Close Combat: Gateway to Caen

08-04-15, 05:07 PM

Finally bought it after had it sitting a long time on my wishlist, forgetting to buy it during sales and what not.
I just couldn't be bothered anymore with not owning it so I just hit the "take my money!!!" button.

Anyone else here playing it?

Oberon · 08-04-15, 08:25 PM

There's a video here of two very strange people playing it:

08-04-15, 09:46 PM

Nice!

Dowly · 08-05-15, 03:02 AM

Yup, play it occasionally.

08-05-15, 04:58 PM

For those who don't know yet, there is a blood mod (MP compatible it seems) for Gateway to Caen.
It isn't over-done and makes it easier to distinguish between dead and alive soldiers.
Also, blood for blood God!

Link

Dowly · 08-05-15, 05:20 PM

Also, my less accurate mortars: Link

That was made during 1.0, though.

(Really, the stock mortars are waaaaay to accurate after their first shot)

08-05-15, 05:22 PM

Self advertisement?
Shamefurr dispray!

That mod is only for SP though, I figure?
In any case, the mortars are disturbingly accurate. I learned to love and fear them instantly.

Dowly · 08-05-15, 05:28 PM

SP as far as I know. (unless both host and client uses it, I think.)

Another thing I like to mod is the later era german guns to have +25% accuracy, to simulate the zeiss scopes.

As stock, every gun has the same base accuracy, which I find a bit silly.

08-05-15, 05:33 PM

Either for balancing reasons or because the game isn't as deeply researched as I thought it is. Can't really comment on that yet.

I tried snipers last night in SP campaign mode, they struck me as completely useless, except for reconnaissance which might even justify the slot but... 60 rounds for 1 kill? Doesn't sound too much like sniping...

I see how they must not be overpowered, it could break things fast but making them useless doesn't strike me as a good idea.

What are your experiences with snipers?

08-06-15, 06:12 PM

I created a steam group after looking for one yet not finding anything.
This should make it way easier to find potential players.
It is an open group with an unlimited supply of German beer and topless girls - so feel free to join everyone.

HunterICX · 08-08-15, 04:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oberon

There's a video here of two very strange people playing it:

Strange?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nippelspanner

Either for balancing reasons or because the game isn't as deeply researched as I thought it is. Can't really comment on that yet.

Well, I do wager it would made more sense if they're only as accurate as they are in the stock games if the firing zone is in the LOS of a Platoon HQ unit which has a radio to relay corrections.

Quote:

I tried snipers last night in SP campaign mode, they struck me as completely useless, except for reconnaissance which might even justify the slot but... 60 rounds for 1 kill? Doesn't sound too much like sniping...

I see how they must not be overpowered, it could break things fast but making them useless doesn't strike me as a good idea.

What are your experiences with snipers?

I've barely used them, I do however had situations that I suddently lost a whole platoon who I though to be safe by a sniper that I couldn't detect.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nippelspanner

I created a steam group after looking for one yet not finding anything.
This should make it way easier to find potential players.
It is an open group with an unlimited supply of German beer and topless girls - so feel free to join everyone.

Subscribed, recently reinstalled both Panthers in the Fog and Gateway to Caen.

08-08-15, 05:10 AM

Nice, we should play sometime!

CybrSlydr · 10-19-15, 08:56 PM

Close Combat 3 was one of my all-time favorite strategy games. LOVED playing it - though I learned quickly to play as the Germans, load up on MG42 units and press play to win.

US infantry units with the M1/Carbines are woefully inaccurate and can't hit anything. Same with the .30cal MG, etc. The only useful thing the US had were tanks - and those were pretty easy to destroy!

That said, I adored that game. I love the lack of base building and just straight focus on tactics and maneuvering. I keep hoping for a modern update with graphics and the like, but I'm continually disappointed.

Dowly · 03-31-16, 12:57 PM

Bump!

I did some research today, trying to figure out how to make the allied AI a bit more aggressive and I think I found something interesting.
(All of which has been in CC for years, I just didn't get the memo)

In the BGroup.txt, there are values for 4 commander attributes: Aggression, Caution, Charisma and Tactical Skill. (Last four numerical values on each line Clicky!)

Aggression is self-explanatory. Like all the attributes, it ranges from -5 to 5, former meaning extremely defensive tactics and latter being all-out attack.
All of the Allied BGs have this set to 5, so that's not the problem.

Next up is Caution, which governs the commander's use of reserves. Setting it to 5, means the commander will keep lots of reserves, while -5 means basically no reserves.
All BGs have this set to 0.

Coming up is Charisma. Something something morale.
All BGs have this set to 0 as well.

Last one is Tactical Skill, meaning how many plans the AI has to choose from. 5 = ALL THE PLANS!, -5 = Plans?
This appears to be set to 5 for all Allied BGs.

So, I did some testing with Allies being the attacker and it would seem like the tactical skill is what's slowing the AI down. Lowering caution also helps the attack as more teams are used in a single thrust, instead of waves.

Here's a sped-up video using the stock values for Allied commander. *Axis units are set to 'defend' from start*

Things to note:
- Single Bren section used for recon. This is rather usual for the AI and it's basically a wasted team as it most of the time gets slaughtered.
- Attack stalls immediately as the Allied infantry takes cover in the buildings.
- Churchill Mk.VI, instead of supporting the infantry, takes cover in the courtyard.
- Armor starts to push on once infantry has already taken big losses. I assume the reason for this is that they were in a 'support group'. The AI groups its units for recon/support/reserve/command/attack (or something to that effect.)
- No Axis teams eliminated.

Results:
ALLIES: 9 KIA, 27 WIA, Morale 63%, no flags captured.

AXIS: 2 KIA, 6 WIA, Morale 100%

Here's a video showing the AI after I changed both caution and tactical skill to -5. *Axis units are set to 'defend' from start*

Things to note:
- No wasted recon teams.
- Attack doesn't stall immediately.
- Infantry is not bunched up inside a building, but spread out.
- Tanks, especially the Churchill Mk.VI stays close to the infantry, supporting the attack. The Crocodile, I assume was part of a 'support group' as it appeared to move whenever the Platoon HQ and the PIAT were moving.
- Three Axis teams eliminated.

Results:
ALLIES: 9 KIA, 21 WIA, Morale 63%, one flag captured.

AXIS: 7 KIA, 12 WIA, Morale 48%

Results will naturally vary as there is more to the AI that is unfortunately hardcoded. Definitely needs more testing (tank battles, defensive battles, axis side etc.)

03-31-16, 01:20 PM

Very nice, I also concur with the observations that vanilla AI mostly hides its tanks and never uses his PIAT etc.

I will try these settings, as the AI starts to bore me. In Op epsom, they can't even push in at all and bite their teeth on my defences while often they could have overrun my positions. Here's hope they will act a bit more daring now - just like the Tommies did back then!

08-04-15, 05:07 PM	#1
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Close Combat: Gateway to Caen Finally bought it after had it sitting a long time on my wishlist, forgetting to buy it during sales and what not. I just couldn't be bothered anymore with not owning it so I just hit the "take my money!!!" button. Anyone else here playing it?

10-19-15, 08:56 PM	#13
CybrSlydr Lieutenant Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Beverly, OH Posts: 263 Downloads: 13 Uploads: 0	Close Combat 3 was one of my all-time favorite strategy games. LOVED playing it - though I learned quickly to play as the Germans, load up on MG42 units and press play to win. US infantry units with the M1/Carbines are woefully inaccurate and can't hit anything. Same with the .30cal MG, etc. The only useful thing the US had were tanks - and those were pretty easy to destroy! That said, I adored that game. I love the lack of base building and just straight focus on tactics and maneuvering. I keep hoping for a modern update with graphics and the like, but I'm continually disappointed. __________________

08-04-15, 08:25 PM	#2
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	There's a video here of two very strange people playing it:

08-04-15, 09:46 PM	#3
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Nice!

08-05-15, 03:02 AM	#4
Dowly Lucky Jack Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 25,053 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	Yup, play it occasionally.

08-05-15, 04:58 PM	#5
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	For those who don't know yet, there is a blood mod (MP compatible it seems) for Gateway to Caen. It isn't over-done and makes it easier to distinguish between dead and alive soldiers. Also, blood for blood God! Link

08-05-15, 05:20 PM	#6
Dowly Lucky Jack Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 25,053 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	Also, my less accurate mortars: Link That was made during 1.0, though. (Really, the stock mortars are waaaaay to accurate after their first shot)

08-05-15, 05:22 PM	#7
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Self advertisement? Shamefurr dispray! That mod is only for SP though, I figure? In any case, the mortars are disturbingly accurate. I learned to love and fear them instantly.

08-05-15, 05:28 PM	#8
Dowly Lucky Jack Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 25,053 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	SP as far as I know. (unless both host and client uses it, I think.) Another thing I like to mod is the later era german guns to have +25% accuracy, to simulate the zeiss scopes. As stock, every gun has the same base accuracy, which I find a bit silly.

08-05-15, 05:33 PM	#9
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Either for balancing reasons or because the game isn't as deeply researched as I thought it is. Can't really comment on that yet. I tried snipers last night in SP campaign mode, they struck me as completely useless, except for reconnaissance which might even justify the slot but... 60 rounds for 1 kill? Doesn't sound too much like sniping... I see how they must not be overpowered, it could break things fast but making them useless doesn't strike me as a good idea. What are your experiences with snipers?

08-06-15, 06:12 PM	#10
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	I created a steam group after looking for one yet not finding anything. This should make it way easier to find potential players. It is an open group with an unlimited supply of German beer and topless girls - so feel free to join everyone.

08-08-15, 05:10 AM	#12
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Nice, we should play sometime!

03-31-16, 12:57 PM	#14
Dowly Lucky Jack Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 25,053 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	Bump! I did some research today, trying to figure out how to make the allied AI a bit more aggressive and I think I found something interesting. (All of which has been in CC for years, I just didn't get the memo) In the BGroup.txt, there are values for 4 commander attributes: Aggression, Caution, Charisma and Tactical Skill. (Last four numerical values on each line Clicky!) Aggression is self-explanatory. Like all the attributes, it ranges from -5 to 5, former meaning extremely defensive tactics and latter being all-out attack. All of the Allied BGs have this set to 5, so that's not the problem. Next up is Caution, which governs the commander's use of reserves. Setting it to 5, means the commander will keep lots of reserves, while -5 means basically no reserves. All BGs have this set to 0. Coming up is Charisma. Something something morale. All BGs have this set to 0 as well. Last one is Tactical Skill, meaning how many plans the AI has to choose from. 5 = ALL THE PLANS!, -5 = Plans? This appears to be set to 5 for all Allied BGs. So, I did some testing with Allies being the attacker and it would seem like the tactical skill is what's slowing the AI down. Lowering caution also helps the attack as more teams are used in a single thrust, instead of waves. Here's a sped-up video using the stock values for Allied commander. Axis units are set to 'defend' from start Things to note: - Single Bren section used for recon. This is rather usual for the AI and it's basically a wasted team as it most of the time gets slaughtered. - Attack stalls immediately as the Allied infantry takes cover in the buildings. - Churchill Mk.VI, instead of supporting the infantry, takes cover in the courtyard. - Armor starts to push on once infantry has already taken big losses. I assume the reason for this is that they were in a 'support group'. The AI groups its units for recon/support/reserve/command/attack (or something to that effect.) - No Axis teams eliminated. Results: ALLIES: 9 KIA, 27 WIA, Morale 63%, no flags captured. AXIS: 2 KIA, 6 WIA, Morale 100% Here's a video showing the AI after I changed both caution and tactical skill to -5. Axis units are set to 'defend' from start Things to note: - No wasted recon teams. - Attack doesn't stall immediately. - Infantry is not bunched up inside a building, but spread out. - Tanks, especially the Churchill Mk.VI stays close to the infantry, supporting the attack. The Crocodile, I assume was part of a 'support group' as it appeared to move whenever the Platoon HQ and the PIAT were moving. - Three Axis teams eliminated. Results: ALLIES: 9 KIA, 21 WIA, Morale 63%, one flag captured. AXIS: 7 KIA, 12 WIA, Morale 48% Results will naturally vary as there is more to the AI that is unfortunately hardcoded. Definitely needs more testing (tank battles, defensive battles, axis side etc.)

03-31-16, 01:20 PM	#15
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Very nice, I also concur with the observations that vanilla AI mostly hides its tanks and never uses his PIAT etc. I will try these settings, as the AI starts to bore me. In Op epsom, they can't even push in at all and bite their teeth on my defences while often they could have overrun my positions. Here's hope they will act a bit more daring now - just like the Tommies did back then!