats, i have been to Chernobyl and seen the devastation and i will say nothing came close to the utter disrespect shown to the crew of this submarine than some tin pot production company making a few quid from a tragic accident.

I have spoken with Igor Kurdin and also Andrey Nikoaev who are part of the Submarine veterans club in St petersburg they are both understandably upset and dismayed at this game, because when it happened these two were the front line for the families they supported them they took care of them and now not even 20 years on this stupid production company wants to make something from their misery.

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by Vivid1963

Personally as one with naval connections I find the "Game" In bad taste, given that the Tragedy was so recent and the loss or ARA San Juan even more so. I wonder if such a game would be made based on the USS Thresher or USS Scorpion - I think not.
Wartime losses are one thing, all submariners know that Wartime service gives a very low chance of survival.
Games set in either world war are historical, with many fictional elements and done in due respect to those who served, In Silent Hunter III, the U Boat commander Eric Topp was a Technical Adviser - would he have done that if he considered it an Insult to his lost comrades, I doubt it.
I leave you with a final thought on Kursk - what do you think the Widows, families and friends think of such a "game", as well as the Russian people - I know what I would think.
Subsim, please do not consider giving "games" like this serious reviews, they are in very poor taste, and not worthy of serious comment.

I agree. I am failing to see the entertainment value of a game based on an accident like this.

[hauangua]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

DSCN2727 by B S, on Flickr

These are the graves of some of the Kursk's crew (others were buried in home town or not found), Having stood there seeing the faces of the men on the grave stones i can tell you it is one sobering sight, i have been to Laboe and the war time submarine losses in U boats, i have been to Chernobyl and seen the devastation and i will say nothing came close to the utter disrespect shown to the crew of this submarine than some tin pot production company making a few quid from a tragic accident.

I have spoken with Igor Kurdin and also Andrey Nikoaev who are part of the Submarine veterans club in St petersburg they are both understandably upset and dismayed at this game, because when it happened these two were the front line for the families they supported them they took care of them and now not even 20 years on this stupid production company wants to make something from their misery.

Originally Posted by Platapus

I agree. I am failing to see the entertainment value of a game based on an accident like this.

I totally agree with you

Originally Posted by Kapitan

DSCN2727 by B S, on Flickr

These are the graves of some of the Kursk's crew (others were buried in home town or not found), Having stood there seeing the faces of the men on the grave stones i can tell you it is one sobering sight, i have been to Laboe and the war time submarine losses in U boats, i have been to Chernobyl and seen the devastation and i will say nothing came close to the utter disrespect shown to the crew of this submarine than some tin pot production company making a few quid from a tragic accident.

I have spoken with Igor Kurdin and also Andrey Nikoaev who are part of the Submarine veterans club in St petersburg they are both understandably upset and dismayed at this game, because when it happened these two were the front line for the families they supported them they took care of them and now not even 20 years on this stupid production company wants to make something from their misery.

One man's "misery" is another man's entertainment.

Luckily we have the freedom to make games we wish to, and sell them to people who want to buy them. Whether that makes everyone 100% happy or not. Thank God. Can't imagine living in a world where having things is determined by: Is someone's panties in a twist? Yes? You can't have it.

What an awful world to live in.

[Kapitan]

Indeed it is, however if you look at games like silent hunter no names are mentioned only fictional ones the engagements are fictional.

What they certainly should have done is just called it something other than Kursk could have called it Sub Down or something of that nature, but for me the fact remains it is based on a real life event and uses the Kursk name to bolster the game which isnt exactly tasteful.

Just MHO

Originally Posted by Kapitan

Indeed it is, however if you look at games like silent hunter no names are mentioned only fictional ones the engagements are fictional.

What they certainly should have done is just called it something other than Kursk could have called it Sub Down or something of that nature, but for me the fact remains it is based on a real life event and uses the Kursk name to bolster the game which isnt exactly tasteful.

Just MHO

And as someone pointed out to you, you have no issues with the Silent Hunter franchise doing the same. I haven't seen you say including The Hood in World of Warships is distasteful, and only three men lived from that.

No, they certainly should not have. If it is distasteful for you, don't buy it, or read about it. That simple. No need to act like the game shouldn't exist just because it "offends" you. Facts, video games, and video gamers, don't care about your feelings! And thankfully your power to control what gamers see or get, died in the 90s.

[Kapitan]

Originally Posted by Slyguy3129

And as someone pointed out to you, you have no issues with the Silent Hunter franchise doing the same. I haven't seen you say including The Hood in World of Warships is distasteful, and only three men lived from that.

No, they certainly should not have. If it is distasteful for you, don't buy it, or read about it. That simple. No need to act like the game shouldn't exist just because it "offends" you. Facts, video games, and video gamers, don't care about your feelings! And thankfully your power to control what gamers see or get, died in the 90s.

And as i pointed out Silent Hunter takes a fictional boat fictional crew and operates against a fictional enemy, the names of ships dont appear your attacking a C2 cargo or a T2 tanker not a specific ship.
It is also set in war time not based on an accident like this game is.

I have never played world of warships so not aware of that.

As for does it offend me ? NO it doesnt offend me i just find it distasteful as does a lot of other people especially the families of the victims.
While i can only express opinion (and that is what it is) a much more powerful source can certainly have the game entirely shelved, if Igor Kurdin and the families decided against a court case to have damages paid out then that would sink the game entirely.
(He has already assisted in doing this with Hostile waters film and that was against a European consortium)

Like i said if they had changed the name then things would be a lot different it would be no complaints.

Change only comes from protest, and yep i didn't buy it and yes i am against the name of the game not the game itself.

Originally Posted by Kapitan

And as i pointed out Silent Hunter takes a fictional boat fictional crew and operates against a fictional enemy, the names of ships dont appear your attacking a C2 cargo or a T2 tanker not a specific ship.
It is also set in war time not based on an accident like this game is.

I have never played world of warships so not aware of that.

As for does it offend me ? NO it doesnt offend me i just find it distasteful as does a lot of other people especially the families of the victims.
While i can only express opinion (and that is what it is) a much more powerful source can certainly have the game entirely shelved, if Igor Kurdin and the families decided against a court case to have damages paid out then that would sink the game entirely.
(He has already assisted in doing this with Hostile waters film and that was against a European consortium)

Like i said if they had changed the name then things would be a lot different it would be no complaints.

Change only comes from protest, and yep i didn't buy it and yes i am against the name of the game not the game itself.

U-Boats weren't fictional, WW2 wasn't fictional.

I care absolutely nothing about victims who use lawyers to bully people around they disagree with. Those are the absolute worst kind of "victims". Good thing I don't live in a country subject to the EU, and it's oppressive ways.

You mean the Igor Kurdin who helped write Hostile Waters?

https://www.google.com/search?q=Host...ih=800&dpr=1.5

So it's ok for him to profit off the deaths of victims. It's cool, the world is filled with "Lawyers" like that. They don't scare anyone but cowards.

And protesting gets nothing done. All protesting does is inconvenience hard working people who just want to be left alone. The only thing it really does, is make people really hate your cause.

Also, bought a copy of the game in your name. So you did buy it. Checkmate!

[Kapitan]

Originally Posted by Slyguy3129

U-Boats weren't fictional, WW2 wasn't fictional.

I care absolutely nothing about victims who use lawyers to bully people around they disagree with. Those are the absolute worst kind of "victims". Good thing I don't live in a country subject to the EU, and it's oppressive ways.

You mean the Igor Kurdin who helped write Hostile Waters?

https://www.google.com/search?q=Host...ih=800&dpr=1.5

So it's ok for him to profit off the deaths of victims. It's cool, the world is filled with "Lawyers" like that. They don't scare anyone but cowards.

Igor Kurdin assisted in writing the book, mainly as technical advisor because he had commanded a similar type of submarine, he did not however get involved with the film, and if you read hostile waters the book it mentions nothing about a collision the film portrays this, and yes when i met him i did ask him about this and his statement was simply there was no collision so therefore it was the film that caused the problem.

Your also clouding what im also saying and im not saying WW2 was fictional, nor U boats far from it !
The silent hunter series is based around a true events but uses fictional encounters, fictional ships, and fictional series of events, which in turn means it is not directly related to the true event which took place, thus your not U123 sinking the Coimbra en route to America exactly as it would have been are you? the game generates fictional traffic patterns so the odds are you may be U1 and encounter a lone un named T3 tanker off the coast of Ireland when in reality that never happened at that time date or location.

Thats what i am getting at the detachment the way Ubisoft did silent hunter series was a good way around things, detach slightly from the real thing but still have realism in it make it un named that way your playing the game for what it is platform v platform.

Kursk is nothing like that your playing it based on a real event based on its real name based on the loss of its entire crew, the plot to steal the VA111 skhval theory is just weird the torpedo has been around since the 70's and well frankly its old hat.

I care absolutely nothing about victims who use lawyers to bully people around they disagree with

So lets say they released a game around the incidents of Bhopal or the tragedy of the Holocaust you wouldn't give a monkeys if the victims decided to take the publisher to court because after all as you say these victims are just trying to bully right? but surely they have a right to say it

I may disagree with what you say, but I will fight, even to death, for your right to say it. By: Someone more articulate than I, but in my words.

[Kapitan]

As for buying it in my name crack on because people know i wont buy it, and i can prove beyond doubt i didnt buy it either so all you managed to do was waste your own money and time.

Originally Posted by Kapitan

Igor Kurdin assisted in writing the book, mainly as technical advisor because he had commanded a similar type of submarine, he did not however get involved with the film, and if you read hostile waters the book it mentions nothing about a collision the film portrays this, and yes when i met him i did ask him about this and his statement was simply there was no collision so therefore it was the film that caused the problem.

Your also clouding what im also saying and im not saying WW2 was fictional, nor U boats far from it !
The silent hunter series is based around a true events but uses fictional encounters, fictional ships, and fictional series of events, which in turn means it is not directly related to the true event which took place, thus your not U123 sinking the Coimbra en route to America exactly as it would have been are you? the game generates fictional traffic patterns so the odds are you may be U1 and encounter a lone un named T3 tanker off the coast of Ireland when in reality that never happened at that time date or location.

Thats what i am getting at the detachment the way Ubisoft did silent hunter series was a good way around things, detach slightly from the real thing but still have realism in it make it un named that way your playing the game for what it is platform v platform.

Kursk is nothing like that your playing it based on a real event based on its real name based on the loss of its entire crew, the plot to steal the VA111 skhval theory is just weird the torpedo has been around since the 70's and well frankly its old hat.




So lets say they released a game around the incidents of Bhopal or the tragedy of the Holocaust you wouldn't give a monkeys if the victims decided to take the publisher to court because after all as you say these victims are just trying to bully right? but surely they have a right to say it

https://www.google.com/search?ei=cYm...46.mLeR3easpkU

Not this movie right? This isn't the movie he stopped is it? I hope not. He didn't stop it very well. I remember it.

So again, he makes money, but someone else can't. Classy dude this lawyer.

That didn't occur to "who" exactly? Igor? I wish people would decide if we are supposed to 100% trust Russians, or 100% not trust them. Cause it always seems to change for certain people. One minute they are awesome one minute they "stole the election".

What's Bohpal? Is that a made up word? Like one random Syrian town the whole world is supposed to care about? Apellego or something? Like "Schindler's List"?

Oh of course, victims have a right to bitch, that's all they do is bitch. It's when they try to make some pay a financial toll for their loss, when I put my foot down. That comes across as "I want the whole world to feel my loss." When what they need to hear is, no one cares about you, or your loss, till you start trying to oppress people vicariously through that loss.

No, no. It made up for the loss in you not giving them money. Making your refusal to purchase out of protesting impotent. Just like all protest.

[Kapitan]

Originally Posted by Slyguy3129

https://www.google.com/search?ei=cYm...46.mLeR3easpkU

Not this movie right? This isn't the movie he stopped is it? I hope not. He didn't stop it very well. I remember it.

So again, he makes money, but someone else can't. Classy dude this lawyer.

That didn't occur to "who" exactly? Igor? I wish people would decide if we are supposed to 100% trust Russians, or 100% not trust them. Cause it always seems to change for certain people. One minute they are awesome one minute they "stole the election".

What's Bohpal? Is that a made up word? Like one random Syrian town the whole world is supposed to care about? Apellego or something? Like "Schindler's List"?

Oh of course, victims have a right to bitch, that's all they do is bitch. It's when they try to make some pay a financial toll for their loss, when I put my foot down. That comes across as "I want the whole world to feel my loss." When what they need to here is, no one cares about you, or your loss, till you start trying to oppress people vicariously through that loss.

No, no. It made up for the loss in you not giving them money. Making your refusal to purchase out of protesting impotent. Just like all protest.

Igor Kurdin Is Chairman of the Submarine veterans club St Petersburg, the movie Hostile waters its publishers were taken to court and awarded damages, this was after the release but notice being a British made publication it has never been aired on British TV Since, you can now only find it on You Tube or Amazon, the claim made a huge dent in the profits of that company, it portrayed Captain Britanov incompetent which under legal terms in the west amounts to slandering character.
Igor Kurdin made no money from the legal case the damages went to Britanov, so your argument there is false and unfounded.

A lot of people i speak with generally Americans and British who have an opinion on the Russian people their way of life what they do and how they do it tend to not actually have one clue about the reality of it, these people hold their own governments narrative close to heart and believe what their own media says about a certain group or country.

Recently there have been reports in the British media about Russian aircraft buzzing Estonian airspace, but why are they doing it? is it because the British Royal Air Force is Buzzing Russian airspace ? having worked with the British MOD and US DOD and NATO i can sum it up with this "six of one half dozen of the other" both as bad as each other and each media outlet plays against each other, so trust the Russians? like anything in life trust what you see not what you hear or read about find out for yourself go out and explore.

I have been to Russia i have spoken with Russian people i have spent time with high ranking officials in Russia, not just Igor Kurdin but i have also been down on the street and mixed with local people and strangely their aims are no different to what you or I want peace stability prosperity

People are not nations


If you had been wronged wouldn't you want someone to help you ?

The fact is things like this have been going on for a very long time and oddly it stems from the USA's suing culture the Russians just adopted it.

I think you mean Alleppo in Syria, which has seen the violence, and if you want clumsy that's one area the USA has stumbled into, but that's something else.

As for Bhopal its not made up if you google it you will find it was the worst industrial accident of all time Union Carbide (American company) had a major leak at its pesticide plant just to give you a link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhopal_disaster


Schindlers List was a man trying to save as many people as possible from the genocidal regime that one should be applauded not condemned.

Oh of course, victims have a right to bitch, that's all they do is bitch. It's when they try to make some pay a financial toll for their loss, when I put my foot down. That comes across as "I want the whole world to feel my loss." When what they need to here is, no one cares about you, or your loss, till you start trying to oppress people vicariously through that loss.

And you yourself have never been a victim of anything your entire life right ? never had a car accident, never fallen over, never had someone bully you, never had someone cause you harm, never had anything stolen from you? never lost anyone in your life? none of that right?

So i also guess the victims of the Holocaust were just bitching about their treatment right? and they should just shut up and get on with it and not be compensated for their lost time and positions health etc?

I have seen what a genocidal regime can do, i spent time in Bosnia mainly around Srebrenica, Banja Luka, Tusla and Mostar where they were digging up the massed graves of over 8,000 Bosniaks who were slaughtered for simply being from one side of the fence, but like you say the victims families are just bitching about it and they want the world to know because they are attention seeking right?
Good job they did make it public because Slobodan Melosivic wouldn't have been jailed nor Rado Meladik in 2017 (these massacres happened in 1995) so if the world did shut up about all this we would live in an oppressed society.

It made up for the loss in you not giving them money. Making your refusal to purchase out of protesting impotent. Just like all protest.

So in actual fact your purchase is in direct protest against my refusal to purchase making your purchase a protest.

Bullets change governments faster than votes,

If it wasn't for MLK Black people in America would still be oppressed

If it wasn't for the united peoples of many countries around the British Empire at the end of WW2 the empire would still be here (in theory)

If it wasn't for the Suffragette movement and protests Women in the UK would still not have the vote

If it wasn't for human rights protests against Saudi Arabia Government women Would still not be allowed to drive.

But as you say Protest's don't work do they.