Senate report on CIA torture techniques released

[August]

Originally Posted by Oberon

Elegantly stated though roundly ignored I see.

As an aside I would hate living in that thing. Especially at night!

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by MH

The reason is that this torture issue is very much political issue in USA and not only... and some people need promotions while others don't want to get fired or put on trial.
I believe it is similar case with this report , while it may be correct in the context it was written it is not entirely accurate and objective on the issue.
It very much serves ideology of current administration.
Not that I personally justify mass torture , the USA as it seems lost the proportions a bit.

I read the report and I do understand this is simply political hay at others expense, namely at the expense of an entire agency and country. It's the hypocrisy that on one hand they publically blame an entire agency for the misdeeds of a few. Then turn right around launch a drone against 'suspected' terrorist targets killing them and their wives and children as well. And have the audacity to tell me it was their solemn duty to so.

The report didn't have jack-squat to do with the good of the nation, it wasn't for justice, or for better regulations. It is just simply good ol' fashioned divisiveness.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by August

Elegantly stated though roundly ignored I see.

As an aside I would hate living in that thing. Especially at night!

One would hope that the glass is tintable...

[ikalugin]

Sky, you assume that humans are rational and ego centric.

I don't talk about Russia because there is nothing to talk about, it is not a part of our ideology to prosecute other states for human rights violations.

[Buddahaid]

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

....Two more years of surprises from a President that can veto any bill they put on his desk....

Oh please. Like the next president won't when it suits his fancy. Get real.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by ikalugin

Sky, you assume that humans are rational and ego centric.

I assume that humans are motivated and driven by egoist motives, yes. The whole model of the free market bases on that assumption as well, btw. It makes egoists interacting and cooperating for fulfilling their egoist motives. It'S kind of a super-complex coordination mechanism.

But being rational humans need to learn, it is an exercise in self-discipline, else human egoism meets emotions and sentiments, genetically rooted drives, also some ratio: but as well a good load of irrationality, short-termed instinct and last but not least: reflexes.

That man is born to be a rational being only is true in so far as one would claim that egoism always matches the understanding of being a rational motive. But even when being egoist, the chosen methods to fulfill that egoism can be irrational. Rational only is to want to be egoist. In the end, the ultimate egoism is the drive to survive and even kill othe rlife ion order to secure one's own survival, may it be a fight man against man to fight off a robber or murderer, or man slaughtering an animal to eat it.

And as a former psychologist you will not convince me from man being all-rational by birth anyway. Rationality is just part of the whole package. And a relatively small one.

I don't talk about Russia because there is nothing to talk about, it is not a part of our ideology to prosecute other states for human rights violations.

So does China and a couple of other dictatorships as well. Many states practicing something suppressive do not attack other states over being suppressive themselves, not wanting to draw attention to their own misdoing that way. Western states however love to lecture others about how superior Western corrupted (!) politics are, the corrupted state of things usually gets completely ignored and faded out. Especially the US, regarding the spreading of the American model, and Germany, regarding the general moral good-doing.

[Rockstar]

Politics, n. An unclean and sordid business. Etymology: from Ancient Greek poly-, “many,” plus ticks, n. pl., “small bloodsucking arthropods.”)

[Dread Knot]

For those who are interested in a delightful Christmas gift, the Senate CIA report will be available from publisher Melville House in bound book form this holiday season.



Should look smart up on the shelf somewhere between The Pentagon Papers and the Tower Commission Report.

[Wolferz]

Leave it to the comedians to state the truth of it.

Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere and applying all the wrong remedies
"Groucho Marx"

Colbert and Stewart have been having a blast going after this latest governmental faux pas. Those guys get a constant feed of material from people I consider total idiots. Good for a laugh though.

[Oberon]

For comedians, politics is the gift that keeps on giving.

[ikalugin]

@Skybird

And this is where our points of view differ, as I assume that:
- not all humans are rational.
- not all humans are egoistical.
- a perfectly rational human would not only act on his best interests, but on the over all community's best interests (well Economics and Game Theory advanced beyond the Adam Smith).

Back to the topic - as not all humans are rational, then torture (and such interrogation techniques) may be highly ineffective - ie what if the suspect happens to be a fanatic and doesn't value his own survival?

[Jimbuna]

If I wanted to go crazy I would do it in Washington because it would not be noticed - Irwin S. Cobb

[Mr Quatro]

Originally Posted by Buddahaid

Oh please. Like the next president won't when it suits his fancy. Get real.

Just that it will be easier to get along with a Republican President that has a Republican Senate majority and House of Representatives.

You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.

Abraham Lincoln

[August]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Western states however love to lecture others about how superior Western corrupted (!) politics are, the corrupted state of things usually gets completely ignored and faded out.

You really don't see a difference between the hand wringing Western states do over comparatively minor transgressions and the anonymous bullet to the back of the head that enemies of the Eastern states usually recieve?

[MH]

Originally Posted by August

You really don't see a difference between the hand wringing Western states do over comparatively minor transgressions and the anonymous bullet to the back of the head that enemies of the Eastern states usually recieve?

He is just softrolling